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Bragging
Old 04-23-2010, 01:06 PM   #141
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Bragging

All right, I was the one that brought "bragging" into the thread. It was unnecessary and didn't add anything. I apologize - especially to the poster it was directed against. Would edit it out but I can't ... no edit function.
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Old 04-23-2010, 01:13 PM   #142
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For vacationing, we just got an RV. We may skip international travel for the next couple of years.
Please let us (at least me ) the results of your RV travels.

We were looking at the posts related to RV travel on this site and did some preliminary investigation. This was based upon our U.S. based trip that we make every year (usually fly, rental or tour bus) which would allow us to take our two "furkids" along.

The initial investigation, based upon our method of usual travel did not "match up". Let me explain. My DW (love her dearly, but can be a PIA since she needs to see "everything") would not allow us to use an RV unless we had a separate tow vehicle (e.g. intercity travel).

Additionally, since we had condo rentals on several trips to Hawaii (no, not bragging - just trying to state the facts, please) when we went to the local market to get food for breakfast, she let me know that her version of vacation (e.g. any trip) did not include anything she normally did at home (including making breakfast; BTW, I've always made my own ).

However she has not said a definite "no"; we are still investigating.

Hey, how will we ever get to "The biggest ball of twine"

World's Largest Twine Ball, Darwin, Minnesota

unless we're on the road?....
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Old 04-23-2010, 01:28 PM   #143
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Heh heh heh, we are going to like to travel like a "turtle" with an RV. In fact, we just made a short 3-day trip, and loved it. Will make a post about this later.
LOL! We sometimes refer to our mode of travel as "like a turtle".

Audrey
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Old 04-23-2010, 05:02 PM   #144
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All right, I was the one that brought "bragging" into the thread. It was unnecessary and didn't add anything. I apologize - especially to the poster it was directed against. Would edit it out but I can't ... no edit function.
Hey no fair ! I thought I was the one that brought up the "B" word.
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Old 04-23-2010, 06:25 PM   #145
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Big deal, I say. If a man is communicating expect at least some of it to be bragging, or poorly camoflaged attempts to brag without seeming to be bragging.

I remember visiting my old parents in the assisted living home. I ate lunch with the old men. They were all bragging about how rich they were. Then I had coffee with my mother and her friends- they were all bragging about how rich their sons were.

Like the song says. ...and dance me to the end of time...

Ha
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Old 04-23-2010, 06:28 PM   #146
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We have an LBYM lifestyle in retirement. We rent our place in Vancouver because buying made no sense. We sublet it when we are down south. We own our place in PV and that makes our winters really cheap. We own a car in both places (a 93 and an 05).

It works out for us enabling us to travel each September to someplace special (like Provence or Tuscany) but it is indeed a subsistance approach. Even so, we expect to leave a bunch of money behind for charitable purposes but that will depend on the markets! We are hopeful but also cautious now more than ever!
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Old 04-24-2010, 06:15 PM   #147
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Getting back to the OP " Is a second home a good idea-given the obvious expense". I think we covered the waterfront (and then some) on this. Hard to talk about these types of issues without offending someone it would appear. Hopefully this board is "big" enough to embrace a little wealth diversity.
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Old 04-24-2010, 06:22 PM   #148
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Getting back to the OP " Is a second home a good idea-given the obvious expense". I think we covered the waterfront (and then some) on this. Hard to talk about these types of issues without offending someone it would appear. Hopefully this board is "big" enough to embrace a little wealth diversity.
I think the "offense" that was taken was mostly a misunderstanding in hindsight.

And getting back to the part you put in quotes, whether it's a "good idea" from a *strictly* financial standpoint is secondary to the basic idea that if something enhances your quality of life AND you can very clearly afford it, do it, even if it's financially suboptimal. It's important to make decisions justified by financial considerations, but if you can *easily* afford something and it's something you really like and enjoy, at that point financial optimization is secondary to enjoying life.
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Old 04-24-2010, 10:02 PM   #149
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Yes, I feel there is wealth diversity here, although I do not know if it is representative of the society at large. Still, this being an open public forum and not having an exclusivity of a country club (I am not a member of any, never will be nor care to be), one should expect that the distribution is to be somewhat Gaussian and concentrated towards the middle, as Meadbh pointed out. In fact, I strongly suspect that this forum is already tilted towards the upper middle class. Let's face it. It is simply difficult for an average worker with the median income to think of early retirement. It is possible, but a lot tougher than it is for someone who has a 6-figure annual income, or at least quite a bit more than the US household average of around $50K/year. Meadbh was right when she implied that a person of a lesser income who manages to ER would have a more interesting story to tell than an arrogant well-compensated lawyer. It would be to me.

And then, even someone with a 6-figure annual income still cannot be considered as "having money out the wazoo". He has a bit more means than the average worker, but still has to debate various ways to spend his money and to allocate it to maximize its utility. Hence, this "vacation home or no vacation home" debate would still be of interest to such persons, I presume.

Now, for a person of much greater means, such a debate becomes meaningless. The LBYM concept becomes absurd when we talk about Buffett or Gates. A lesser billionaire, Larry Ellison, who is a more flamboyant spender, would be hard pressed to spend a 4% SWR of his 22 billion fortune. I am not blaming a rich person for being rich, but he simply does not have the same problems that the average Joe has, even if that average Joe is the "millionaire next-door". Yes, why bother to debate on how to spend money? Why not have one of everything?

Of course a centimillionaire who does not have 1 billion still has to decide on whether to have a helipad in the back of his yacht, but I don't think the average forum member would have much to offer in such discussions.

Ha was right that people most often like to "brag". I take this verb a bit more broadly to mean that we like to tell about something that we are proud of. It may not be about wealth, but about some accomplishments, or some new acquisitions. It may be our skill or knowledge in cooking, or a serendipitous find on craigslist.

When I just discovered this forum, I surfed and looked at some old threads. I laughed my ass off at some threads about LBYM, where people half-jokingly told how their frugal ways were superior. We have not had that kind of bragging in a while. I miss it.
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Old 04-24-2010, 11:18 PM   #150
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I miss it.
I don't! And I hope your nostaligia for it does not get it started up again.

Ha
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Old 04-25-2010, 10:33 AM   #151
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I agree with everything said in the last few posts (except nostalgia for LBYM "jokes"). I think we can stop talking about the mega rich (except in the abstact) as there wouldn't be any likely on this board. Define mega rich as >$100million net worth. Likely our diversity might max out at a few 10's of millions perhaps. This still leaves a lot of lifestyle differences but that is what makes things interesting as long as the discussion can be respectful and tolerant of all viewpoints.
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Old 04-25-2010, 10:39 AM   #152
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Hmm... I think LBYM technique discussions can be funny and entertaining. No more TP saving techniques please, or tricks that amount to stealing.

My point is that most people here are able to, or plan to retire early by scrimping on something compared to their peers who make the same income. We may exaggerate what we do to save, in order to laugh at ourselves. What's wrong with that?
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Old 04-25-2010, 11:17 AM   #153
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Does this mean I can't tell anyone I've been stitching used dryer sheets together to make bath towels?
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Old 04-25-2010, 11:41 AM   #154
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Does this mean I can't tell anyone I've been stitching used dryer sheets together to make bath towels?
I don't know, but I must admit that shamefully, I have never made my own laundry detergent and I never plan to do so.

Usually I *DO* use about 1/4th as much liquid detergent as is indicated as the proper amount by the line on the cap... ssshhhhh!!!! Don't tell anybody! After all, I do buy name brand liquid detergent (Tide) so that has to count for something.

Wait - - which are we supposed to do? Tell people how LBYM we are, or tell people how LBYM we aren't? You all have really confused me now. Oh well, I did both.
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Old 04-25-2010, 12:37 PM   #155
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How did I miss such an entertaining discussion?

My parents had several vacation homes. They had one home in the city for the week, one home in the mountains for the week-ends and winters (skiing), and one home on the beach for the summers. The mountain home was only 30 minutes away by car and was used heavily (at least once a week) and required quite a bit of maintenance (snow plowing in the winter, mowing in the summer, painting, etc...). In truth, that home required so much maintenance that I never thought of it as a vacation home. The summer home was much further away, so we went there only once a year or so, but it was heavily used by friends and family during the off-season. The summer home required much less maintenance on our part (we paid a fee to have someone maintain the property).

Now that I am in a position to have vacation homes myself, I find little enthusiasm for them. I will one day inherit either the summer or winter home and I am still unsure whether I will keep it or sell it. Personally I prefer to have the option to go to a different place each year and splurge on a luxury hotel rather than spend time and money on upkeep for a property I visit only once or twice a year. But to each their own.
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Old 04-25-2010, 03:23 PM   #156
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Wait - - which are we supposed to do? Tell people how LBYM we are, or tell people how LBYM we aren't?
Both. I don't know about other posters, but I like to brag about how I save money by being a DIY'er in home and car maintenance projects which occasionally involve tall ladders and scaffolds , then splurge that savings on travel. That way, I feel good about taking travel, having two homes (look at all the savings that I have made by maintaining them myself!), and still having money left to count.

PS. Forgot to add the savings I have made by maintaining and installing some upgrades on the RV that I only had for 2 months. I went to Camping World to buy some RV parts and cringed at what they charge for doing routine maintenance.
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Old 04-25-2010, 04:03 PM   #157
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I went to Camping World to buy some RV parts and cringed at what they charge for doing routine maintenance.
Yikes! Didn't anyone warn you about the Affinity Group?
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Old 04-25-2010, 04:14 PM   #158
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No.

As a place to get RV parts, its price is competitive with another local shop I went to, and in fact is sometimes lower. The labor charge (which I do not incur) is high, but to be fair, another local shop hangs a sign up front saying $120/hr labor, 1/2 hr minimum.

So, what's wrong with the Affinity Group (which is the parent corp of Camping World as I just found out)? There are always rows of RVs parked there, waiting to be serviced.
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Old 04-25-2010, 04:41 PM   #159
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No. So, what's wrong with the Affinity Group (which is the parent corp of Camping World as I just found out)?
And they are the parent of a bunch of other RV related enterprises. There is nothing inherently wrong with the organization, just be sure that "shop around" is constantly uppermost in your mind when dealing with them. They are sometimes the best place but not always... and when they are not, it does serious damage to the wallet.

Caveat Emptor, I think is the operating attitude to take. Once you are on their mailing list (too late) it is even more fun.
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Old 04-25-2010, 05:15 PM   #160
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Does this mean I can't tell anyone I've been stitching used dryer sheets together to make bath towels?
I'll go you one better ! I am weaving together dryer sheets and the lint to make a new dock and to make sue I'm LBYM I'm only buying no name dryer sheets and buying them at the dollar store when I have a coupon !
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