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04-21-2010, 04:35 PM
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#101
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Administrator
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 23,039
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ziggy29
True.
I'd add that think it's silly for people to criticize someone's spending when they can very easily afford it *and* it enhances their quality of life. We're not all wired to value the same things or to all find the same things "wasteful" and "frivolous."
To one person, eating out a few times a week may not add much enjoyment to life and to them, it therefore seems wasteful and spendthrift even if they could afford it. For some people it adds a lot to enjoyment of life. Beyond a certain level of thrift, refusing to spend on things you enjoy even though you can very easily afford it goes beyond frugal and begins to approach miserly.
One can live well below their means and still have discretionary spending that others would consider "wasteful." Still, I tend to follow the Dave Ramsey philosophy on this one -- there's nothing wrong with spending in and of itself; there's something wrong with spending you can't afford. And if someone can very easily afford a second home (even if vacant 85% of the time) and it improves their quality of life, more power to them. But yeah, it's not something I would call "thrifty" or "frugal."
Living below your means shouldn't have to mean "living as far as possible below your means," not unless that's what someone happens to value.
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A good post Ziggy. I'm sure many here would find some of my spending wasteful (I recently posted on my costly wine habit), but I have been fortunate enough to have reached a position in life where I can afford it.
I have tried to live my life by the precept that "you shouldn't own anything that you don't either know to be useful or believe to be beautiful". Keeping that in mind has saved me from buying a lot of useless crap to clutter up the house.
I also extend the precept to experiences. I try to spend money only on activities, like vacations, that will relax me, educate me or otherwise benefit me in some way. I have seen way too many people doing things just because they thought they should, without seeming to derive any real enjoyment from their activity.
Obviously, some people may find that a second vacation home enhances their life enough to be worth spending money on it. The young wife and I haven't ever felt the need even for a first vacation home, but I fully support those who can afford it and think that having one will enrich their lives.
__________________
Living an analog life in the Digital Age.
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04-21-2010, 06:24 PM
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#102
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: minnesota
Posts: 13,228
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kcowan
What about Buffet? I think he display the LBYM attitude much better than Gates.
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I agree.
__________________
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No more lawyer stuff, no more political stuff, so no more CYA
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04-21-2010, 06:26 PM
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#103
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: minnesota
Posts: 13,228
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Quote:
Originally Posted by haha
Any well off person in the US is giving plenty to a mandatory charity with bloated administrative costs- the US Government. Her rate of giving is soon to increase markedly also.
Ha
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As I am being terse, I'll continue and say that I disagree that "any well off person is giving plenty" in taxes.
__________________
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No more lawyer stuff, no more political stuff, so no more CYA
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04-21-2010, 06:27 PM
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#104
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: minnesota
Posts: 13,228
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He can own all the companies he wants. I just think that huge success comes with huge responsibility which AFAIK he takes seriously.
__________________
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No more lawyer stuff, no more political stuff, so no more CYA
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04-21-2010, 06:48 PM
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#105
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 11,401
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kcowan
I think at a certain level, owning property is much more satisfying than having a larger portfolio and it represents a store of value in normal times.
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I agree. There's something "real" about real estate, which is why it now comprises a significant chunk of my NW. However, I have only one vacation home; the rest is income property. The vacation home is rented when I am not there. It's all working for me.
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04-22-2010, 05:32 AM
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#106
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gone traveling
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Eastern PA
Posts: 3,851
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Danmar
Still there is something to be said for arriving at your vacation place with your clothes in the closet and you cars in the garage.
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It's still the same view looking out the window. Much too boring for us ...
We look at our trips (no longer vacation, since I'm retired) as "adventures". We don't want to sit on a rocking chair and just take it easy (we could do that in our home)...
Anyway, our trips take us outside the US (along with one trip per year in the US) every year. Just an example, last June we spent a month "down under", snorkeling the Great Barrier Reef, spending time in the Outback (yes, hiking around Uluru) plus the big city pleasures of Sydney - plus many more places on the continent. This June we're on a Baltic cruise (England, Norway, Russia, etc.) When we return, DW is off with her "travel buddy" (another woman that she travels with when I decide not to go) on two trips in the early fall. One to Canyonlands/Vegas (no, I don't ask) and the month after on a Nile River cruise for two weeks.
Not to impress anybody at all; just to show that we're not (and haven't been for at the last 15+ years) happy with going to the same place on our journies, both before and after retirement. Again, a "second" (or third, or fourth...) home would not fit our lifestyle...
As for others? Fine.
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04-22-2010, 03:50 PM
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#107
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Alberta/Ontario/ Arizona
Posts: 3,393
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Having vacation homes doesn't preclude travel. We are out of the country this year 72 days-US, Mexico, Carribean, Italy, Turkey, and Thailand planned and booked, or done. Not including our own places. We are not bored.
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04-22-2010, 04:17 PM
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#108
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 14,328
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OK, I'll say it. I think this thread has turned into more of a bragfest than an actual discussion.
Flame away.
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04-22-2010, 07:27 PM
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#109
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: New Orleans
Posts: 47,500
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OK, I don't have a first vacation home much less a second vacation home, and not only that - - I have no travel plans whatsoever! So there. Does that help?
__________________
Already we are boldly launched upon the deep; but soon we shall be lost in its unshored, harbourless immensities. - - H. Melville, 1851.
Happily retired since 2009, at age 61. Best years of my life by far!
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04-22-2010, 08:44 PM
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#110
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: May 2008
Location: No fixed abode
Posts: 8,765
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I'm going camping in 3 weeks, and I'm going to sleep in an 8-man tent by myself. On an inflatable air mattress. Doesn't get much better than that.
__________________
"Good judgment comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement." - Anonymous (not Will Rogers or Sam Clemens)
DW and I - FIREd at 50 (7/06), living off assets
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04-22-2010, 08:46 PM
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#111
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Texas: No Country for Old Men
Posts: 50,021
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Quote:
Originally Posted by harley
I'm going camping in 3 weeks, and I'm going to sleep in an 8-man tent by myself. On an inflatable air mattress. Doesn't get much better than that.
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You only have one tent?
__________________
Numbers is hard
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04-22-2010, 08:48 PM
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#112
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: May 2008
Location: No fixed abode
Posts: 8,765
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I keep the porta-potty in the small one.
__________________
"Good judgment comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement." - Anonymous (not Will Rogers or Sam Clemens)
DW and I - FIREd at 50 (7/06), living off assets
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04-22-2010, 08:53 PM
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#113
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hooverville
Posts: 22,983
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Quote:
Originally Posted by harley
I'm going camping in 3 weeks, and I'm going to sleep in an 8-man tent by myself.
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That's wasteful. Can't you find some homeless campers to share with?
__________________
"As a general rule, the more dangerous or inappropriate a conversation, the more interesting it is."-Scott Adams
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04-22-2010, 09:00 PM
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#114
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 17,774
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Take that tent on a few international vacations every year and rent it out when you get there!
__________________
“Would you like an adventure now, or would you like to have your tea first?” J.M. Barrie, Peter Pan
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04-22-2010, 09:37 PM
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#115
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 35,712
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So, taking an interstate joy ride in a new car over several days does not count as "travel" ?
__________________
"Old age is the most unexpected of all things that happen to a man" -- Leon Trotsky (1879-1940)
"Those Who Can Make You Believe Absurdities Can Make You Commit Atrocities" - Voltaire (1694-1778)
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04-22-2010, 10:12 PM
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#116
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gone traveling
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 3,864
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.
Quote:
It's still the same view looking out the window. Much too boring for us ...
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04-22-2010, 10:29 PM
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#117
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: New Orleans
Posts: 47,500
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Hey, I said that I didn't have any travel plans... not that I hadn't ever traveled.
__________________
Already we are boldly launched upon the deep; but soon we shall be lost in its unshored, harbourless immensities. - - H. Melville, 1851.
Happily retired since 2009, at age 61. Best years of my life by far!
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04-22-2010, 10:31 PM
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#118
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gone traveling
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 3,864
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W2R
Hey, I said that I didn't have any travel plans... not that I hadn't ever traveled.
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Life is what happens to us while we are busy making plans...
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04-22-2010, 10:42 PM
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#119
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: New Orleans
Posts: 47,500
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There is always the possibility that I might travel north a few hundred miles this summer if a strong hurricane approaches New Orleans. I have no definite travel plans, though.
Life seems to throw plenty of travel my way, even when I don't plan for it!
__________________
Already we are boldly launched upon the deep; but soon we shall be lost in its unshored, harbourless immensities. - - H. Melville, 1851.
Happily retired since 2009, at age 61. Best years of my life by far!
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04-23-2010, 05:40 AM
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#120
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 11,330
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Heck, I wear junky old T shirts while relaxing in my weekend home.
__________________
Idleness is fatal only to the mediocre -- Albert Camus
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