Ever Been to China?

[DrRoy]

I tried posting this in the "Any Travel Planned" thread but did not get a response so I thought I would start a new one.

About 2 weeks ago DW and I saw a reference to low cost tours to China from a company called Sinorama. You could get, for example, a 15 day, pretty complete tour in China for $1600 per person. On further study, it seems that the quality of the tour elements is suspect, and one spends a fair amount of time on required visits to factories and shops where you got a hard sell to buy the offering there. If that is the most you can afford, it may be the only way to see China, but it's not for us.

After some more research, we are going to consider a custom tour from China Highlights or China Discovery. Does anyone have experience with them? We know to specify no "forced visits" to shops and factories. We also know generally where we want to go and are highly interested in photography. Are there any other custom tour operators you would suggest? How about general tips if you have been there? Thanks in advance.

[MBAustin]

I went in 2011 with Intrepid (an Australian company) on the China Highlights tourChina Highlights | China Tours | Intrepid Travel US. I was the oldest person in the group, most were in their late 20s/early 30s. We had a fabulous guide (young Chinese Muslim woman). Hotels were ok, not fancy; food was surprisingly good. The write-up on the website accurately describes the trip. The only really bad part was the poor condition of the toilets by the end of the overnight train trip.

General tips:
- when you aren't with the tour group, stick to official taxis, trains, or subways
- be discreet about mentioning political topics in public spaces (especially Beijing) - you're probably being recorded and this can get your tour guide in trouble
- expect to have locals or other Asian travelers want to take their pictures with you (especially if you are blonde and/or blue-eyed)

I'm really glad that I went, so I encourage you to book a tour that fits your travel style and budget and go for it.

[flyingaway]

These are the so-called shopping tours, you spend lots of time on shopping, and you will almost feel forced to buy things that you don't need or want. If the tour price is low, even if they say there will be no shopping, don't believe it. There will be. Their excuse will be that we have to accommodate some people who want to go shopping. You should buy some tours from US based companies and expect to pay reasonable prices.

[Souschef]

I went with Odysseys Unlimited. They feature small group tours, which is a plus. We stayed at some of the same hotels that Vantage did, but we had half the people of their group.

[braumeister]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MBAustin The only really bad part was the poor condition of the toilets by the end of the overnight train trip.

Based on my trip, I would revise this a bit. The toilets on the train were in an unspeakable condition at the start of the trip, and by the next morning were unapproachable.
The food on the train was basically the same as the toilets. Nobody wanted to go anywhere near it.

Our guide said this was just because our schedule got messed up and we were on a normal train instead of a tourist train.

But this was the only unpleasant part of an otherwise fantastic ten day trip, and I would do it again.

[TrvlBug]

We used China Int'l Travel Service (CITS) in 1994 for a customized tour for 2 including mostly 4* hotels (some 5 and one 3). We spent 3 weeks in China including a Yangtze River cruise. We wanted to go to Dazu but couldn't find any tour companies that included Dazu. Our trip included 4 in-China flights and private guide and car at each location. We were surprised at the affordability, about 20% more than tour group costs. IIRC they are the "official" travel agency for China and did a fabulous job.

[YVRRocketSurgery]

Just wanted to throw my two bits on the tours subsidized by shopping. My gf/now missus did one to Beijing about a decade ago when I was working in HKG. And she did another one recently (actually two parts back to back) with her parents just over a year ago.

It is true that you waste an incredible amount of time in shopping traps (jade, medicine, tea, ceramics, etc). You are pretty much stuck until a certain sales quotient is met. Some places are in the middle of no where so you can't even ditch the store until you're group is ready to keep going. You're golden if your group has a bunch of shopaholics though. The restos they take you too are also average at best.

Would I do tour subsidized by shopping again? Nah, not worth my time.

One of my coworkers at a time when I work working in HKG, he just hired a driver recommended by the hotel he was staying at in Beijing during his own trip. He thought that was great.

[Luck_Club]

I've traveled to china on 3 occasions, never on a tour, nor the "travel office of a mega corp". Traversed several cities per trip, and utilized train, bus, and water taxi. In general if you are flexible and have a good sense of humor, it is great. Air ticket can be had for about $1200, and "5 star accommodations" for about $150 a night. In general it is very safe. Many speak English though they won't let you know it. Be polite, apologetic and throw yourself at their mercy and you will do fine.

Learn
Hello
thank you
bring phrase book.
Key is be humble and smile.

Shanghai easy.
Hong Kong super easy
Guanzhou semi easy.
Yanchung very little English
Zhuhai challenging but still cool.

All major transport is in English and Chinese. Subway at rush hour is very packed. Being an ugly American you will get more space then normal

My wife was shocked that after waiting in a long line to use a disgusting pit toilet, no one wanted to go after her!

[NW-Bound]

Oh boy! Any place that does not have decent bathrooms, I will pass. I can just do an armchair visit via youtube. I am chicken-hearted, and not that adventurous.

[6miths]

Ray Kroc's secret to success!! Clean washrooms! They were very clean at the McDonald's in Hong Kong the times that I was there but never ventured into the PRC proper.

[Meadbh]

I visited China on an educational trip in 2000. One of our guides told us that China was beginning the Bathroom Revolution. Sounds like there is a ways to go, still. But we had a fantastic trip.

[gcgang]

I went in 2002 to adopt my daughter, so only my 3 days in Beijing before the adoption process count.

We walked/ took cabs within Beijing. It was fun and exciting, pretty easy to get around except for one cab ride that went thru a very bad part of town.

We met an English speaking cab driver who was a hustler, in the best sense of the word, and was very accommodating, even taking us to the Great Wall. There was the customary stop at the jade shop. I was able to figure out pretty quickly that things weren't a great deal there as we had just bought one of those rock globes in Vegas for a housewarming present, and then seen the same thing only a bigger globe for 1/4 the price at Costco. The jade shop had the same globe. Pretty much the same price as the Vegas globe, so we passed on anything at their shop.

[braumeister]

Quote:

Originally Posted by 6miths Ray Kroc's secret to success!! Clean washrooms! They were very clean at the McDonald's in Hong Kong the times that I was there but never ventured into the PRC proper.

When I visited the McDonald's in Beijing (well, you just have to, don't you?) they just had pit toilets (two footprints and a hole), but they were clean!

[NW-Bound]

Pit toilets used to be common in other places in the world too, including Europe.

[KB]

I found that the handicapped stalls have 'regular' toilets in China.

My sister and I took a 3 week Overseas Adventure Travel trip to China, but it was not a custom trip. However, we went all over China by bus, plane, train and small cruise ship. It took us to a number of the famous tourist sites, all were interesting. We went into Tibet also, and stayed with a local family in a very small town in China where the other residents had outhouses in their back yards. While I probably wouldn't go back, it was a good trip.

[MBAustin]

For clarity on the restroom issue - all of the "standing" toilets that we encountered other than on the overnight train were perfectly clean. Also, we were on a regular, not a tourist, train. Western-style toilets as an option in public restrooms are becoming more common but 5 years ago they were still a minority.

[Mr._Graybeard]

DW and I were in China in late 2015 for about three weeks. We were lucky to have my sister (and her driver) as an informal guide around Shanghai, where we spent most of our time. During excursions to Xian and Beijing we employed a private guide and driver. Guides were fluent in English, drivers were not.

If you're going in a small group, I'd highly recommend retaining your own guide. We used Allen's Tours in Xian, and our guide got us into a limited-access area at the terra-cotta warriors site where we weren't being jostled for position at the observation rail (as our guide said, "There is no personal space in China").

We took the high-speed train from Shanghai to Beijing -- also highly recommended. 800 miles in five comfortable hours, cruising speed 190 mph. Awesome.

[FIYes]

I have taken a Sinorama tour as mentioned by the OP. I thoroughly enjoyed the tour. However I will say that it had all the advantages and disadvantages of being on a tour. As a point of reference I have also taken a Globus tour and a Cosmos tour in Europe.
Comparing Sinorama to the other two tour companies that I have traveled with...I would say that there were no more "shopping opportunities " than with the other two companies. I would also say that the Sinorama tour was more inclusive. No additional charges for banquets or shows. The hotels we stayed in were very nice....only complaint was that the floors could have been cleaner. Other than the carpets, the hotel rooms were excellent. As a budget traveler the hotels were nicer than we are accustomed to. The river cruise was very nice.
Now on the negative side...like all tours you are traveling with a bus load of people. You go when and where the tour goes and you stay however long the tour stays. However, that is a drawback of all tours not just this one.

[Sojourner]

I've never been to China and have no plans to go anytime soon, due in part to its very bad reputation for things like extreme pollution and medieval hygiene.

Here's an interesting article I found that talks about that in greater detail.

Blogs-about-why-china-is-disgusting

Quote:

China, as we all know, is one vast, filthy pit. From its air pollution to its lead poisoning, China has earned a worldwide reputation as the Goliath of health hazards. However, Westerners visiting China for the first time are often unprepared for a different sort of dirtiness: poor human hygiene. With their overflowing hole-in-the-ground toilets and public spitting habits, [Chinese commoners] horrify international travelers with their cavalier disregard for Western manners and hygiene. And since they comprise the majority of the Chinese population, they are unavoidable.

I'm a bit of a "germaphobe", so I can't imagine actually enjoying spending time around hoards of people constantly spitting near me, on sidewalks, in buses and trains, and even indoors in places like airports. Plus... those pit bathrooms.

[Dd852]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sojourner I've never been to China and have no plans to go anytime soon, due in part to its very bad reputation for things like extreme pollution and medieval hygiene. Here's an interesting article I found that talks about that in greater detail. Blogs-about-why-china-is-disgusting I'm a bit of a "germaphobe", so I can't imagine actually enjoying spending time around hoards of people constantly spitting near me, on sidewalks, in buses and trains, and even indoors in places like airports. Plus... those pit bathrooms.

I'm a germaphobe too but I lived happily in China for many years - go figure. Like everyplace, including my home town in the USA, it is very easy to make all sorts of judgments (positive and negative) based on limited evidence but like everyplace, it yields different things for different people. Sometimes it depends on your attitude. Sometimes it depends on your luck - having a great friend or a lousy toilet. Sometimes it depends on the pure randomness of weather, companions, your age, your mood, your health... if you're someone who tends to like travel, go. If you're someone who prefers the familiar, don't go. No value judgments either way!