Italy for 2 years

J

justlikebike

Recycles dryer sheets
Joined
Jun 2, 2013
Messages
106
Location
Victoria
So my DW and I are thinking about moving to Italy for 2 years or so. My DW has family over there and we have visited them on several occasions. We absolutely loved it.
We are both dual citizens (Canadian/Italian)
We are trying to come up with all the things to be aware of for such a long move.
Things to think about:
1) House sitter for our house in Canada.
2) Banking. I assume we will get an Italian bank account and transfer money monthly or so from our Canadian Bank to our Italian bank. Not sure how yet, will need to talk to our bank here. Have no desire to have larger amounts of money in Italy.
3) Medical Insurance - Not sure what to do here. I believe we can get basic medical through Italy as we are Italian Citizens, but will need to confirm the steps there. Is there any extended medical insurance available in Italy?
4) Drivers license. I believe I'll need to take an Italian drivers test after being in Italy for 1 year.
5) Purchasing a car in Italy. I assume this isn't a big deal other that I am uncertain about getting insurance over there with a Canadian Drivers license. Has anyone done this?
6) Paying taxes. Will need to talk to my accountant.
7) Things like renting a furnished apartment, etc. I don't think are that complicated, we have family and friends over there to vouch for us and I can't see that as too different from here.

Is there any other things to be aware of? Has anyone done anything similar that can offer advice?
We are just starting down this idea path, so although we may sound disorganized we have a year or so to plan.
Thanks
 
You are fortunate you are dual citizens - it was a major PITA when I had to get a student visa and then go through the whole process to get my residency in Italy - medical insurance is cheap there - as I remember you had to purchase the basic that covered most catastrophic and some preventive. Taxes - the Italians are fairly serious about that - the most important thing I had to do when I got there was to get my Italian equivalent of a social security number and that had to be done in person at the office that doles those out - if you are a citizen, you probably already have one of those.

I did not use an Italian bank account - if you have an account that allows international bill pay, then you should be fine. Also, I took out cash from the ATMs in Euros....easier that way - other thing is an international credit card that doesn't charge fees for international charges (currency conversion).

Any car in Europe is going to be much more expensive than that of the US (don't know about Canada). Gas is four times more expensive, almost every road in Italy that isn't a super local one going through villages is a toll road and many are now auto-pay. Insurance will probably be a lot more, too, because, well, the Italians are not known for their good driving habits. When I lived in Germany stories abounded about the Italian driving habits and how it could be disconcerting to American (and German) drivers. Just be careful and be prepared to pay more in insurance as well.

Renting an apartment isn't difficult - and getting it furnished might be a bit more of a challenge, but you could probably buy some cheaper furniture there to furnish it.

In any case, best of luck to you and it truly should be a wonderful adventure - be sure to visit all parts of Italy as each region is different with different food, culture, dialects and history - I really liked Italy outside of the bureaucratic hassle I had there :).
 
Yeah, was in Italy for 3 months last year. Saw 7 accidents while I was there.
So for your basic expenses such as Hydro, internet, etc. How did you pay those? I assumed for things like that I would need a European bank account.
Thanks
 
"So for your basic expenses such as Hydro, internet, etc. How did you pay those? I assumed for things like that I would need a European bank account."

They were included in my rent - for a phone, one could buy an Italian service SIM card.

I belong to credit unions that allow international bill pay - that means they can pay international bills in Euros electronically. There are some threads here about how people pay for bills overseas---I think Chase Bank and others have this feature as well. That way you don't have to re-patriate your money to a foreign bank. In my case, the credit union has an IBAN number that is recognized by the European electronic banking systems - similar to ACH in the US - so I can send and receive funds in Euros even though the base currency for the account is US$. I have no knowledge of what is available in Canada. However, (and I may be wrong here), if Canada is part of the Commonwealth, then the Canadian banks may have closer ties to the British banking system electronically which is also recognized in Europe - lots of Brits work in Europe so need to use a similar banking system. You might ask your bank about that and what they offer.
 
I don't know about Italy but in the UK banks need proof of address before they will open an account. It is a catch 22, you need a place but to pay for the place you need a bank account which you can't get without a place.
 
jim584672 said:
I don't know about Italy but in the UK banks need proof of address before they will open an account. It is a catch 22, you need a place but to pay for the place you need a bank account which you can't get without a place.
Click to expand...

Excellent point - I have been fortunate in that my banking choices (credit unions) have had international bill pay - Service Credit Union, PenFed, etc. If the OP has accounts with them, this may be an easier way to solve the issue - or if there is a Canadian bank/credit union that also provides service for Canadian military personnel and the OP has a way to get an account. Many of the places I served overseas were joint-combined so we had lots of different military uniforms around and they all lived there and needed to be able to have local banking services so they could pay their local bills.
 
I'd rent out your house.
You will miss out on about $48,000 (guess) of rent , and instead have a house sitter cost of $2,400 min.
You could put your furniture in storage for a couple of thousand per year.
 
Yes, will visit my bank soon and ask some specific questions. Thanks for the information that helps clarify the questions I need to ask. We have family over there, so "proof of address" shouldn't be a problem. Ideally I would prefer to not open a bank account over there, but assumed I needed to for bill payments, insurance, etc. Will confirm with my bank and if not, some of the other more international banks. I know Scotia Bank and HSBC have more international presence.
 
Sunset said:
I'd rent out your house.
You will miss out on about $48,000 (guess) of rent , and instead have a house sitter cost of $2,400 min.
You could put your furniture in storage for a couple of thousand per year.
Click to expand...

Ha! YOU talk to my DW! :LOL: We just renovated so the idea of someone damaging that scares her. We are hoping our DN and her boyfriend will stay there.
 
I would never rent out my house.
 
We are VERY jealous!

If you rent your house don't cheap out. Hire a good property management company who know how to screen renters and protect owners as much as possible. The fee that you pay will be well worth the money. Unless of course you can find a trusted friend or relative to move in and pay rent.

Why not try to find a short term furnished rental? Then you can take your time, cast about, and understand the market and the preferred areas. No need to sign up for 2 years right off the bat so to speak.

We have driven in Italy many times. Toll roads and back roads. We do not see much of a difference despite all the old wives tales about Italian drivers. One thing to be very aware of is the no go areas (for non residents) in some cities. The fines can be quite high. If you are not aware and/or not watching the signage you could end with a ticket.
 
Last edited:
justlikebike said:
Ha! YOU talk to my DW! :LOL: We just renovated so the idea of someone damaging that scares her. We are hoping our DN and her boyfriend will stay there.
Click to expand...

So you get landlord insurance, have the renters pay 3K damage deposit, take lots of photos before renting and have the property managed.

Besides I see you are near Victoria, so the 2K per month number could be low, maybe it's 3K for you and that is $72,000 you are missing.
Plus renters would pay utilities which is another cost you will avoid worth $4,000 over the 2 years.

Your DN and boyfriend, could easily damage the place like a renter, but you couldn't/wouldn't sue them so they might be a worse choice.

ps - if you don't find anybody, I'd house sit for 2 months in a Spring/Fall time. We would use the opportunity to tour around locally.
 
Teacher Terry said:
I would never rent out my house.
Click to expand...

At first I had a relative live in mine, as leaving a house empty is really bad for many reasons (like no ins coverage).

Then I rented it out. I'm $450,000 ahead because I did and I still have the house rented out.

What if OP's 2 years turns to 3, then 4, then 5, etc....
 
Sunset said:
At first I had a relative live in mine, as leaving a house empty is really bad for many reasons (like no ins coverage).

Then I rented it out. I'm $450,000 ahead because I did and I still have the house rented out.

What if OP's 2 years turns to 3, then 4, then 5, etc....
Click to expand...



I think renting the house out is a great suggestion. We have considered moving to a tropical beach area for a couple of years and renting our place out while we’re away. We also did a major remodel in 2015 so I can understand the reluctance, but our condo would rent out for around $5K/month so that is just too much money to leave on the table, for us anyway.
 
I spoke with someone recently regarding their purchase of a home there. He related that it was a real PITB to pull it off. Stick with renting...
 
My wife's family is all from Tuscany (Lucca). There are still some pretty cheap homes you can get there but as mentioned, a real PITA. I think we will stick to renting.
What I have learned so far is: If you have no driving history your insurance is crazy expensive. Like 4000 euros. Italian medical pays for prescription meds with is cool. Dental is way cheap compared to here. If I am there more than a year I will need to pass an Italian driving test in Italian... That will require some studying...
 
justlikebike said:
My wife's family is all from Tuscany (Lucca). There are still some pretty cheap homes you can get there but as mentioned, a real PITA. I think we will stick to renting.
What I have learned so far is: If you have no driving history your insurance is crazy expensive. Like 4000 euros. Italian medical pays for prescription meds with is cool. Dental is way cheap compared to here. If I am there more than a year I will need to pass an Italian driving test in Italian... That will require some studying...
Click to expand...

Regarding driving history, I asked my US auto insurance company for a claim history letter. They provided me with a 7-year history which helped to cut my auto insurance premiums significantly when I moved to France.
 
I moved to France with my wife somewhat recently, and although I am not confident in direct applicability of my situation to yours, EU regulations may make some areas similar. Note that I am a US citizen only, whereas my wife has dual citizenship.


Bank accounts: It sounds like you already have an Italian account, so that greatly simplifies things. Nevertheless, you may be required to switch to the local branch due to bank company policy or government policy (France has concerns about money laundering and your banker supposedly is liable to some extent). Due to high fees for brick and mortar services, it can also make considerable sense to open up an on-line only account. Transferwise has been impeccable for transferring funds.


Utilities: Probably not a big deal, but you need a bank account with a RIB and possibly even a local bank account for proof of address.



Rent: Without a proven source of income such as a permanent job contract (a temporary, yet multi-year contract is not adequate), many rental agencies will not rent even if one offers to pay all rent up front. I think this is primarily due to it being 'different' rather than any legal reason, even with rental laws strongly favoring the renter. We were also surprised that personal and family guarantees, which were always utilized a decade ago, are now completely disregarded. This appears to be location dependent in France, and perhaps this has not yet changed in Italy at all.



Auto insurance: This appeared to not be available at all from the companies we contacted without a French driver's license (my wife did already have a French driver's license). As an 'occasional driver', I am covered on our policy as long as I do not drive on a daily basis, but I cannot be listed as an insured. There may be some convolution in what we were told for lack of French citizenship vs lack of a French driver's license, as we eventually gave up trying to get good information after discussing with 3 major companies and having one guarantee the 'occasional driver' aspect.


Purchasing an auto: This was simpler than expected and actually less expensive than in the US. A few things to be aware of: diesel is strongly going out of favor in France (and from my understanding, much of the rest of the EU), so resale of a diesel vehicle may become more challenging in the next several years. Vehicles above a certain displacement, newer/older than a certain age, or AWD/4WD may have much higher registration or insurance costs (moreso than in the US).


Taxes: This will be extremely dependent on your sources of income, both in terms of wage vs retirement and also country. Make sure you have your EU tax identification number on hand, as this can also be required for modifying bank accounts and some other government transactions. If you don't already have one as an Italian citizen, you may need to get one prior to dealing with your first year of taxes.


I'd also recommend having a few sets of documents readily available as you settle in: Italian birth certificate (or a recent US copy that can be translated), some standard forms that a family member can sign that guarantee fiscal responsibility and/or that you live at their location of residency, a certificate of marriage depending on how your income and/or health insurance are handled, and capability of showing a history of income extending back several months.



Again, take this with the caveat of being a different country, different residency/citizenship status, possibly an area of a city that is not as used to US immigrants, and likely a different work status. Nonetheless, I hope it offers a couple of items to think upon!
 
FIREd said:
Regarding driving history, I asked my US auto insurance company for a claim history letter. They provided me with a 7-year history which helped to cut my auto insurance premiums significantly when I moved to France.
Click to expand...


Extremely good point - having maximum insurance history showing no accidents cut insurance rates by 50% for us in France. Fortunately, we didn't have to have the document translated for the insurance company we went with (some said they required a translation).
 
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