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Old 12-28-2009, 11:25 AM   #21
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I'm joining the chorus of sympathy for Ivana. Not that I don't feel sorry for you parental units and all, but jeesh, these kids on planes can be horrible these days.
Like W2R and others, when I was a kid, I didn't make a peep if I was lucky enough to get to travel somewhere on a plane!
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Old 12-28-2009, 11:58 AM   #22
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For the record, I have yet to bring my kids on a plane. Part of the reason is that I'm not sure I could handle five hours of trying to get my kids to be quiet and sit still. And the potential whining, crying, fighting etc...

However if I needed to travel with kids to visit family, for example, I wouldn't hesitate to do it even if it made others around me uncomfortable. Maybe I could bring a handful of xanax with me to share (with my kids and with those passengers around me!).
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Old 12-28-2009, 12:47 PM   #23
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For the record, I have yet to bring my kids on a plane. Part of the reason is that I'm not sure I could handle five hours of trying to get my kids to be quiet and sit still. And the potential whining, crying, fighting etc...

However if I needed to travel with kids to visit family, for example, I wouldn't hesitate to do it even if it made others around me uncomfortable. Maybe I could bring a handful of xanax with me to share (with my kids and with those passengers around me!).

Yup, that's just the way I feel about smoking.....
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Old 12-28-2009, 01:25 PM   #24
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To the kid bashers - remember that the parents of those kids have to live with them 24/7/365 for 18 years. Take pity on us, please!
Here in Spain the multiplication can easily reach 28/30 years and then a few more years part-time....
A few parents have been brought to trial by their almost 30 year old children for not being adequately looked after by them financially and thrown out of parental home... Needless to say the children were given what they wanted by the judge.
Public opinion outraged.... but a lot of psychologists didn´t find the verdict unreasonable.
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Old 12-28-2009, 01:43 PM   #25
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However if I needed to travel with kids to visit family, for example, I wouldn't hesitate to do it even if it made others around me uncomfortable.
It is this attitude, the "I don't care if my kids bother you" attitude, which bothers both us childfree people and responsible parents who don't subject others to the bad behavior of their kids.

Please train your kids to behave on a plane or don't subject the rest of us to them.
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Old 12-28-2009, 01:48 PM   #26
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For the record, I have yet to bring my kids on a plane. Part of the reason is that I'm not sure I could handle five hours of trying to get my kids to be quiet and sit still. And the potential whining, crying, fighting etc...
Hey, if the passengers seated around you want to whine, cry and fight, I say let 'em have at it!
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Old 12-28-2009, 01:57 PM   #27
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Hey, if the passengers seated around you want to whine, cry and fight, I say let 'em have at it!
I'm a-leavin' on a jet plane to FL in less than 3 weeks.
Shall I test this theory?

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Old 12-28-2009, 01:59 PM   #28
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It is this attitude, the "I don't care if my kids bother you" attitude, which bothers both us childfree people and responsible parents who don't subject others to the bad behavior of their kids.

Please train your kids to behave on a plane or don't subject the rest of us to them.
Have no fear that Fuego's kids are polite, respectful, and very well mannered. As a childfree person myself, I tend to judge kids when I see them rather than admonishing strangers to "train" their kids.
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Old 12-28-2009, 02:13 PM   #29
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However if I needed to travel with kids to visit family, for example, I wouldn't hesitate to do it even if it made others around me uncomfortable.
Weren't you on a flight with Ivana just recently?
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Old 12-28-2009, 02:16 PM   #30
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It is this attitude, the "I don't care if my kids bother you" attitude, which bothers both us childfree people and responsible parents who don't subject others to the bad behavior of their kids.

Please train your kids to behave on a plane or don't subject the rest of us to them.
I care, but what am I to do? Short of drugging children, there is no magic antidote to child misbehavior. Sometimes they are "polite, respectful, and very well mannered" and sometimes they whine and cry a lot. Kind of like many adults, including Ms. Trump.

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Old 12-28-2009, 02:30 PM   #31
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I think there are "avoidable" and "unavoidable" places in terms of children acting unruly. An airplane is probably one of the "unavoidable" ones, whereas something like a nice restaurant (where you pay a lot for the ambience and atmosphere) is an "avoidable" one.

I wouldn't question a parent for taking a fairly boisterous 5-year-old on a plane, but I would question the judgment and consideration of a parent who brought a similar child to the expensive, fancy restaurant. If I went to McDonald's or Denny's, on the other hand, I would expect lots of kids acting like kids.

And if I was upset about kids being loud and rambunctious around me at a place like Chuck E. Cheese's, the problem is all me -- sort of like complaining about airplane noise after buying a house next to the airport...

To a large degree, the respect and understanding can go both ways with "situational awareness" combined with a little patience and consideration of others.
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Old 12-28-2009, 02:38 PM   #32
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I'm joining the chorus of sympathy for Ivana. Not that I don't feel sorry for you parental units and all, but jeesh, these kids on planes can be horrible these days.
Like W2R and others, when I was a kid, I didn't make a peep if I was lucky enough to get to travel somewhere on a plane!
This, of course, was in the days when parents didn't get locked up if they applied a little judicial "swat" when needed. Try that now, especially in public.


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Old 12-28-2009, 03:17 PM   #33
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How is it possible that no one on that flight thought to video the taking off of Ivana? Think what that would have been worth!
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Old 12-28-2009, 03:36 PM   #34
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How is it possible that no one on that flight thought to video the taking off of Ivana? Think what that would have been worth!
Fuego- you could have been ER'ed after selling the video footage to TMZ- they would have run it under the tagline "Ivana gets Trumped"
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Old 12-28-2009, 05:13 PM   #35
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The only plane I would have been able to ride in when I was a kid would have been a crop duster. You wouldn't be able to hear me whine in that plane....I'll guarantee ya!

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Old 12-29-2009, 01:07 AM   #36
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I believe that kids should behave reasonably on planes (and elsewhere) but maybe it's not reasonable to expect them to be perfectly quiet in a strange and exciting environment. There are quite a few different versions of this story circulating, so it's difficult to assess what really happened. In some versions there is no running or "screaming" just a fussy baby and all passengers are sitting in their seats. In all the versions, Ivana is cursing and cannot be calmed or controlled by the flight attendants, leading the pilot to return to the gate to put off an unruly passenger (Ivana). Regardless of the provocation, it seems like her impulse control was pretty far out of whack.
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Old 12-29-2009, 01:14 AM   #37
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expect the possibility that others will try to, and not in way you may necessarily approve of.

If you, or any like-thinking "gentleman", were to manifest your feelings by having inappropriate contact with my grand daughter, as you're implying, I guess we'd have a discussion about that.......

It's interesting how this discussion turned from a woman being ejected from an airplane for showing excessive hostility and aggravation (ie, lost her cool and went over the top cursing and not following instructions from the crew) to whining about other people's kids......

Ivana lost her temper and became hostile to crew members trying to calm her, so she had to go. The trigger was apparently noisy kids. But I would have expected the crew to have handled it the same way if she had blown up over a gas passing nerd engineer in the next seat, a software guru with bad breath, a retired public servant who wouldn't stop talking about FIRE or a goat keeper who didn't shower before boarding the plane.

When you make the decision to walk into the aluminum tube with a bunch of other folks, you better put your tolerant hat on and be prepared to follow instructions from the crew. Complaints can be made after deboarding at the other end of the flight.

Just saying.......
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Old 12-29-2009, 01:23 AM   #38
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If you can't control them in public, expect the possibility that others will try to, and not in way you may necessarily approve of.
This seems to imply that if you do not approve of the behavior of others children in public that you will take matters into your own hands - as well as imply that what you do will likely not be approved by the parents. Now maybe what you mean is that you will boldly ask them to behave in ways you approve of, but if what you really mean is that you will berate them or strike them, then you could be in a heap of trouble.
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Old 12-29-2009, 06:51 AM   #39
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It's pretty obvious from reading these posts who has raised kids and who hasn't been exposed to them at all. Just remember folks with no kids; unruly children will "pay back" those indulgent parents sooner if not later, anyway, I'm sure.

Maybe we should call Ivana's mother on her for her totally out-of-control, over-the-top, obnoxious, immature reaction that got her actually "escorted" off the plane?
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Old 12-29-2009, 08:22 AM   #40
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Okay, peeps, it looks like we're not going to be able to play nice in this one, so it's time for everyone's favorite cartoon pig to make a cameo.

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