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Old 02-26-2009, 08:42 PM   #101
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It's getting a bit more intense...
World news Feed Article | World news | guardian.co.uk
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Old 03-01-2009, 11:24 AM   #102
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It's getting a bit more intense...
More than a bit...

U.S. rattled as Mexico drug war bleeds over border

"Execution style murders, violent home invasions, and a spiraling kidnap rate in Phoenix -- where police reported an average of one abduction a day last year linked to Mexican crime -- are not the only examples along the border.

In southern California, police have investigated cases of Americans abducted by armed groups tied to the Tijuana drug trade. One involved a businesswoman and her teenage daughter snatched in San Diego last year and held to ransom south of the border.

In south Texas, a live hand grenade traced back to a Mexican cartel stash was tossed onto the pool table of a bar frequented by off-duty police officers in January."
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Old 03-01-2009, 12:08 PM   #103
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In south Texas, a live hand grenade traced back to a Mexican cartel stash was tossed onto the pool table of a bar frequented by off-duty police officers in January."
I read about that just a couple of weeks ago. I didn't know it was a "cop bar", and I'm not sure what would classify as such in Pharr. I do know that the ATF traced the grenade and knows it's part of a big cache that is linked to a number of other grenade attacks in Mexico, including several that were tossed at the US Consulate in Monterrey.

I'm not sure why this doesn't get more media attention. You have groups of renegade special forces troops like Las Zetas running amok on either side of the border tossing grenades in bars in Texas and at US Consulates and it's not big news? If somebody threw some grenades at the consulate in Toronto - would that make news? Or if one landed in a bar in Buffalo - would that be a big deal?

Edit: After posting my reply I was reading the newspaper and here's an excellent article on how things have changed. When I read this quote it made me realize that I haven't gone to Mexico in years. Not that I was a big traveler there, but things have changed too much to want to go out of my way to make a trip there.
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When he was a boy, Carr and his friends played in the stream and skipped over to Porvenir to watch movies or flirt with the girls in the plaza. But that was when the border was a region, not a rampart.

Now the new American fence blocks the river bank. And Carr and others in Fort Hancock haven’t crossed the short bridge to Mexico in years.

“Not on a dare,” said one of the farmers at the town’s cafe. “Not on a bet,” agreed another
I think Mexico in general is still okay, and there are plenty of places that are safe as any place else in the world. But there are places where things have changed. If you're going there you need to make sure about the situation where you are traveling. This guy's opinion mirrors mine.
Quote:
At least five Fort Hancock residents have been killed south of the river or simply disappeared in the past several years, Chief Deputy Mike Doyal said. Sheriff’s deputies recently scrambled on reports that a drug gang hit squad crossed the river.

“Twenty years ago, I would never have imagined I’d be sitting here talking about hit squads and military incursions,” Doyal said. “In the last seven or eight years this border has changed drastically.”
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Old 03-01-2009, 12:38 PM   #104
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I'm not sure why this doesn't get more media attention.
Several reasons I can think of. People have always had lower expectations regarding law and order anywhere south of the Rio Grande, and for the most part this has been experience based. Murders in Beverly Hills draw more attention that murders in Compton.

Mexico is warm, cheap, nearby and colorful. So the travel industry loves it. This is not a small industry. It advertises a lot in local newspapers and from this has considerable power on local and regional levels, as wel as considerable power to influence governments through their congrssional and state representatives.

Another reason is that with oil revenues falling and production likely to have peaked, Mexico direly needs travel revenue to help stay afloat. Historically and particularly over the past decade Mexico has had a powerful influence on our executive branch. The US federal government and border state governors don't want to do anything that leads to more poor Mexicans crossing the border.

The greater good perhaps? In other words, travelers are on their own. They may well get more misinformation than information.

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Old 03-01-2009, 12:46 PM   #105
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There's an advantage to being from the Northern Virginia/ Washington, DC area. Almost anywhere else one in the world one travels to, Mexico included, is relatively safer with a smaller murder rate.
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Old 03-01-2009, 12:50 PM   #106
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There's an advantage to being from the Northern Virginia/ Washington, DC area. Almost anywhere else one in the world one travels to, Mexico included, is relatively safer with a smaller murder rate.
So you are saying that Georgetown or Arlington or McLean have higher murder rates than Ciudad Juarez?

¡Dios mio!

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Old 03-01-2009, 12:57 PM   #107
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So you are saying that Georgetown or Arlington or McLean have higher murder rates than Ciudad Juarez?

¡Dios mio!

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Well, let's see, according to the latest stats I find, the murder rate in Mexico is 13 per 100,000. DC is 35.

I wouldn't put Arlington or Georgetown against Ciudad Juarez, but I'd put my money on the North Capital street neighborhood of DC.
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Old 03-01-2009, 01:16 PM   #108
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Well, let's see, according to the latest stats I find, the murder rate in Mexico is 13 per 100,000. DC is 35.

I wouldn't put Arlington or Georgetown against Ciudad Juarez, but I'd put my money on the North Capital street neighborhood of DC.
While the US rate of 4 per 100,000 is far too high, it makes me wonder why you posted the blatantly misleading statistic that you posted.

No one who is able to put together a retirement stash could fail to be unaware of the distortion involved.

Mexico has the highest murder rate in the western hemisphere. Jay Root, a McClatchy news reporter, wrote in 2007 that recent experience put Mexico behind only some notoriously lawless African nations.

"In a global context, we suffer from more homicides, that is to say, violent deaths, than any other region in the world except for certain regions on the African continent,'' said Eduardo Rojas, who helped put together the crime report at the Center for Social and Public Opinion Studies, a research arm of the Mexico's Chamber of Deputies.

The report, made public last week, was a setback for Mexican President Felipe Calderon, whose tough new war on drug trafficking has sent thousands of Mexican Army troops into the countryside and a record number of drug suspects to the United States for trial.
The report said that major federal crimes, which include homicides, kidnappings and arms trafficking, rose 25 percent in the first half of 2007 over the same period last year. In 2006, the same crimes rose 22 percent over the previous year.
Gangland style executions have risen 155 percent since 2001, according to the congressional report.


Mexico crime continues to surge | McClatchy Washington Bureau

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Old 03-01-2009, 01:25 PM   #109
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While the US rate of 4 per 100,000 is far too high, it makes me wonder why you posted the blatantly misleading statistic that you posted.
Ha
First, I didn't post a US rate of 4 per 100k, you did. I posted a Mexico rate of 13 per 100k. That's from here:
NationMaster - Murders (per capita) (most recent) by country

And I posted a DC murder rate of 35. That's from here:
2005 Murder Rate in Cities — Infoplease.com

If you think the statistics are incorrect, take it up with those sites.
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Old 03-01-2009, 02:04 PM   #110
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First, I didn't post a US rate of 4 per 100k, you did. I posted a Mexico rate of 13 per 100k. That's from here:
NationMaster - Murders (per capita) (most recent) by country

And I posted a DC murder rate of 35. That's from here:
2005 Murder Rate in Cities — Infoplease.com

If you think the statistics are incorrect, take it up with those sites.
My last communication to you. The misleading statistic that you posted is this:

Quote:
Well, let's see, according to the latest stats I find, the murder rate in Mexico is 13 per 100,000. DC is 35.
Reasonably well informed and well meant discussion is interesting to me.

Obvious distortion and unclaimed agendas are not.

¡Adios!
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Old 03-01-2009, 04:57 PM   #111
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Returning to my OP before the previous bizarre exchange:

The murder rate in Mexico is 13 per 100,000. DC is 35. Anyone can look up the references I posted.

I hold to my original comment, almost anywhere in the world has a lower murder rate than DC. Obviously, there are places in Mexico and other places that are more dangerous than DC, but I would not go to those places. When I go to Mexico, I don't hang around the slums of Ciudad Juarez, I choose safe areas. Same as when I travel to Jamaica, Turkey, Holland, Puerto Rico, or any other number of places that I've travelled to, I have a choice of where I hang out. When I'm in the DC area, even though I live in a pretty safe suburb, I don't always have a choice of where I travel. I may have to go through the North Capital area sometimes to get to through town, or I may have to go through the Georgia Avenue bombed out areas to get to Walter Reed. It's not something I lose sleep over, but I feel as safe or safer when I travel than when I'm back home.
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Old 03-02-2009, 12:06 PM   #112
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Stay out of the border towns, they are death traps, even the marines and US army personnel were told not to cross over for R and R.

The country I believe is going into a rapid decline quickly, also due to many returning due to downturn in US economy. The US is essentially their safety valve and keeps the country from exploding.

I guess places like Cancun, Mexico City, Acapulco, the seashore are ok, but the border areas are death traps, crowded, dirty and sell the same crap you can buy in a shlock store in any town.

The only reason to go their is if you need cheaps scripts or dental care, cross over quickly, get it done, and get out, all on foot.

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Old 03-02-2009, 12:42 PM   #113
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Old 03-02-2009, 01:14 PM   #114
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Stay out of the border towns, they are death traps, even the marines and US army personnel were told not to cross over for R and R.
jug
Yep. From the link that freebird posted: "The situation in Ciudad Juarez is of special concern. Mexican authorities report that more than 1,800 people have been killed in the city since January 2008."

A year or so ago I was driving in south El Paso and the next thing I knew I was on the road to Juarez. For about a millisecond I thought about crossing over then came to my senses about going to a border town, and saw the traffic backup getting coming back the other way. Fortunately there was a u-turn spot before getting to Juarez, but I still had to recross the US border to get back.

OTOH, I have many friends living in Mexico on the west coast, san miguel, and other areas that have never had any problems and love the lifestyle. It's all about location location location.
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Old 03-02-2009, 03:44 PM   #115
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There was an interesting segment on 60 Minutes last night about the situation in Mexico. There was a warning to college spring breakers about travel to Mexico. The Sec. of Homeland Security described the confrontation going on between the drug cartels and the Mexican government. Major wars here. Lot of serious type weapons in use here and most coming from the States. The feds kill a bunch of druggies and then the druggies kill a bunch of police. Not just kill but beheadings. This is like a third word country. According to higher-ups interviewed, the big problem is the corruption in the government. However, this has always been the case.

Tourism, being a big part of the Mexican economy, is in jeopardy. The word is out. Things are bad there and getting worse. DON'T GO!!!
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Old 03-02-2009, 04:02 PM   #116
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This is like a third word country.
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Old 03-02-2009, 04:11 PM   #117
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Old 03-03-2009, 12:03 PM   #118
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Last year I was down by Yuma and walked across the border into a small town, San Luis, I believe. Loaded with dentists and farmacia.

Walked around, then waited on line to get out at US border.

Everyone on line had either bags of scripts or had gone to the dentist and was waved through US customs. When asked what I did in Mexico, I told the agent I was just looking around, well he gave me the business. He couldn't believe I would go there to look around, he looked me over, didn't know what to do, looked at his buddies, but saw I was carrying nothing, finally let me cross back, with a grunt. What I learned was that some middle aged yanks go over and act as mules going back, carrying drugs in all sorts of weird places to make a few grand for the trip.

Weird world
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Old 03-04-2009, 02:17 PM   #119
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Don't Be Concerned About This, You can Drive Really Fast On Your Way Through

Mexico troops move in to retake warring border city | U.S. | Reuters

Now children, Mommie wants you to roll up the windows and lock the doors! And maybe you should stay down on the floor too!
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Old 03-04-2009, 11:06 PM   #120
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Last year I was down by Yuma and walked across the border into a small town, San Luis, I believe. Loaded with dentists and farmacia.

Walked around, then waited on line to get out at US border.

Everyone on line had either bags of scripts or had gone to the dentist and was waved through US customs. When asked what I did in Mexico, I told the agent I was just looking around, well he gave me the business. He couldn't believe I would go there to look around, he looked me over, didn't know what to do, looked at his buddies, but saw I was carrying nothing, finally let me cross back, with a grunt. What I learned was that some middle aged yanks go over and act as mules going back, carrying drugs in all sorts of weird places to make a few grand for the trip.

Weird world
jug
That is very weird. A bunch of drugs in hand = wave through. Nothing in hand = drug mule. Hm...if I were a drug mule with two brain cell to rub together, I'd carry a bunch of boring drugs on top and a crap load of oxycontin on the bottom to satisfy even the most voracious oxy-consuming radio host.
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