PenFed changed the Chip on their Credit Card!

[audreyh1]

PenFed mailed us new PenFed Cash Rewards VISA cards, as the current ones expire next month.

There is a big change with the chip. The old one is larger, and has eight contacts. This new card has a smaller chip, and it only has six contacts.

Does anyone know whether PenFed cards still have the embedded PIN? Or has something changed? I can't find any recent discussions on the web.

Anyone have a recent issue PenFed credit card that they have successfully used with the PIN in Europe?

OK - added a photo showing the two cards:

[braumeister]

I'll be over there next week and looking forward to trying it. Will report.

[audreyh1]

Well, DH thinks that two of the chip contacts at the bottom are auxiliary contacts and are not used.

[audreyh1]

Quote:

Originally Posted by braumeister I'll be over there next week and looking forward to trying it. Will report.

Does your PenFed card chip have 6 contacts (3 on each side) or 8 (4 on each side)?

I added a photo to my original post. So you can compare your card.

[audreyh1]

Our original card was issued in 2014 before most US banks were issuing EMV cards, so maybe it's just a throwback, LOL!

But I would like to know the embedded PIN status. Credit union and bank CSRs are notorious about not knowing that level of technology. There was a website where you could look it up. Maybe I can track that down.

OK - I tracked one site down. It gives the "CVM list" for the PenFed cards, not that I understand the CVM list. It says this about the PenFed credit cards. It looks like my particular card is not currently listed as it's not currently offered - http://www.spotterswiki.com/emv/card...e%5B%5D=credit
CVM List
1: Signature (paper)
2: No CVM required
3: Plaintext PIN verified by ICC

EMV database site: http://www.spotterswiki.com/emv/index.php

[braumeister]

Quote:

Originally Posted by audreyh1 Does your PenFed card chip have 6 contacts (3 on each side) or 8 (4 on each side)? I added a photo to my original post. So you can compare your card.

It's the newer one (6 contacts). Just got it recently.

[audreyh1]

The CVM list is the Cardholder Verification Method list, and it gives the order in which the machine tries to verify the cardholder. So:

CVM List

1. Signature (paper) - signature if available. This is what makes the PenFed card signature priority
2. No CVM required - This is for low-dollar transactions, at merchants in low-risk categories
3. Plaintext PIN verified by ICC - a.k.a "Offline Plaintext PIN" this confirms embedded PIN, and it is verified by the Integrated Circuit Card (ICC).

Cardholder Verification Method (CVM):

Quote:

In the context of a transaction, the method used to authenticate that the person presenting the card is the valid cardholder. EMV supports four CVMs: offline PIN (offline enciphered & plain text), online PIN, signature verification and no CVM. All CVMs can be available on all payment types (credit, debit and prepaid) as defined by the issuer. The merchant chooses which CVMs they will support. The issuer sets a prioritized list of methods on the chip for verification of the cardholder.

Plaintext PIN Also known as: • Offline Plaintext PIN

Quote:

Offline PIN processing in which the PIN entered by the cardholder is sent unencrypted, in plaintext, from the PIN pad to the chip card for verification.

Having an offline PIN is handy, because it doesn't require a kiosk to be connected to the VISA network to verify your PIN. It does it by talking to the card. An Online PIN has to be electronically sent to and validated by the card issuer. Some chip cards with PIN issued in the US require this method. Those are the kind you can call in to change your PIN.

References:
https://www.firstdata.com/downloads/.../EMV-A-toZ.pdf
https://www.quora.com/Step-by-step-H...d-payment-work
http://tsys.com/Assets/TSYS/download...ion-method.pdf

OK - is everyone up to speed now!?!?

[audreyh1]

So, the CVM list is the order of the methods by which the card will try to verify the cardholder.

Hmmm - based on the EMV CVM database, I think my Bank of America Travel Rewards VISA will indeed work with a PIN, and not just for cash advances. I did get prompted in a kiosk once, and I may try it again using my cash advance PIN.
1: Signature (paper)
2: No CVM required
3: Enciphered PIN verified online

Conversely, the Chase cards have nothing to do with any PIN:
1: Signature (paper)
2: No CVM required

The Andrews credit card CVM list is exactly the same as the PenFed cards
1: Signature (paper)
2: No CVM required
3: Plaintext PIN verified by ICC

The Barclaycard Arrival and Arrival Plus Mastercards have the longest CVM list.
1: Signature (paper)
2: Enciphered PIN verified online
3: Enciphered PIN verified by ICC
4: Plaintext PIN verified by ICC
5: No CVM required
So this one tries to verify the PIN online before going offline.

USAA has exactly the same list for their VISA cards:
1: Signature (paper)
2: Enciphered PIN verified online
3: Enciphered PIN verified by ICC
4: Plaintext PIN verified by ICC
5: No CVM required

The Fidelity VISA Gold Check Debit Card issued by PNC bank:
1: Signature (paper)
2: Enciphered PIN verified online
3: No CVM required
This is interesting, because for me that card defaulted to "No CVM required" at all the French SNCF ticket kiosks I used around France, but I did get prompted for my PIN at the Schiphol (Amsterdam Airport) NS train/metro ticket machine.

The Charles Schwab Bank VISA Platinum Debit Card
1: Signature (paper)
2: Enciphered PIN verified online
3: No CVM required
So - this uses exactly the same list order as the Fidelity Debit VISA

This are all from looking up various card issuers in the EMV CVM database site: http://www.spotterswiki.com/emv/index.php

[braumeister]

I intend to use several cards in Europe next week.
Partly just because I need to, but also I want to test various cards in different places to see if I can spot those that are friendlier to chip & PIN transactions.

In past trips I've found that chip & PIN is uncommon for US-issued cards, but occasionally possible. Hopefully that is changing. Fingers crossed.