Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 08-09-2009, 02:54 PM   #161
Moderator Emeritus
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,929
Quote:
Originally Posted by M Paquette View Post
Anyway, the application for individual/family coverage with a high deductible and HSA was just one branch in a decision tree. I've got lots of options left.

In this case, DD now has the HSA plan, so her rates drop. DW and I continue on COBRA on into 2011, and can try again for a HSA plan, falling back to 'conversion' to a HIPAA plan with no medical review (a bit more than COBRA, but with DD on the HSA, we are still in budget).
Just a quick followup.

DD is now on the HSA plan, at 1,488/year (including a minimal dental option)

We are moving onto a COBRA extension, where we continue on our group medical coverage, paying the full cost, plus a 10% administrative fee. That costs 8,742/year for DW and I.

We are also paying for another daughter away at college, outside our HMO coverage area, at 1,788/year.

That puts our current annual rate at 11,748/year.

In about a year and a half, we go off COBRA and onto a HIPAA continuation plan that covers pre-existing conditions like being over 55. That one will cost DW and I 21,600/year. (This is essentially an unsubsidized version of the high risk pool, with better lifetime maximums and overall coverage.)

With any luck the college student will graduate and get a job with coverage, so our annual insurance cost will only be 23,088/year.
__________________

__________________
M Paquette is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 08-09-2009, 03:07 PM   #162
Moderator Emeritus
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,929
Quote:
Originally Posted by samclem View Post
I think this is unconstitutional as well as impractical. Is there some reason that this particular industry should not be allowed free speech?
Buckley v. Valeo found that shoveling piles of cash at politicians (purely in support of the election of candidates, of course) was protected free speech.

Sadly, the auctioning of votes to the highest bidder is a privilege reserved to our distinguished politicians.
__________________

__________________
M Paquette is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2009, 03:12 PM   #163
Moderator
ziggy29's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Texas
Posts: 15,613
Quote:
Originally Posted by M Paquette View Post
Buckley v. Valeo found that shoveling piles of cash at politicians (purely in support of the election of candidates, of course) was protected free speech.
I believe the decision was a correct one. Having said that, I don't know that the framers of the Constitution could foresee just how much "money = speech" would buy influence elections a couple centuries hence.

I believe campaign finance reform such as McCain-Feingold is unconstitutional for that reason, though I wouldn't mind seeing a Constitutional amendment placing some restrictions on lobbying and "money as free speech" (depending on the details). I don't think elections being bought and paid for by well-heeled special interests is in the best interests of the people. For sure I think the health care debate is one of those where the big-time moneyed interests can thwart the will of the people.

There are plenty of other examples in other issues, too, whether it be trial lawyers, unions, drugmakers, insurance companies, big business or others.
__________________
"Hey, for every ten dollars, that's another hour that I have to be in the work place. That's an hour of my life. And my life is a very finite thing. I have only 'x' number of hours left before I'm dead. So how do I want to use these hours of my life? Do I want to use them just spending it on more crap and more stuff, or do I want to start getting a handle on it and using my life more intelligently?" -- Joe Dominguez (1938 - 1997)

RIP to Reemy, my avatar dog (2003 - 9/16/2017)
ziggy29 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2009, 04:29 PM   #164
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
youbet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Chicago
Posts: 9,965
Quote:
Originally Posted by ziggy29 View Post
I don't think elections being bought and paid for by well-heeled special interests is in the best interests of the people.
How about the reverse? Say a candidate promises a special interest group that controls significant votes that he'll spend lots of public money on their focused situation if they vote for him/her? Perhaps promising a large union that he'll bail out their employer and help them keep high paying jobs if they vote for him and work hard to get him elected? The money flows from the taxpayers to the public domain to the special interest group. Is that direction of money flow OK?

We have a lot of that here in Illinois. But I guess everyone knows that.........
__________________
"I wasn't born blue blood. I was born blue-collar." John Wort Hannam
youbet is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2009, 05:54 PM   #165
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: E. Wash
Posts: 1,060
[quote=M Paquette;843492]Just a quick followup.

We are also paying for another daughter away at college, outside our HMO coverage area, at 1,788/year.
quote]
MP
You have probably checked on this but I found I could cover my college kid's health risk by buying the policy issued through the University. It is my understanding that most schools offer their students coverage programs at what are pretty attractive rates. It is several years ago but I think a 12 month policy was around $700 for the year. It did require the full amount to paid up front.
Nwsteve
__________________
nwsteve is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2009, 06:02 PM   #166
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 160
Quote:
so our annual insurance cost will only be 23,088/year.
So, is the new "Health Plan" going to require people buy private insurance like this? This is insanely expensive, unless you have very expensive chronic health problems. I got some quotes for private insurance a few months ago, and nothing was this expensive.
__________________
quietman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2009, 06:56 PM   #167
Moderator Emeritus
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,929
[QUOTE=nwsteve;843549]
Quote:
Originally Posted by M Paquette View Post
Just a quick followup.

We are also paying for another daughter away at college, outside our HMO coverage area, at 1,788/year.
quote]
MP
You have probably checked on this but I found I could cover my college kid's health risk by buying the policy issued through the University. It is my understanding that most schools offer their students coverage programs at what are pretty attractive rates. It is several years ago but I think a 12 month policy was around $700 for the year. It did require the full amount to paid up front.
That's what we are using. There are three tiers to the coverage, with the better (higher priced) tiers offering lower copays and better percentage coverage. For example, the base level in-network benefit covers 50% of hospital costs, and a maximum policy benefit (lifetime) of $2,500.

That's not so good. For a bit more, the lifetime max goes up to $100,000, and for a little bit more the in-network benefit goes up to 90% coverage and a $250,000 lifetime.

The devil is in the details on these things. The base policy would be totally exhausted on one trip to the ER.
__________________
M Paquette is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2009, 07:19 PM   #168
Moderator Emeritus
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,929
Quote:
Originally Posted by quietman View Post
So, is the new "Health Plan" going to require people buy private insurance like this? This is insanely expensive, unless you have very expensive chronic health problems. I got some quotes for private insurance a few months ago, and nothing was this expensive.
Well, there are at least five versions of healthcare bills rolling around now. The more recent ones seem to favor no government insurance competition, and the nearest thing to that would be health care co-ops. The idea that all persons must have health care coverage of some form still seems to be going strong, but they'll likely have to buy coverage from an insurer. This appears to be acceptable to insurers. ("You yielded in the past. You shall do so again.")

That rate is expensive because the HIPAA continuation plan allows pre-existing conditions, and is not subsidized. It's similar to the state-subsidized high risk pools, but with a better lifetime cap and coverage terms. If I had qualified for a high deductible plan with HSA, I would have gone that route, costing me $5340/year.

Entry conditions are pretty strict. I have to have had 18 months of continuous coverage without breaks, last insurance under a group plan, not eligible for another group plan, group coverage not terminated due to non-payment or fraud, not eligible for Medicare/Medicaid, and purchased and exhausted COBRA or similar temporary continuation coverage.

HIPAA does not limit the premiums individual healthcare plans can charge. If qualified, an application won't be rejected, but you will pay. Shopping for different plans with significant rate savings involves investigating different state limits, and being willing to relocate to obtain the desired benefits and rates.
__________________
M Paquette is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2009, 09:39 PM   #169
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Northern IL
Posts: 18,293
Quote:
Originally Posted by youbet View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by ziggy29 View Post
I don't think elections being bought and paid for by well-heeled special interests is in the best interests of the people.
How about the reverse? Say a candidate promises a special interest group that controls significant votes that he'll spend lots of public money on their focused situation if they vote for him/her?
Yep. I hate abuse by lobbyists as much as the next guy, but consider something - If the "rich" represent only a few % of the total population, their vote does not count for much. So how do they get representation? They buy it (lobbyists being one way).

I'm not defending it, just saying that it is a reality.

And when Congress has set it up such that ~ 50% of the wage earners pay no/little Federal Income Tax, we shouldn't be surprised by it.

-ERD50
__________________
ERD50 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2009, 10:04 PM   #170
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 160
Quote:
The idea that all persons must have health care coverage of some form still seems to be going strong, but they'll likely have to buy coverage from an insurer. This appears to be acceptable to insurers.
No surprise at that. Once we are REQUIRED to buy it, I can easily imagine that plans will be getting more expensive.
__________________
quietman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2009, 10:32 PM   #171
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Northern IL
Posts: 18,293
Quote:
Originally Posted by quietman View Post
No surprise at that. Once we are REQUIRED to buy it, I can easily imagine that plans will be getting more expensive.
Yes, but in theory at least, we are paying for a lot of this in our taxes and through adjustments in billing (hospitals charge extra to 'make up' for those who do/cannot pay).

And if ins cos are required to take all, they don't need to spend money on screening out your risk. I don't know if that is big bucks in %, but it's something.

My fear is the reality will not be anywhere close to the theory. I don't trust tnat Congreess is cablale of dealing with this. I don't even think Congress is the right place to be dealing with this (at least not at the level of detail that they seem to be trying).

I am not alone. I'm not even in the minority:

Congressional Approval Hits Record-Low 14%

whoops, old data (2008, not 2009), still looking bad though:

http://www.gallup.com/poll/118318/Ap...ns-Steady.aspx

edit/add: even if we are required to buy ins, *if* there is competition for our $, that should help control costs.

-ERD50
__________________
ERD50 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2009, 06:09 AM   #172
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 11,615
Quote:
Originally Posted by quietman View Post
No surprise at that. Once we are REQUIRED to buy it, I can easily imagine that plans will be getting more expensive.
I'm not sure. We're all required to buy food and it is cheap. All drivers are required to buy insurance, and we have a healthy, competitive marketplace. We don't have a healthy, efficient marketplace now for health insurance because the folks using the insurance (the patients) are not the ones buying it (employers). And, even in the individual insurance market, pricing and content information is very hard to get (differs by health status, complexities in coverage, legalese in the contracts, satisfaction of customers with various insurers and policy types, etc). The best use of government power is to institute changes that make this market more efficient, this would drive down costs of both medical care and insurance.
__________________

__________________
"Freedom begins when you tell Mrs. Grundy to go fly a kite." - R. Heinlein
samclem is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
cobra, hipaa


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Universal health care - best I've seen Rich_by_the_Bay Health and Early Retirement 21 12-13-2007 11:38 AM
New Health Care Proposal -- If it happens what does it mean? chinaco FIRE and Money 9 06-11-2007 04:04 PM
health insurance and effect on increased health care costs Martha Other topics 9 08-08-2006 02:54 PM
Health Care in Retirement Sammy FIRE and Money 9 11-13-2005 09:18 PM
Health Care Lovecraft Young Dreamers 3 02-20-2004 09:28 PM

 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 12:18 PM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.