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01-18-2009, 07:14 AM
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#1
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 5,072
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Not in My Backyard
The greenies want renewable energy. But they have difficulties with conflicting goals.
They don't want the infrastructure in their backyard or in open lands.
Which is worse? Dependence on foreign oil, pollution, greenhouse gases or the new infrastructure to harvest natural energy?
However, the Power Company seems to be up to a little subterfuge... say one thing to get what they want then do something different. They wouldn't lie would they?
Power Struggle . NOW on PBS
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01-18-2009, 07:24 AM
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#2
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 6,506
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chinaco
The greenies want renewable energy. But they have difficulties with conflicting goals.
They don't want the infrastructure in their backyard or in open lands.
Which is worse? Dependence on foreign oil, pollution, greenhouse gases or the new infrastructure to harvest natural energy?
However, the Power Company seems to be up to a little subterfuge... say one thing to get what they want then do something different. They wouldn't lie would they?
Power Struggle . NOW on PBS
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Start building those windmills off Nantucket.
__________________
There must be moderation in everything, including moderation.
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01-18-2009, 10:47 AM
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#3
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Administrator
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 23,038
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chinaco
The greenies want renewable energy. But they have difficulties with conflicting goals.
They don't want the infrastructure in their backyard or in open lands.
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Painting with a bit of a broad brush there, aren't you? I would consider myself an environmentalist and a proponent of renewable energy, but I support nuclear power and wouldn't mind if they put a wind farm in Long Island Sound (which I view from my house).
I do agree that NIMBY'ism, and its more virulent form BANANA (build absolutely nothing anywhere near anything) is a real problem. We as a society are simply going to have to start making realistic choices about what we want (and start properly evaluating the risk associated with each option).
__________________
Living an analog life in the Digital Age.
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01-18-2009, 11:45 AM
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#4
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Northern IL
Posts: 26,889
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gumby
Painting with a bit of a broad brush there, aren't you? I would consider myself an environmentalist and a proponent of renewable energy, ...
We as a society are simply going to have to start making realistic choices about what we want (and start properly evaluating the risk associated with each option).
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Does anyone know - is there a term for the kind of "greenies" that I believe Chinaco was referring to? I guess I'd call them hypocrites, but there must be some kind of specific "green hypocrite" or "green clueless" ( for the people who think hydrogen is a readily available, pollution free energy source, or that electric cars are zero-pollution) term in use.
I agree "Greenie" is probably too broad a brush, but I think I know what he means.
-ERD50
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01-18-2009, 12:40 PM
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#5
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: North Oregon Coast
Posts: 16,483
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I think there are ways to address NIMBYism. If there's a pressing enough need for more power plants, communities can be bribed persuaded to accept a plant in several different ways. Whether through "profit sharing" checks for locals, reduced cost power or just the lure of more jobs, there are ways to "buy" community support.
But in reality, I think NIMBYism tends to wane when the economy is in the dumps. Anything that's likely to produce hundreds of new jobs in a region is likely to be much more popular now than when almost everyone who wants a decent job has one.
__________________
"Hey, for every ten dollars, that's another hour that I have to be in the work place. That's an hour of my life. And my life is a very finite thing. I have only 'x' number of hours left before I'm dead. So how do I want to use these hours of my life? Do I want to use them just spending it on more crap and more stuff, or do I want to start getting a handle on it and using my life more intelligently?" -- Joe Dominguez (1938 - 1997)
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01-18-2009, 12:54 PM
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#6
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 14,328
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Blatantly political and not related to FIRE.
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01-18-2009, 12:59 PM
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#7
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Administrator
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: N. Yorkshire
Posts: 34,126
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ERD50
Does anyone know - is there a term for the kind of "greenies" that I believe Chinaco was referring to? I guess I'd call them hypocrites, but there must be some kind of specific "green hypocrite" or "green clueless" ( for the people who think hydrogen is a readily available, pollution free energy source, or that electric cars are zero-pollution) term in use.
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Hypogreenies?
__________________
Retired in Jan, 2010 at 55, moved to England in May 2016
Enough private pension and SS income to cover all needs
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01-18-2009, 01:03 PM
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#8
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Full time employment: Posting here.
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 622
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We need nuclear powered retirement!
And we need it now!
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01-18-2009, 01:04 PM
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#9
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: North Oregon Coast
Posts: 16,483
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frugality_of_Apathy
We need nuclear powered retirement!
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Anyone who spent 20 years on a Navy submarine might already have it...
__________________
"Hey, for every ten dollars, that's another hour that I have to be in the work place. That's an hour of my life. And my life is a very finite thing. I have only 'x' number of hours left before I'm dead. So how do I want to use these hours of my life? Do I want to use them just spending it on more crap and more stuff, or do I want to start getting a handle on it and using my life more intelligently?" -- Joe Dominguez (1938 - 1997)
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01-18-2009, 01:46 PM
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#10
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,082
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How about just 'Hypocrits'?
After all, do you call a preacher that spends donation money on private jets a 'religious hypocrit' or just 'hypocrit'?
I consider myself a 'greenie' as well. However, I have no problem with them building wind generators in my view.
For those that do, I would suggest this; give them a choice. You can either have now power, wind farm, or a coal plant built in your back yard
__________________
"We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our children.
(Ancient Indian Proverb)"
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01-18-2009, 03:39 PM
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#11
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,433
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ERD50
Does anyone know - is there a term for the kind of "greenies" that I believe Chinaco was referring to?
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I believe they would be called "limousine greenies".
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01-18-2009, 09:55 PM
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#12
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Northern IL
Posts: 26,889
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You have a point. The OP should have mentioned the costs that could affect the retired folk.
This kind of negativism from pseudo-environmentalists could increase energy costs for us. And, if the govt decides to subsidize programs such that we spend $2 to save $1, that could affect us.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zathras
How about just 'Hypocrits'?
After all, do you call a preacher that spends donation money on private jets a 'religious hypocrit' or just 'hypocrit'?
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Good point - but I'm just looking for a catchy "buzz word".
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan
Hypogreenies?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FIRE'd@51
I believe they would be called "limousine greenies".
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Good ones - I really like "limousine greenies"
-ERD50
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01-18-2009, 11:27 PM
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#13
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Oahu
Posts: 26,860
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zathras
I consider myself a 'greenie' as well. However, I have no problem with them building wind generators in my view.
For those that do, I would suggest this; give them a choice. You can either have now power, wind farm, or a coal plant built in your back yard
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I live next to a sewage pumping station, and many's the time I've thought about putting 5-10 KW of photovoltaic panels on its big, flat, sunny, wide-open roof when nobody is looking.
My big obstacle has been figuring out how to disguise the power conduit coming over to our house...
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Co-author (with my daughter) of “Raising Your Money-Savvy Family For Next Generation Financial Independence.”
Author of the book written on E-R.org: "The Military Guide to Financial Independence and Retirement."
I don't spend much time here— please send a PM.
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01-19-2009, 07:21 AM
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#14
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,082
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Paint the conduit to look like a sewer pipe??
__________________
"We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our children.
(Ancient Indian Proverb)"
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01-27-2009, 10:51 PM
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#15
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 12,483
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A lot of our village is rural. One farmer I know had a nice high point on his land that was difficult to grow crops on. Verizon wanted to put a cell tower on it, and were willing to pay him $2500 a month for 99 years.
The zoning commission refused to grant a permit, even though Verizon agreed to disguise the cell tower by making it look like a silo with an American flag flying on top..........
__________________
Consult with your own advisor or representative. My thoughts should not be construed as investment advice. Past performance is no guarantee of future results (love that one).......:)
This Thread is USELESS without pics.........:)
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01-28-2009, 05:09 PM
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#16
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Leeward Oahu
Posts: 17,914
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ERD50
Does anyone know - is there a term for the kind of "greenies" that I believe Chinaco was referring to?
-ERD50
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Watermelons - Green on the outside. Red on the inside.
Sorry, can't take credit for this one. Got it from a neighbor. He (honestly) believes it's not about NIMBY or BANANA but about "destroying America" from the inside. Can't say I fully agree with him, but you have to wonder about folks who decry the use of oil, coal, and even nuclear but don't want "clean" energy either.
__________________
Ko'olau's Law -
Anything which can be used can be misused. Anything which can be misused will be.
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01-28-2009, 05:14 PM
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#17
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 12,880
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Quote:
My big obstacle has been figuring out how to disguise the power conduit coming over to our house...
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Cover it with sewage.
__________________
Al
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01-29-2009, 09:22 AM
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#18
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 12,483
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TromboneAl
Cover it with sewage.
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Cover it in canvas, and let the local art college students paint it to blend in with the surrounding flora.........
__________________
Consult with your own advisor or representative. My thoughts should not be construed as investment advice. Past performance is no guarantee of future results (love that one).......:)
This Thread is USELESS without pics.........:)
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02-12-2009, 03:10 PM
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#19
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 2,049
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ERD50
This kind of negativism from pseudo-environmentalists could increase energy costs for us. And, if the govt decides to subsidize programs such that we spend $2 to save $1, that could affect us.
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We've been subsidizing oil for a long, long, time. I have the oil depletion allowance on my 1040 to prove it.
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02-12-2009, 03:26 PM
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#20
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Northern IL
Posts: 26,889
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And just think, if we didn't subsidize oil, maybe we wouldn't need subsidies on alternative energy. Funny how the "answer" never involves removing anything, it is always to add another thing to counter-act it.
I've never come across clear numbers about the extent of oil industry subsidies (and I'd prefer to exclude military costs, unless they are directly and unquestionably related to oil, just to avoid that whole issue). Anyone got a good link?
-ERD50
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