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WA Legislature Opens New Class Warfare Front
04-02-2009, 01:47 PM
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#1
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hooverville
Posts: 22,983
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WA Legislature Opens New Class Warfare Front
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04-02-2009, 01:58 PM
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#2
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Full time employment: Posting here.
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 880
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Mustn't let a good crisis go to waste. Hit the upper class while the media has everyone whipped up over the AIG bonuses. Timing is everything....right?
Not to mention that the sales tax has just increased to 9.5% in WA.
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04-02-2009, 06:02 PM
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#3
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: W Wash
Posts: 1,644
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Wonder if other states are do devoid of leadership in their legistlative bodies? Wash's Dem driven agendas seems to not be able to connect that authorization on going programs without revenue sources generates deficits.
Interesting how little press is given to the fact that total spending in the State is still higher in the new "reduced" budget is still higher than the last biennium.
Somehow, our esteem legistlators do not understand that capital does not lay idle and those who are fortune enough to have excess are the ones who are most likely to deploy it in ways beyond simple consumer spending.
Nwsteve
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04-02-2009, 09:24 PM
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#4
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Recycles dryer sheets
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Newcastle, WA
Posts: 208
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Washington state has entrenched one-party government.
I'm grateful that, at least for now, Gov. Grimoire is making noises like she's opposing the income tax. We'll see how long that lasts; but I think she's savvy enough to get that an income tax = Republicans back in the majority in the legislature.
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- Jack Bogle
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04-02-2009, 10:29 PM
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#5
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: the City of Subdued Excitement
Posts: 5,588
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Proposing an income tax in the Soviet of Washington has been political suicide in the past. I dunno. Maybe the world has changed.
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I have outlived most of the people I don't like and I am working on the rest.
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04-02-2009, 10:34 PM
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#6
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: the City of Subdued Excitement
Posts: 5,588
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Say, ha,
Are you ready to move south of the border now?
What would it take? A Starbucks in Buenas Aires?
(I need an advance man to scope out the territory.)
your amigo,
El Gitano
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I have outlived most of the people I don't like and I am working on the rest.
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04-03-2009, 07:49 AM
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#7
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Lawn chair in Texas
Posts: 14,183
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed_The_Gypsy
Say, ha,
Are you ready to move south of the border now?
What would it take? A Starbucks in Buenas Aires?
(I need an advance man to scope out the territory.)
your amigo,
El Gitano
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And a waxing parlor...
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Have Funds, Will Retire
...not doing anything of true substance...
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04-03-2009, 07:55 AM
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#8
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 12,483
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HFWR
And a waxing parlor...
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And a car wash with girls in bikinis.........
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Consult with your own advisor or representative. My thoughts should not be construed as investment advice. Past performance is no guarantee of future results (love that one).......:)
This Thread is USELESS without pics.........:)
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04-03-2009, 08:09 AM
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#9
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 4,629
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Quote:
Originally Posted by haha
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I've never lived in Washington, so I'm missing all the nuances. But, the article seems to say that someone is making a proposal that makes the Washington tax system somewhat more "progressive". You call this "class warfare".
Are you saying that "progressive tax rates" = "class warfare"? Or are there special circumstances in Wasington that I'm missing?
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04-03-2009, 08:19 AM
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#10
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: North Oregon Coast
Posts: 16,483
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Independent
I've never lived in Washington, so I'm missing all the nuances. But, the article seems to say that someone is making a proposal that makes the Washington tax system somewhat more "progressive". You call this "class warfare".
Are you saying that "progressive tax rates" = "class warfare"? Or are there special circumstances in Wasington that I'm missing?
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I think the term "class warfare" is over used and sometimes incendiary, but in this case I think it might fit. There's little question in my mind that some of these political hacks are using current populist anger against the bailouts of what they perceive to be big-shot multi-millionaire bankers in order to further a punitive agenda against the very wealthy.
Even the governor, in Ms. Brown's own party, is opposed to it.
I don't believe pushing for further progression in the income tax is necessarily aimed at "punishing achievement" or anything like that, but in this case, I do think there's a conscious effort to seize on the current public mood to let 'em have it.
As for enacting a state income tax, every now and then someone suggests it here in Texas, but it's like suggesting Social Security and Medicare cuts at an AARP convention.
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"Hey, for every ten dollars, that's another hour that I have to be in the work place. That's an hour of my life. And my life is a very finite thing. I have only 'x' number of hours left before I'm dead. So how do I want to use these hours of my life? Do I want to use them just spending it on more crap and more stuff, or do I want to start getting a handle on it and using my life more intelligently?" -- Joe Dominguez (1938 - 1997)
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04-03-2009, 09:12 AM
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#11
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hooverville
Posts: 22,983
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Independent
Are you saying that "progressive tax rates" = "class warfare"? Or are there special circumstances in Wasington that I'm missing?
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What I am saying is very clear. This isn't any normal progressive tax, whatever the merits or demerits of those are.
This is a tax that almost anyone can be in favor of, because as it is being sold anyway, it could not possibly touch more than 1% of voters.
Some very high earning software people, some doctors and lawyers, some Amazon, Starbucks, Paccar execs, owners of successful car dealerships, real estate developers.
IMO the money is better off with these people than it would be in public hands. Many of the things I do every day are currently and were in the past funded by these highly productive local people. Who will do more for medical care in Africa, Bill Gates or Christine Gregoire?
Or, ask any Ferrari dealer how he sees it. I rather enjoy seeing Ferraris on the street, even though I know I will never have one.
Remember, Jesus said the poor will always be with us, and so far it looks like he was right, if for no other reason because what is "poor" will always be defined upward.
Ha
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"As a general rule, the more dangerous or inappropriate a conversation, the more interesting it is."-Scott Adams
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04-03-2009, 09:23 AM
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#12
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 4,629
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Quote:
Originally Posted by haha
What I am saying is very clear. This isn't any normal progressive tax, whatever the merits or demerits of those are.
This is a tax that almost anyone can be in favor of, because as it is being sold anyway, it could not possibly touch more than 1% of voters.
Some very high earning software people, some doctors and lawyers, some Amazon, Starbucks, Paccar execs, owners of successful car dealerships, real estate developers.
IMO the money is better off with these people than it would be in public hands. Many of the things I do every day are currently and were in the past funded by these highly productive local people. Who will do more for medical care in Africa, Bill Gates or Christine Gregoire?
Or, ask any Ferrari dealer how he sees it. I rather enjoy seeing Ferraris on the street, even though I know I will never have one.
Ha
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Okay. Assume Washington replaced some of its sales tax with an income tax, with progressive rates that go 1%, 2%, 3%. Further, assume that the 1% started early enough that most people at least paid that amount, but the 3% didn't kick in until $500lk. Then that wouldn't be "class warfare", correct?
I think Ziggy is saying that the real issue here is "Why would anybody support this?", rather than "What is the dollar effect?". I can kind of buy that.
Maybe I'd say that if the supporters intend it to be "punitive", then it's class warfare. If the supporters are simply looking for revenue, note that the Washington tax system is currently pretty flat, and figure it could be more progressive, then it's just "practical gov't financing".
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04-03-2009, 09:24 AM
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#13
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 7,968
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They have made some progress since I left in 1969 - my home district got a civil rights lawyer in the 60's and I heard they were forced to actually count Republican votes instead of just penciling in a number.
I sure things have gone downhill ever since. I'm positive 'The God's' voiced their displeasure at the turn of event's with Mt St. Helens.
Of course I was wearing a tinfoil hat when that thought occured.
heh heh heh - you don't even want to know what sneaky things Missouri is contemplating to shore up revenue.
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04-03-2009, 09:30 AM
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#14
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 2,049
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1% of 500,000 isn't going to cause Bill Gates to stop funding malaria work in Africa. The sky won't fall, really.
The real danger of a new tax is that, once it's started, it tends to get increased every year.
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04-03-2009, 09:32 AM
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#15
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: North Oregon Coast
Posts: 16,483
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eridanus
The real danger of a new tax is that, once it's started, it tends to get increased every year.
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That's exactly what we opponents to a state income tax in Texas say. The proponents of it can talk about it being "revenue neutral" all they want by cutting sales taxes and property taxes, but it's FAR easier to raise an existing tax than to enact a new one, so most of us think it best to prevent the new one from taking hold. It wouldn't be long before we'd have an income tax and sales taxes raised back to their old levels anyway...
__________________
"Hey, for every ten dollars, that's another hour that I have to be in the work place. That's an hour of my life. And my life is a very finite thing. I have only 'x' number of hours left before I'm dead. So how do I want to use these hours of my life? Do I want to use them just spending it on more crap and more stuff, or do I want to start getting a handle on it and using my life more intelligently?" -- Joe Dominguez (1938 - 1997)
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04-03-2009, 11:45 AM
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#16
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 4,764
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Never mind. I misread the amount taxed.
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04-03-2009, 11:49 AM
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#17
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 2,612
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eridanus
1% of 500,000 isn't going to cause Bill Gates to stop funding malaria work in Africa. The sky won't fall, really.
The real danger of a new tax is that, once it's started, it tends to get increased every year.
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The bigger danger is that in total, the 1% tax isn't even enough to fund one hour of government -- mostly because the cost of collecting it will be eaten up by administration costs, and more.
Bad idea, won't fly.
-- Rita
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04-03-2009, 11:55 AM
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#18
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Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 2,049
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The high paying jobs will move to California. Oh, wait. Maybe they'll move to New York? No, no. Portland? Hmm, Oregon's income tax is 5, 7, or 9%. New Hampshire? Nah, they have an interest and dividend tax. I think any tax escapees can move to Alaska, Nevada, Wyoming, or Singapore.
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04-03-2009, 12:02 PM
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#19
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 2,049
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gotadimple
The bigger danger is that in total, the 1% tax isn't even enough to fund one hour of government -- mostly because the cost of collecting it will be eaten up by administration costs, and more.
Bad idea, won't fly.
-- Rita
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Probably true since WA doesn't have an income tax currently. They'd have to set up a system, get a building, hire employees, etc. However, if they increase the % to 3% next year, and add another tier at 1%, and then do the same in 2011 and 2012, then we're talking real money.
To paraphrase Agent Smith, "Humans are like goldfish. They'll eat at the public trough until society collapses."
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04-03-2009, 05:59 PM
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#20
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: North of Montana
Posts: 2,769
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dog
Mustn't let a good crisis go to waste. Hit the upper class while the media has everyone whipped up over the AIG bonuses.
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Less than ten years ago, the socialist party (which tends to win power often) in my Canadian province suggested the way to end the deficit was to 'let the rich pay', through income taxes. When the party leader was asked 'who are the rich', the answer was "anyone making more than $50K".
Beware, more people become 'rich' every year.
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