From technical to management position

[Aaron]

I’d like to get some career advice from the group.  I’m in a technical position, similar to a database analyst.  I really enjoy the technical parts of the job and solving the various problems that come up.  However, I’m pretty close to the top of the pay scale in my industry and can’t expect much more than standard cost of living increases. 

The next logical step would be into management, but then I would be doing almost nothing technical (which I really enjoy), and I’d just be managing people and projects and coordinating activities.
 
I’m definitely an introvert and not a natural born leader so I was just wondering what others have done in similar situations, especially since there are so many current and former engineers, programmers, and other tech people on the board.  Has anybody regretted going into management that was previously in a tech position?

I’m pretty sure I wouldn’t be as happy if I gave up doing the technical stuff, but I would very easily make 50 - 60% more if I was a manager, which is very hard to pass up. 

Aaron

 

[MasterBlaster]

The choice, Grasshopper, is up to you....


Well since only you can decide what makes you happy, then only you can decide what you want.

Upward is not always better, that is definitely true. The best job is the one that you like best.

But before you pass on a promotion ask yourself - How would I feel if they choose that lesser person over there to be your boss ?

 

[bow-tie]

Sounds like it's time for a serious gut-check on your part.  Do you think you can handle those things you do not like about mgmt?  Will the money compensate you enough for the BS you have to endure and the loss of the technical aspects you enjoyed?  Probably tough to answer but the more inflection involved, the better your chances you make an informed decision.

How much is that pay raise truly worth?  

 

[Bimmerbill]

I've been technical for close to 15 years. I like it very much. I find managing good people to be a pleasure. But managing problem employees is a giant PITA. And its always one or two people that ruins it, too!

There are still large salaries to be made in the technical side of the house. For now I am sticking to technical, but preparing myself for management.

That way, I have opitions.

 

[TromboneAl]

I was in the same position in about 1982. I went from programmer to director of software at a small educational software company.

I also was an INTJ, and liked programming a lot. The management job wasn't bad however. I enjoyed the challenges. I got to do programming as well, however, when we were shorthanded.

After a year or two I got layed off and became a consultant, so I don't know whether I would have gotten tired of managing after a while.

 

[SteveR]

The choice, Grasshopper, is up to you....


Well since only you can decide what makes you happy, then only you can decide what you want.

Upward is not always better, that is definitely true. The best job is the one that you like best.

But before you pass on a promotion ask yourself - How would I feel if they choose that lesser person over there to be your boss ?

Very good points to consider.
My career has included several technical positions many of which also included managment responsibilities. At some point you end up doing 90% management work and 10% technical work. In some jobs it happens sooner than later.

Being in management is not as easy as it appears. It is very challenging in many ways and can lead your career in a variety of directions you may not have previously considered. If I had chosen to remain as a lab rat laboratory technican I can honestly say I would not be any where near as FI as I am today. I would most likely have to work several years longer to be able to retire on a far smaller income stream.

Going into management in a technical area allowed me to use my technical (scientific) knowledge but in a different capacity. Sure it was not as much "fun" as being totally hands on but it allowed me to have a say in what actually happened in the technical areas. I was giving direction and not taking it.

Management is not for everyone as evidenced by the number of very bad managers around. Some see it as only a stepping stone (on the backs of their fellow workers) to a fatter paycheck or bigger bonus. They miss the other aspects of the job that can bring some level of job satisfaction. They also miss those areas that cause the greatest dissatisfaction and those ofter result in a very bitter and unhappy person who becomes only self directed and forgets about the greater good of the company and his employees.

What do you really want out of your career? How many years do you see doing what you are doing today and do you believe you will be happy doing it for that long. Consider what happens over time in your present job. How will you feel in 10 years when many of your coworkers are no longer there? You might end up being the "old man" of the department and your peers will all be much younger than you with very different interests. Where do you want to be financially in 10, 20 or 30 years from now? How do you plan on getting there in your present job? What happens when you top out in your job grade range? What other promotions would be likely?

The best advice I can give you is to think it though and talk to someone in managment in your area of technology and ask them questions about their job; the good and the bad. Then look inward and see if you want to do what it takes.

Good luck.

 

[Cut-Throat]

I’d like to get some career advice from the group. I’m in a technical position, similar to a database analyst. I really enjoy the technical parts of the job and solving the various problems that come up. However, I’m pretty close to the top of the pay scale in my industry and can’t expect much more than standard cost of living increases.

The next logical step would be into management, but then I would be doing almost nothing technical (which I really enjoy), and I’d just be managing people and projects and coordinating activities.

I’m definitely an introvert and not a natural born leader so I was just wondering what others have done in similar situations, especially since there are so many current and former engineers, programmers, and other tech people on the board. Has anybody regretted going into management that was previously in a tech position?

I’m pretty sure I wouldn’t be as happy if I gave up doing the technical stuff, but I would very easily make 50 - 60% more if I was a manager, which is very hard to pass up.

Aaron

Well, if you actually got 50-60% more it might be worth it. I did it for about 20% more and it totally sucked. In eight years i had lost my technical edge, was listening to complaining clients and employees all day and had just about zero job satisfaction. I went back to the technical group and was happy. But not as happy as I am now to be out of the rat race entirely. 8)

 

[ERD50]

Another option is to stay on the technical path, but get super-knowledgeable in a specific area that is important in your line of work. To the point that you are a recognized 'expert' and people come to you for your expertise.

That can put you in a valuable position, more so than the other tech guys that are just 'good' at their jobs. You might be able to swing a salary close to the management guys, but still be happy.

Just a thought. - ERD50

 

[vic]

I know the money part is very attractive (but would you make 50% more right away or maybe 10 years down the road?). It sound like you would not enjoy that type of job though. If you do not enjoy people and managing people be fair to them and do NOT become a manager. I have had more bad than good managers and they really put a huge mark on how you (do not) enjoy work. If I were a manager, I think I would go nuts with the performance reviews, meetings, slackers and planning vacation schedules and more of that type of stuff. Also, if you get laid off from the high paying manager job several years down the road - will you still have any technical skills left to land you a new job?
Vicky

 

[bearkeley]

Great posts all -- here's an HR perspective...

This is a big challenge for a lot of folks.   Your heart has to be into it when you do it, otherwise, you will fail (I've fired a number of techies who couldn't make it as a manager - sometimes because they weren't cut out for it, but mostly because they really were not fully bought into the idea).    

You don't have to be an extrovert to be a great manager.   Leadership abilities will definitely help, but did you know that this is a learned behavior at the executive level?  

Also, a lot of IT folks have a bad image of what management is like - I have seen a lot of strong techies who also became great managers.    However, if you're not ready to get into it now, be careful.   It's got to be right for you AT THE RIGHT TIME in your life - not just career.    Take the advice of others and find out more about the job / responsibilities if you haven't done so.    

50% - 60% more as a manager versus a techie?     I really find that hard to believe.  That may very well be true where you're working, but that is definitely not the case in the rest of the world.    You could have the potential to make that much more over time (ie., once you become a CTO, etc) but definitely not as a Manager, or even a Director for most organizations.    

If you like what you're doing now, think about moving to a larger organization where you can specialize in a specific technology (ie., engineer route with a focus on sql, etc).   You can also look into poject management type of responsibilities.   You will defnitely be technical in this role too.

If money is truly important to you, consider being a consultant -- not as stable, but since you're on this site, the flexibility to work part of the year and still get paid a lot a few years from now might be of interest...good luck!

Good luck!

 

[Aaron]

Thanks guys, I appreciate the responses.  I’m 30, and still one of the younger ones in my group of lab rats, so I have some time before I’m considered the “old guy” but I definitely want to avoid getting into that position.  I always like to know my next step and what direction and I’m heading.

There are definitely a few more things I could learn and probably pick up some certifications and additional training to specialize a bit more.  There’s even an intermediate position between lab rat and manager that I might be more suited for – kind of a project manager/coordinator type position.  I’ll try and look into that position more. 

I advanced pretty quickly when I first started out so I think I’m just getting impatient and expected to keep moving at the same pace.  I never considered talking with other managers to see what it’s really like, so I’ll definitely have to explore that idea. 

 

[Cut-Throat]

Great posts all -- here's an HR perspective...

This is a big challenge for a lot of folks. Your heart has to be into it when you do it, otherwise, you will fail (I've fired a number of techies who couldn't make it as a manager - sometimes because they weren't cut out for it, but mostly because they really were not fully bought into the idea).

oooh! - You've fired the techies? - You mean you did upper Management's dirty work for them. - I've never worked at a company where HR made hiring and firing decisions of Technical Management.

 

[Scrooge]

There’s even an intermediate position between lab rat and manager that I might be more suited for – kind of a project manager/coordinator type position.  I’ll try and look into that position more.

That's pretty much what happened to me when I was 29-32. I found myself doing my usual technical stuff 80-90% of the time while semi-supervising one other employee at a time.

In my case, I found it to be not worth it. Of the three employees that I "serially managed", one was talented but a total jerk (to use a technical term), one was a nice and hard working guy who was unable to overcome his background and (what passed for) education, and the third one was a pleasure to work with.

I figured that one out of three was a poor batting average and went back to being a full time techie. Perhaps I gave up too soon, but oh well...

 

[PsyopRanger]

I think you also have to ask yourself if you truly like managing people versus working on your own. When you are a manager, you are held responsible for your group.

Do you like helping people with their problems?
Would you mind being emailed or called 10-20 times per day asking questions?

IMHO, managers that do it for the money are not very effective and the team can see it. It turns sour sometimes and people won’t respect the manager or work well for the person. If however you enjoy helping people grow, teaching them, listening to peoples personal problems and offering honest advice, then go for it.

I have had many leadership/management positions in the past 10 years and some have been life changing while others I want to forget. You learn from each experience though and bring it with to the next one.

A great book I read 7 years ago is “The 21 Irrefutable Laws of Leadership” by John C. Maxwell. It explains in detail why some managers fail and others are great and what you can do to move towards the great side.

Lance

 

[brewer12345]

I think Lance has a very good point: make sure you want to manage people.

I always viewed getting promoted to management as a pie-eating contest where the prize is more pie. Now I am getting hints from my employer that tehy would like me to become more of a teacher and manager. I am technically proficient at my job, but I've no idea how to manage people. Never found it interesting or attractive, and have no idea how to do it. Guess I will have to learn enough to fake my way through it.

 

[Rich_by_the_Bay]

Aaron,

I'm senior in my career, and got increasingly into management by outlasting my enemies , actually by having a fairly level head and learning how to think in organization-mode. I now spend my time about 50:50 between management and other front-end activities.

Couple of things:

1. Management skills can be learned by receptive individuals. At your age, I would definitely look for good inservice or degree-based training. Everything from conflict resolution to motivating team work to negotiating skills will help. Even things which may make you cringe at first (like role-playing drills) will help.

If you find yourself starting to find it interesting and challenging, you might enjoy the career shift. I think it was Harry Truman who said, "it's amazing how much you can get done if you don't care who gets the credit." That's how you have to look at management -- getting stuff done through others

2. You need the ability to not personalize things. Most people project personal motivation and intent on management decisions. If it gets to you too personally, you will be less happy. A level head, a bit of concerned detachment are really good assets to have.

It's not for everyone, and everyone likes to blame management for everything, but in the right hands with the right training, personality and experience it can be challenging and rewarding.

Hope this helps.

 

[SteveR]

I agree with Rich's comments and his list.

Management positions are not for everyone. You get crap from employees who second guess each decision you make and your own management who will always want it yesterday with as few people as possible and with no expenses.

The 80-20 rule applies. 80% of your problems will always come from 20% of your people. The 20% can be reshuffled but somehow new employees seem to fall into groups that closely fit the previous ones and the rule holds true. If you are unlucky enough to work in a very hostile environment in a very mismanaged company expect the rule to be different; everyone will be a source of problems.

The other part of the 80-20 rule is that 80 percent of the problems with the business are caused by mismanagement of the business by management.

Being a middle manager is a very tough way to make a living especially if you care about people and about the company. Your management and some of your people will make it very hard for you to do your job the way it should and could be done.

 

[maddythebeagle]

Wow, in my organization right now, being a middle manager looks to be the worst job...upper management or being a field engineer looks like the place to be...

 

[Bimmerbill]

Doesn't middle management bear the brunt of layoffs a lot of the time?

 

[SteveR]

Doesn't middle management bear the brunt of layoffs a lot of the time?

Middle mgt. seems to be hit more by upper management restructuring and "right sizing" of individual organizations. Layoffs, at least in the places I have worked, were usually at the worker-bee levels mostly but did sometimes include project staff too.

Upper management has been "flattening" the organizational struture in many companies for years. This creates fewer and fewer jobs for middle managers while stretching the organization very thin with respect to empoyee to supervisor ratios. I know several companies where there are over a hundred people reporting to a single supervisor on a manufacturing line. That is just too many people for one person to supervise. One of the aspects of organizational flattening is the thining of the reserve bench for likely candidate supervisors and managers. That requires a less exerienced person fill an open position or to hire someone from outside the company at great cost. Anyway, there is lots more to this iceburg but I will stop here for now.

 

[bearkeley]

oooh! - You've fired the techies? - You mean you did upper Management's dirty work for them. - I've never worked at a company where HR made hiring and firing decisions of Technical Management.

Well, actually, Officially:

HR Professionals: "Partner and provide professional guidance to Managers".

HR Professionals also sit-in during termination discussions 'to protect the employees rights, blah blah blah.

In reallity, however, here's what happens:

Day 1 - Manager loves employee

Day 2 - Manager gets pissed off at employee and decides to fire the person.

Afternoon of day 2 - HR says no way, you don't have enough documentation.

Next several weeks, sometimes months: Manager wants to fire, and HR makes them write reasons and specifics on how the employee 'failed to meet expectations' and 'consequences should the behavior continue'. (HR loves red tape and is sometimes dubbed as the employee nazi because of this)

100 years later -HR has enough documentation; Manager sets up a meeting where he can finally release the anger, frustration, power he has over his lazy good for nothing employee.

And then, after all that, at the termination meeting, where the HR professional sits next to the employee, the manager across the desk, the manager has his opportunity to FIRE the techie he's been trying to get rid of for years...he's practice what to say, over and over, and whe he opens his mouth, he freezes. He realizes that firing a person isn't the same as sunsetting, migrating, upgrading technologies...that's when, behind closed doors, the employee nazi steps up, takes the proverbial axe and strikes!

 

[Craig]

Aaron, I switched from technical financial work (tax / audit), to management. Glad I did, worked for me and my family.

The fact that you are exploring this option leads me to believe you should at least give it a try. You can go back, one way or another, as long as you keep your tech skills up reasonably well in the interim.

Oddly enough, it is easier to find good technical people than it is to find good managers. As noted above, you can refine management skills, and they can provide you with more options in your career ... different size companies, new industries, etc. ... even an opportunity someday to have your own business. After all, when you become part of management, you are looking at a much broader cross section of a company.

It can be aggravating, but it can also be very satisfying. Listen to your gut, but don't pass it up for the wrong reasons. Again ... this is not a light switch ... you can go back to the techie focus within a reasonable period of time, if you decide management just isn't your bag. And, sharp employers see this from time to time, and aren't surprised ... I've had guys / gals come to me for positions "lower" than their resume. They got burned out, and just don't want the brain damage anymore ... just wanted a good, basic tech / staff job, where they could keep their head down, do the work, participate on a team, have a steady paycheck, and ride off into the sunset. Cool with me. You'll have options. And, with some management time under your belt, you'll be an even better technical person.

Best of luck with your decision, and your career.

 

[riskadverse]

I went through the transition from technical to management in one of my early careers.  While I was good at both, the stress on me was far greater as a manager.  In later careers, I made a determined effort to resist jumping into management beginning with the hiring interview.  While the money may not have been as good, it is surprising how much a good "old" technical person can get paid (often more than his new managers).  I never regretted my decisions (opportunities were offered every few years). 
My wife was pretty much forced into the opposite route (manage or risk lack of employment).   While she excelled in new job, the toll it took on her was enormous . . . which made her ER much sweeter than mine.  Luckly she didn't make the transition till the last 8 years of her career.  Without ER as a carrot, I don't think she could have made the last 4 years.       

 

[chrisdut]

Aaron,
I think all the good advice has already been given.  That being said, I am a civil engineer who became a partner in the consulting firm where I work at the relatively young age of 30 (same as you).  Looking back over the last seven years, I can honestly say I was not quite ready to become an owner.  My technical and client relation abilities were adequate; however, my interpersonal skills with other employees needed work.  As an engineer, when an employee came to me with a problem with another employee, I would try to solve the problem.  Now I know that sometimes the employee just wants you to "listen empathetically" (which I still sometimes struggle with).  Financially, it has been a no-brainer.  I now hope to retire at age 52 (instead of my late 50s or early 60s).  All things considered, I do not regret "getting into management", but it is a personal choice.  My best advice is to follow your gut instinct.    

 

[wabmester]

my interpersonal skills with other employees needed work.   

I've never had any interpersonal skills, but I always found myself booted into management gigs even when I strongly resisted.   (I had a boss once who offered me a management gig, and when I told him "no, thanks," he told me to start the next day.   He was a damn good manager, too.)

IMHO, interpersonal skills are optional for a technical manager unless you have a really large org to manage.   Even in the case of the large org, I found that I could hire other managers who had better interpersonal skills than I did, and I would let them deal with the motivational and conflict resolution crap.