Have you ever heard of the "infinite banking" concept?

[markf57]

Several months ago I can across a thread on another board asking about the infinite banking concept. I did a little googleing and it looked convoluted to me. Looks like a way to sell insurance, but it really wasn't clear.

Anyway, some company is doing local seminars this week and it looks like it might be about this "concept".

Anyone have any words of wisdom? Run, run fast??

Thanks,

Mark

 

[SecondCor521]

Don't invest in anything you don't understand.

2Cor521

 

[markf57]

Don't invest in anything you don't understand.

2Cor521

I agree 100%. That gives me 3 options. Don't learn and don't invest, learn about it and don't invest, or learn about it and invest.

I'm hoping this group can help me with the last 2 now.

Thanks,

Mark

 

[brewer12345]

Insurance, seminars, "concept"...

That's all I need to hear to tell you to stay the fcuk away from it.

 

[d]

just a way to sell insurance ... if you want to save money, the easiest way is to save it, not to give it to an insurance company

 

[Goonie]

.....Looks like a way to sell insurance, but it really wasn't clear.

Looks like insurance to me.

A quote from "The Infinite Banking Cocept" website ( http://www.infinitebanking.org/ ): "Becoming Your Own Banker reveals the extraordinary benefits of creating your own banking system through the vehicle of dividend-paying, permanent life insurance."

If you need life insurance, buy life insurance....(term life...IMHO). If you want to make money on investments, invest in anything other than insurance......stocks, bonds, mutual funds, CDs, anything!

My take on "The Infinite Banking Cocept".....RUN! Don't walk away from it!

just a way to sell insurance ... if you want to save money, the easiest way is to save it, not to give it to an insurance company

Amen!!

 

[Nords]

I did a little googleing and it looked convoluted to me. Looks like a way to sell insurance, but it really wasn't clear.
Anyway, some company is doing local seminars this week and it looks like it might be about this "concept".

Well, this seminar sounds like a wonderful opportunity to slake your thirst for knowledge. You'll have to let us know what you learn. I doubt that we can help you with that from here because the organization probably thinks we aren't smart enough to understand its brilliant financial maneuvers without a seminar.

It makes me wonder why they need to flog free seminars instead of just quietly making their own gazillions and retiring, but I've met entrepreneurial benefactors before who "just want to give back to the people."

But did you look at this website? It also offers books, demos, & audio:
http://www.cramgroup.com/infinite_banking.htm

Personally I'd be a bit hesitant to give my money to anyone named "Cram", but that's just me.

Maybe people could test the "personal banking" concept by borrowing from their 401(k)s and charging themselves 110% interest. Their money would double every year. They'll be rich!!

Anyone have any words of wisdom?

Yeah, you should find out how you benefit. Before you reserve your seat, ask them what kind of doughnuts they're serving with the coffee.

Run, run fast??

Uh, yeah, that too... there are probably better ways to spend your time, let alone your money!

 

[FinanceDude]

I agree 100%. That gives me 3 options. Don't learn and don't invest, learn about it and don't invest, or learn about it and invest.

I'm hoping this group can help me with the last 2 now.

Thanks,

Mark

I manage money for a living, as do others on here. I wouldn't take ANY client to one of these "seminars", much less my best clients..........

Insurance companies exist to make profit for THEM, not YOU............

 

[markf57]

I listened to the Cram guy on a talk show from the site. The info sounded interesting until he started talking about network marketing as a wonderful thing!

Thanks,

Mark

 

[CyclingInvestor]

I just read some of their handouts and articles. I second everyone else here's
opinion. Here is the simplest summary I found, from an insurance broker's
poit of view :

http://www.insuranceproshop.com/sampprivate/page18.html

It basically consists of draining clients of every cent possible to stick
into whole or universal life policies. This includes encouraging clients
to mortgage their houses to the hilt and dropping 401k contributions to
just enough for employer matches.

It seems like an excellent plan for enriching insurance companies,
not so good for their clients.

 

[chinaco]

The scary part is that these clowns cast the net far and wide. They will snag some people who do not know better. The funny part (in a curious way), when people hear the pitch, they think that the wisdom of Solomon was just bestowed upon them. How did everyone else not know?

These @ssh*les are leaches.

 

[markf57]

Well, I went to the seminar last night.

3 hours! It was interesting. He talked about his company's flavor of the infinite banking concept. Sort of a hybrid of Nash, Doug Andrews (Missed Fortune) and others.

The first 2 hours where the setup to the wonderful tool to get all this tax free wealth for me and my family. In the end, he was pitching EIUL from a company called Amerus.

I found it interesting that not once, but twice, he stated how he wasn't in this for some big commission like some other agents at big insurance companies who want to sell you a large death benefit. Ironically, the founder of his company has a unique name so googling was a breeze. The founder has a recruiting page to let agents know that they can make $15k plus per sale.

The presenter did give an analogy, that I also heard in the Crum audio that I listened too. It was about a farmer getting taxed on his seed or his harvest and how much better it is to get taxed on the seed. I think that makes a great argument for a Roth IRA, IMHO.

The seminar talked about phase one of the plan which is the insurance vehicle. They also have a phase two that will supercharge my returns, but due to SEC rules, he couldn't talk about it in public, but he would be happy to discuss it in a free no obligation meeting. Again Google to the rescue. They appear to have an investment club (4 actually) where the founder brings them investments to vote on for the group. I listened to a call and they are investing in diamonds, RE in Mexico, and lots of other stuff. I wonder what the admission price is to those groups?

It was an interesting evening. I can't wait for the follow-up sales call. Any fun questions I should ask?

Thanks,

Mark

 

[kcowan]

I think PT Barnum said it best. We get invitations every couple of months. The latest was a "client appreciation seminar" from a local brokerage. A week after we turfed it, they were running an ad in the local paper.

Then there are timeshare pitches. And land in Costa Rica (Nicaragua...). And trading in options. (I guess they sold all the swampland in Florida?)

The biggest problem is that they serve unhealthy food. How were the donuts?

PS After the newletter pitch, if you buy, they will sell you an extra cost premium subscription, then maybe some software, then options tips, CFDs and The Oxford Club...

 

[gandalf42]

Why go to all of the trouble of "infinite banking" when 401Ks are common and you can often borrow from these but you are to "pay yourself back". Seems they are playing to folks' lack of knowledge of 401Ks.

 

[markf57]

The biggest problem is that they serve unhealthy food. How were the donuts?

They had pastries and coffee. The decaf was good and the water was wet!

 

[brewer12345]

In the end, he was pitching EIUL from a company called Amerus.

 

[RetiredGypsy]

I understand everyone's concerns here. Life insurance has always been sold to the advantage of the agent, but I do have to say...

I BACK THIS CONCEPT 100%!!!

Do you accept checks from Nigeria?

 

[CitricAcid]

This is honestly the most amazing concept you will ever hear about if you just open your eyes and listen! Or maybe you can explain just exactly why Key Bank and hundreds of other banks and some of the most prominent members of our society use it!

I didn't know that your eyes were what made you listen . First post is defending a life insurance vehicle vehemently then directing attention to another site... sounds like a troll/salesman to me!

 

[brewer12345]

And its especially laughable that thisfool is suggesting that we should buy overpriced life insurance we do not need just because lots of banks own it. Many of them own subprime mortgages and crappy home equity loans, too.

 

[FinanceDude]

Insurance companies must be desperate these days...............

 

[brewer12345]

I'd say its more like the agents are desparate. In a nasty, volatile equity market environment, it must be a lot easier to sell guaranteed products vs. a couple years ago.

 

[FinanceDude]

Well, those "magic dividends" must really be the cat's meow............

 

[Coach]

This is a bit disconcerting -- user "jacobtho" is quoted in a couple of messages above, but I don't see his post. Nor do I find him in the list of users. Am I correct in assuming the mods deleted the post and user?

Coach

 

[FinanceDude]

Maybe the real name is "Infinite Commissions"??

 

[REWahoo]

This is a bit disconcerting -- user "jacobtho" is quoted in a couple of messages above, but I don't see his post. Nor do I find him in the list of users. Am I correct in assuming the mods deleted the post and user?

Coach

Yep. Looks to me like he was a run of the mill spammer who got zapped.