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-   -   The beginning of the end for tipping? (http://www.early-retirement.org/forums/f28/the-beginning-of-the-end-for-tipping-39648.html)

dex 10-11-2008 02:49 PM

The beginning of the end for tipping?
 
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/12/ma...nted=1&_r=1&hp

I don't like tipping. I would rather that people were paid a living wage. I think it would help us become a more egalitarian society.

DangerMouse 10-11-2008 02:55 PM

I would love if this would become the norm. Being Australian, tipping is totally foreign and I hate being put into the situation of what is enough. It is also frustrating when someone who has only done an average job is expecting a 20%+ tip.

I would prefer to see those in the industry paid a decent living and do away with tips so that would allow them to budget on what they can expect for their hourly rate.

ziggy29 10-11-2008 03:01 PM

I agree. Just raise the prices by 15-18%, pay 'em a living wage and end the tipping nonsense. If I get bad service I can still report it to the manager.

Rustward 10-11-2008 03:09 PM

I don't like it either, but try to be fair to people who may be working for ~$3/hour.
All other things being equal, we will choose a non-tipping place over one that would require a tip.

One of the main problems with tipping is that (I suspect) what one consumer thinks is a really good tip might be considered an insult by other consumers.

Would be interesting to hear what those who work or have worked for tips think.

CuppaJoe 10-11-2008 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rustward (Post 730411)
....
Would be interesting to hear what those who work or have worked for tips think.

Years ago I had a roommate who worked for tips; I've been tipping very well ever since. Tipping in more than one sense of the word.;)

Own2Feet 10-11-2008 05:02 PM

We lived in the UK for 3 years, where a 10% tip was gratefully received by one and all in the service industries. "Gratefully" meaning big smile and "Thank you! Thank you, sir/mam!"

Back home, I see "18% gratuity" added to restaurant bills automatically. The newspaper delivery service sends a notice around at Christmas with very insistent language about tipping the delivery person. Meanwhile, no one says thank you for a tip. I understand that low-paid people depend on tips. That being the case, wouldn't they think of saying thank you?

Ed at AAFR 10-11-2008 05:09 PM

I always try to tip well because I know it provides most of the income for waiters, waitresses and others.

However, I'd hate to see the system of tipping eliminated. I lived in Europe for 10 years (Germany) where the tip is included in the bill. Service is absolutely horrid there. You get better service in an cheap American lunch spot than in a swank German restaurant. France is even worse. I've seen firsthand what the lack of incentive does to service! But customers need to keep up their end of the bargain too, and not take out their desire to save money on those who are depending on tips for their income.

ziggy29 10-11-2008 05:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Own2Feet (Post 730462)
Meanwhile, no one says thank you for a tip. I understand that low-paid people depend on tips. That being the case, wouldn't they think of saying thank you?

In the case of restaurant servers, they often don't even see your tip until after you're gone. Either you leave cash on the table or, if you charge it, you add the tip to the credit card receipt that you sign.

Ed at AAFR 10-11-2008 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ziggy29 (Post 730481)
Meanwhile, no one says thank you for a tip. I understand that low-paid people depend on tips. That being the case, wouldn't they think of saying thank you?

In the case of restaurant servers, they often don't even see your tip until after you're gone. Either you leave cash on the table or, if you charge it, you add the tip to the credit card receipt that you sign.

I have often been thanked by servers at restaurants. But even if I'm not, I leave a decent tip unless the service was really terrible. It's about paying fairly for the service you received, not about garnering a "thank you."

CuppaJoe 10-11-2008 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ziggy29 (Post 730481)
In the case of restaurant servers, they often don't even see your tip until after you're gone. Either you leave cash on the table or, if you charge it, you add the tip to the credit card receipt that you sign.

Yes, but they remember!

ziggy29 10-11-2008 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CuppaJoe (Post 730492)
Yes, but they remember!

Oh, I know that -- if you're a regular somewhere.

Rambler 10-11-2008 06:32 PM

We rarely eat at places where it would be normal to tip. If I ever see a service charge attached to my bill I will not leave a tip...the management usually takes the service charge or divides it the way they see fit, and not the way I would do it. On the other hand, if I am in a place where the waiter/waitress has taken exceptionally good care of me and mine, I leave a very generous tip. I always give them the opportunity to provide service with a smile, and usuallly give them an opportunity to take care of my whimsical needs/wants. Its kind of like a test. If they do well, they can expect better than 20-25%, even up to 30%. If they do poorly, they know about it, because I usually will comment on it before I leave, thus allowing them a chance to at least partially redeem themselves. If they make an effort to right things, their tip might be 10% or so. If not, I still leave a tip, but only a slap in the face tip of 1-3%. Usually they have the opportunity to say thank you, and the good ones do. The bad ones also have an opportunity to ask what what wrong, or thank me or whatever. Only a few have ever asked what was wrong, and I have been straightforward with them about what I felt should be improved. At least one was embarrassed and apologetic when I said to him "you never once smiled, you didn't say 'thanks' when I moved some empty dishes out of the way for you so you could serve the entree, and you didn't bring the tabasco sauce I requested". On the other hand, there have been many more who simply snorted when they saw their poor tip. I don't go to those kinds of places again.

So, I would really hate to see tipping go away, because it gives me the option to set the price for the service I receive. Also Dex, I'm with you on a lot of your topics, but I don't believe in the kind of egalitarian society where everyone is remunerated the same reqardless of output. If I want egalitarian I go to a place where I don't have to tip...but at the same time I know what to expect when I do, and it certainly isn't service with a smile.

R

CybrMike 10-11-2008 06:41 PM

NO way would I want to eliminate tipping. I believe that service would deteriorate. I bet the servers make more with tipping also. For the record, I used to be a bus boy at outback and I depended on tip share.

ats5g 10-11-2008 06:57 PM

I guess I'm lucky to live in an area with tons of restaurants, so if we get bad service at a restaurant I just give a horrendous tip and then never return.

Leonidas 10-11-2008 07:23 PM

I'll admit that it is a strange system, but my mother raised me on tips she earned as a waitress so I don't have a problem tipping for good service.

Notmuchlonger 10-11-2008 07:32 PM

I know of a young relative who got a job at his local grocery store making 8 an hr being a cashier. What constitutes a living wage? Certainly not an 8hr. So you pay him more because.....? Tipping does not bother me. Cell phones have a calculator so ignorant folk like me can do that there simple maths.

harley 10-11-2008 07:37 PM

I don't have a problem with tipping. Been on both side of the wallet. My only problem is, I know how much to tip in restaurants. But how do you decide how much to tip for extra good service on an installation of a large appliance or something else expensive? Certainly not 15% or anywhere close. $20? Also, what about mail people and such. I know you're not required (or even supposed) to, but here in our new home our mail lady is so helpful I'm going to want to tip her.

clifp 10-11-2008 08:16 PM

I hate the routine tipping for routine service. I don't think it is particularly fair the service provided for $10 lunch gets $1.50-$2.00 tip, a $100 dinner for two gets $15-$20 but there isn't nearly ten times the effort expended nor is the service necessarily better.

Vegas disgusts me in the everyone has there silly hand out. A couple of buck for some guy to signal for a taxi and open the door if I'm lucky??.

I mostly hate tipping because it encourages tax evasion, and dishonesty among the citizens. I bet more than 1/2 the tips never get reported as income.

Nords 10-11-2008 10:00 PM

I think the employee turnover in the waiter/waitress industry indicates how well the tipping system is working.

thefed 10-12-2008 06:49 AM

Oh dear. when i served tables I dreaded old grumpy people...they mostly tipped terribly. nothing would light up my day though like a $5 tip on a $18 bill. Some people are stuck in the 60's...$1 or $2 regardless. Some stick to the 20% ish rule

I for one really appreciate a kind, smiling waiter. They can screw up...just realize it and make it right...even if I point out that they forgot something...be polite back to me, apologize, and keep moving. I usually leave about 20%....last night I left 25% even though she wasnt too friendly...but I think she was really trying. Food came out quick and good and with all the stuff we wanted...so that's what mattered.


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