Humana HDHP Renewal -15% increase

[Buckeye]

Just received our new rates for our individual high deductible policy from Humana. We have Humana One with an $11,900 family deductible and then 100% coverage. We have an HSA. Humana "owns" the Tampa Bay area with respect to individual health insurance so there are really no other competitive options. We work this every year with our broker.

Our premium for the last year was $375 and it has increased to $430 for the coming year. About a 15% increase. We had an 8% increase last year. I am 54 and DH will be 64 this year. Medicare for him next year.

 

[Brett_Cameron]

are the premiums you mentioned per person? Per month?

 

[Buckeye]

Premiums are per month and cover both of us.

 

[fisherman]

My family and I are paying more than that and both much younger with a 10K deductible from Humana One. We have been with Humana for the last seven years and premiums have increased 12 - 15% per year each year but this is the last as Ocare subsidies kick in next year! Current calculator numbers look great with a monthly savings of around $300 per month and a deductible of half as much. Will report in detail once we can buy a family plan on the Exchange to compare.

 

[Buckeye]

My family and I are paying more than that and both much younger with a 10K deductible from Humana One. We have been with Humana for the last seven years and premiums have increased 12 - 15% per year each year but this is the last as Ocare subsidies kick in next year! Current calculator numbers look great with a monthly savings of around $300 per month and a deductible of half as much. Will report in detail once we can buy a family plan on the Exchange to compare.

Does you family include children? Our policy is for 2 adults only.

 

[dgoldenz]

When your policy renews in 2014 and they offer you the option to switch to a "metal" plan or terminate it, $430/mo will look cheap by comparison.

 

[MichaelB]

When your policy renews in 2014 and they offer you the option to switch to a "metal" plan or terminate it, $430/mo will look cheap by comparison.

Do you know any other songs, or is this the only one in your playbook?

 

[dgoldenz]

Do you know any other songs, or is this the only one in your playbook?

Sorry you didn't like my response. In 2014 there will not be any metal plans for $430/mo for a 54 and 64 year old couple unless they qualify for a subsidy. Average rates for that age are expected to be $600-1000/month or more depending on the plan type. Rumors are that carriers will terminate all of the existing non-grandfathered business as of 12/31/13 or the policy's 2014 renewal date, forcing current insureds to move to a metal plan or choose a non-metal plan and pay the penalty.

 

[MichaelB]

Not about like or dislike. Just wondering if there was anything more than "the price is going up for everyone". That point was made long ago, but now we have calculators, tax credits, substantial changes in coverage, and new policy options that make this a much more complex discussion. States are also beginning to bring their exchanges online.

 

[dgoldenz]

Not about like or dislike. Just wondering if there was anything more than "the price is going up for everyone". That point was made long ago, but now we have more details from some states, calculators, tax credits and subsidies, and substantial policy and coverage changes that make this a much more complex discussion.

The price isn't going up for everyone, I never said that. Prices will go up for those with HDHP/HSA plans and younger/healthier people, while prices will generally go down for the older/sicker people who are already paying high rates. The idea of all policies being terminated on 12/31/13 or upon policy renewal in 2014 is relatively new. It has not been confirmed by insurance companies publicly yet, but from internal sources through the grapevine, I have heard that from more than one company.

 

[MichaelB]

Rumors and grapevine? That's different.

What we know is some policies currently held may be withdrawn because they do not meet mandatory coverage standards. We also know some policies may see steep price increases because they are currently underwritten and enjoy the most favorable risk profile for the insurer, these may be withdrawn. HSA policies will continue to be offered, and there is no reason their pricing needs to change other that underwriting. In fact, the primary force driving potential change in policy pricing is underwriting, and to constantly talk about one without the other is pointless.

We have already seen Vermont publish its proposed exchange policies. Surprisingly, prices seem quite similar to current levels.

 

[Buckeye]

When your policy renews in 2014 and they offer you the option to switch to a "metal" plan or terminate it, $430/mo will look cheap by comparison.

This is what Humana wrote in response to my question as to whether my plan was a qualified Obamacare plan. I forgot to ask with which "metal" my plan aligned.

"Thank you for your recent inquiry submitted through the Message Center.

According to the new healthcare reform regulations your current plan will stay as is and would only change if you qualify for government subsidies (payments to offset the cost) if you cannot afford coverage. Once the healthcare reform regulations are made available to us, we will be providing the information to our members. You can expect to receive additional information regarding the changes to healthcare later on this year.

Thank you for contacting Humana where it is our vision to be the most trusted name in health solutions. If you have further questions, please continue to use the Message Center or call our Customer Care Department at 1-800-833-6917."

 

[dgoldenz]

Rumors and grapevine? That's different.

What we know is some policies currently held may be withdrawn because they do not meet mandatory coverage standards. We also know some policies may see steep price increases because they are currently underwritten and enjoy the most favorable risk profile for the insurer, these may be withdrawn. HSA policies will continue to be offered, and there is no reason their pricing needs to change other that underwriting. In fact, the primary force driving potential change in policy pricing is underwriting, and to constantly talk about one without the other is pointless.

We have already seen Vermont publish its proposed exchange policies. Surprisingly, prices seem quite similar to current levels.

The "rumors and grapevine" I referenced are coming straight from the horse's mouth, they are just not officially published because final guidance from HHS has not been given yet. Each company I sell for has stated either in webinars or over the phone that all non-grandfathered plans will be terminated or converted to metal plans eventually (automatic conversions are unlikely IMO), but whether that will be on 12/31/13 or at 2014 policy renewal date has yet to be determined.

This is what Humana wrote in response to my question as to whether my plan was a qualified Obamacare plan. I forgot to ask with which "metal" my plan aligned.

"Thank you for your recent inquiry submitted through the Message Center.

According to the new healthcare reform regulations your current plan will stay as is and would only change if you qualify for government subsidies (payments to offset the cost) if you cannot afford coverage. Once the healthcare reform regulations are made available to us, we will be providing the information to our members. You can expect to receive additional information regarding the changes to healthcare later on this year.

Thank you for contacting Humana where it is our vision to be the most trusted name in health solutions. If you have further questions, please continue to use the Message Center or call our Customer Care Department at 1-800-833-6917."

Key phrase highlighted.

 

[Buckeye]

This is what Humana wrote in response to my question as to whether my plan was a qualified Obamacare plan. I forgot to ask with which "metal" my plan aligned.

"Thank you for your recent inquiry submitted through the Message Center.

According to the new healthcare reform regulations your current plan will stay as is and would only change if you qualify for government subsidies (payments to offset the cost) if you cannot afford coverage. Once the healthcare reform regulations are made available to us, we will be providing the information to our members. You can expect to receive additional information regarding the changes to healthcare later on this year.

Thank you for contacting Humana where it is our vision to be the most trusted name in health solutions. If you have further questions, please continue to use the Message Center or call our Customer Care Department at 1-800-833-6917."

Or highlight this line.

 

[gerrym51]

Rumors and grapevine? That's different.

What we know is some policies currently held may be withdrawn because they do not meet mandatory coverage standards. We also know some policies may see steep price increases because they are currently underwritten and enjoy the most favorable risk profile for the insurer, these may be withdrawn. HSA policies will continue to be offered, and there is no reason their pricing needs to change other that underwriting. In fact, the primary force driving potential change in policy pricing is underwriting, and to constantly talk about one without the other is pointless.

We have already seen Vermont publish its proposed exchange policies. Surprisingly, prices seem quite similar to current levels.

Michael-please don't give me another reprimand-but Vermont like mass and a few other states had already higher rates than most other states because of guaranteed issue. it's the state that essentially had no cost controls on insurance that will see the highest increases. in mass(which i live) will actually see decreases.

Ciao

 

[dgoldenz]

Or highlight this line.

$11.9k deductible HSA plans are not going to be qualify as metal plans. They don't have a 60% actuarial value and the "catastrophic" (a.k.a. HSA) plans available under the metal tiers are only available to people under age 30 or with insurance costs over 9.5% of income. Unqualified HSA plans may be available outside the exchange but it would incur the same penalty as not having any insurance, and the existing policies are still going to be terminated.

Believe me, I hope it doesn't happen this way. I have over 400 clients on the books and if all of the policies are terminated this law is probably going to cost me half my book of business.

 

[dgoldenz]

Michael-please don't give me another reprimand-but Vermont like mass and a few other states had already higher rates than most other states because of guaranteed issue. it's the state that essentially had no cost controls on insurance that will see the highest increases. in mass(which i live) will actually see decreases.

Ciao

x2

States like MA, VT, NY, NJ that already had guaranteed-issue policies will probably see only a slight increase or decrease in premiums. States like VA, DC, MD, OH that have significantly lower average costs will see huge increases for anyone under the age of ~55.

 

[Buckeye]

$11.9k deductible HSA plans are not going to be qualify as metal plans. They don't have a 60% actuarial value and the "catastrophic" (a.k.a. HSA) plans available under the metal tiers are only available to people under age 30 or with insurance costs over 9.5% of income. Unqualified HSA plans may be available outside the exchange but it would incur the same penalty as not having any insurance, and the existing policies are still going to be terminated.

Believe me, I hope it doesn't happen this way. I have over 400 clients on the books and if all of the policies are terminated this law is probably going to cost me half my book of business.

So what Humana wrote in their email to me is a straight out lie. Humana lie to me? Really?

I did send them another email asking what "metal" level I would be. Their answer should be interesting.

 

[dgoldenz]

So what Humana wrote in their email to me is a straight out lie. Humana lie to me? Really?

I did send them another email asking what "metal" level I would be. Their answer should be interesting.

They aren't lying, they just don't have the HHS guidance to give you a different answer yet. The law as written states that all non-grandfathered plans must adhere to any and all requirements imposed by the law, including all of the essential health benefits, which your existing plan does not have. Originally it was thought that insurance companies would just add those benefits to the existing plans and modify the deductibles/coinsurance to comply with the law, but that no longer seems to be the case. Terminating the existing plans and replacing them with new compliant plans looks a lot more likely. Supposedly we will be getting a final answer on this within the next 1-2 months.

 

[Buckeye]

They aren't lying, they just don't have the HHS guidance to give you a different answer yet. The law as written states that all non-grandfathered plans must adhere to any and all requirements imposed by the law, including all of the essential health benefits, which your existing plan does not have. Originally it was thought that insurance companies would just add those benefits to the existing plans and modify the deductibles/coinsurance to comply with the law, but that no longer seems to be the case. Terminating the existing plans and replacing them with new compliant plans looks a lot more likely. Supposedly we will be getting a final answer on this within the next 1-2 months.

My plan definitely doesn't have maternity coverage so I guess that knocks it out immediately. Their answer may not be an outright lie but I would say it's very misleading in that it puts forth more certainty than really exists.

 

[Mulligan]

The price isn't going up for everyone, I never said that. Prices will go up for those with HDHP/HSA plans and younger/healthier people, while prices will generally go down for the older/sicker people who are already paying high rates. The idea of all policies being terminated on 12/31/13 or upon policy renewal in 2014 is relatively new. It has not been confirmed by insurance companies publicly yet, but from internal sources through the grapevine, I have heard that from more than one company.

I have been reading information about this too. But this was quoted information from insurance policy groups, not any inside information. I was under the impression that the insurance companies weren't so much dumping the plans as that the Act itself and the way it was written will make them non-compliment. I read that through a technical loophole companies can renew the policies and then you will be able to hang onto it, through the end of the yearly renewal process in 2014. Some companies were looking to do that from what I understood, as it would help short term profit margins.

 

[dgoldenz]

I have been reading information about this too. But this was quoted information from insurance policy groups, not any inside information. I was under the impression that the insurance companies weren't so much dumping the plans as that the Act itself and the way it was written will make them non-compliment. I read that through a technical loophole companies can renew the policies and then you will be able to hang onto it, through the end of the yearly renewal process in 2014. Some companies were looking to do that from what I understood, as it would help short term profit margins.

The late-2014 renewals are being talked about by a lot of companies. Aetna has already said they will offer this for group policies, so groups may elect to renew in December 2013 instead of their regular renewal date in 2014. This will keep them from getting hit with bigger increases until the end of 2014 even if they have to swallow a smaller increase by using an early renewal date option. For example, a group could buy a policy in July 2013 which would normally renew in July 2014, but the company will allow them to renew in December 2013 which will push the renewal for PPACA compliance back to December 2014.

Whether this will be allowed for individual plans is still being debated and HHS has not issued official regulations on that yet as far as we know.

 

[Mulligan]

$11.9k deductible HSA plans are not going to be qualify as metal plans. They don't have a 60% actuarial value and the "catastrophic" (a.k.a. HSA) plans available under the metal tiers are only available to people under age 30 or with insurance costs over 9.5% of income. Unqualified HSA plans may be available outside the exchange but it would incur the same penalty as not having any insurance, and the existing policies are still going to be terminated.

Believe me, I hope it doesn't happen this way. I have over 400 clients on the books and if all of the policies are terminated this law is probably going to cost me half my book of business.

I have read on more than one occasion that plans may be available outside the exchanges, and that some companies have said they would offer them. Do you think this means they will be high deductible plans? Would they be underwritten? If that is what this means, I will very seriously consider one of these and pay the fine if it is a significant cost savings to me.

 

[dgoldenz]

I have read on more than one occasion that plans may be available outside the exchanges, and that some companies have said they would offer them. Do you think this means they will be high deductible plans? Would they be underwritten? If that is what this means, I will very seriously consider one of these and pay the fine if it is a significant cost savings to me.

Plans outside the exchange will not be medically underwritten (as far as we know under current rules), but if they are not metal plans you would still be subject to the penalty. Pretty stupid to make people with HSA plans pay a penalty and restrict the availability of them to people under age 30 or with insurance cost over 9.5% of income (both of which are least likely to buy an HSA plan in the first place). That's just my opinion, but I'm sure many here will agree with that.

 

[Mulligan]

Plans outside the exchange will not be medically underwritten (as far as we know under current rules), but if they are not metal plans you would still be subject to the penalty. Pretty stupid to make people with HSA plans pay a penalty and restrict the availability of them to people under age 30 or with insurance cost over 9.5% of income (both of which are least likely to buy an HSA plan in the first place). That's just my opinion, but I'm sure many here will agree with that.

What would be the benefit or advantage of even offering or taking a policy outside of exchange then?