Update on Cord Cutting (Cable TV) 2017 - 2020

[Chuckanut]

NFLX is raising subscriber costs across the board, so cord cutting got a little more expensive effective immediately. They need to pay for there 12-14bln worth of corporate bond debt they took on paying script writers and actors to compete against Disney etc.

Comcast is raising fees also. The savings will probably remain about the same.

https://www.cordcuttersnews.com/com...e-tv-some-plans-will-now-cost-254-95-a-month/

Some of these fees will now cost more also. The Broadcast TV fee for networks like ABC, CBS, FOX, and NBC will go up from $8 a month to $10 a month. The Regional Sports Fee will go up from $6.25 to $8.25 a month beginning January 1, 2019.

 

[Cobra9777]

But, if it is happening while watching OTA stations the internet is not involved I would think. IIRC, his Tablo has to have a hard drive attached to it to record shows. Perhaps the HD is having issues, is not the right type or there is a bad cable connecting it to the Tablo?...

Perhaps. But he mentioned same thing happens on Hulu. So I think that rules out a HDD issue. Also, the Tablo may be connected to his network via WiFi (instead of hardwired to the router), which I strongly suspect is at least part of the issue.

...Is your internet cable or FIOS. If I understand this correctly, the cable coming into your neighborhood is shared with your neighbors who may hog bandwich at times. FIOS, on the other hand, just serves you. Your neighbors can stream video 24/7 and it won't affect your usage...

Cable... he mentioned purchasing a new cable modem. I agree that the primetime bandwidth demand in his neighborhood is likely part of the issue, but probably not the whole story.

...I am also curious why he bought a Fire Stick when it won't easily work with Google products like Youtube. A Roku is the best, IMHO. They have been doing it a long time and they work with all comers. No corporate animosity to get in the way...

Our Fire TV works perfectly with YouTube. I watch about an hour every day with no difficulty at all. And Fire TV is by far the best platform for Prime subscribers, plus better integration with live services like PS Vue. That said, I do recommend the Fire TV boxes over the stick, which I also think may be part of trapperjohn's issue, as I mentioned before.

 

[steelyman]

Given a choice, I use the Roku rather than the standalone apps from various providers. It’s an older one (Roku 3) but seems to suffer less from buffering-type problems. The WiFi download speed here (200+ Mbps over 5GHz band according to Speedtest) should be plenty.

 

[MissMolly]

But, if it is happening while watching OTA stations the internet is not involved I would think. IIRC, his Tablo has to have a hard drive attached to it to record shows. Perhaps the HD is having issues, is not the right type or there is a bad cable connecting it to the Tablo?

One more thought. Is your internet cable or FIOS. If I understand this correctly, the cable coming into your neighborhood is shared with your neighbors who may hog bandwich at times. FIOS, on the other hand, just serves you. Your neighbors can stream video 24/7 and it won't affect your usage.

I am also curious why he bought a Fire Stick when it won't easily work with Google products like Youtube. A Roku is the best, IMHO. They have been doing it a long time and they work with all comers. No corporate animosity to get in the way.

Just a few thoughts.

The antennae for OTA stations are connected to the Tablo. Tablos are connected to your Internet router and then beamed wirelessly to your Firestick or Roku. This is why distance from your router can make a difference.

 

[jimnjana]

Finally cable tv free... At least for now. Amazed at channel clarity via antenna. TiVo ota not same TiVo experience we were used to. Pluto tv is a pretty decent freebie. Will be signing up with direct tv now in time for GOTs.

 

[trapperjohn]

First of all, thank you to everyone who responded. Let me try to reply to everyone in this one response, instead of individually.

I understand and agree that download speeds will be slower during evenings where there is more of a demand for bandwidth from everyone in the neighborhood, but my problems happen even during the day, and in the morning.

The newer hi-res TV is only about 30 feet from the router, on the same floor, but in a different room. The older low-res TV is in the basement at the other end of the house.

Someone mentioned that the Firestick may be smart enough to recognize a low-res TV and adapt to where it required less download data, and therefore needed to buffer less. I think they were on to something. That would point to some problem with downloading into my house.

I'm paying extra for 500 Mbps internet download speed from my cable company (who is providing my internet). I tested it last evening and again today during the day. I'm getting about 1.8 Mbps download and 1.9 Mbps upload. I called the cable company to complain today. They checked and confirmed that my cable modem and router were acceptable and able to handle 500+ Mbps. They made me go to their sanctioned website to retest the speed a couple of times, but they got the same speeds I did. They remotely rebooted my cable modem, and confirmed that I was still getting unacceptably low download rates.

Next step: They are sending a technician out in 2 days to "fix the problem".

 

[Chuckanut]

The antennae for OTA stations are connected to the Tablo. Tablos are connected to your Internet router and then beamed wirelessly to your Firestick or Roku. This is why distance from your router can make a difference.

So, no direct connection via cable from the Tablo to the TV?

 

[MissMolly]

So, no direct connection via cable from the Tablo to the TV?

Nope. At least not for us. The Tablo, router and modem are all out in my office. The TVs are in the bedrooms/kitchen/family room. For us, we have Rokus on all the TVs (or a Roku TV in the bedroom). The Rokus are simply plugged into the TVs. We only have the Roku sticks, not the boxes. No cables. The Rokus have a Tablo app (channel) that picks up the OTA stations.

 

[bloom2708]

First of all, thank you to everyone who responded. Let me try to reply to everyone in this one response, instead of individually.

I understand and agree that download speeds will be slower during evenings where there is more of a demand for bandwidth from everyone in the neighborhood, but my problems happen even during the day, and in the morning.

The newer hi-res TV is only about 30 feet from the router, on the same floor, but in a different room. The older low-res TV is in the basement at the other end of the house.

Someone mentioned that the Firestick may be smart enough to recognize a low-res TV and adapt to where it required less download data, and therefore needed to buffer less. I think they were on to something. That would point to some problem with downloading into my house.

I'm paying extra for 500 Mbps internet download speed from my cable company (who is providing my internet). I tested it last evening and again today during the day. I'm getting about 1.8 Mbps download and 1.9 Mbps upload. I called the cable company to complain today. They checked and confirmed that my cable modem and router were acceptable and able to handle 500+ Mbps. They made me go to their sanctioned website to retest the speed a couple of times, but they got the same speeds I did. They remotely rebooted my cable modem, and confirmed that I was still getting unacceptably low download rates.

Next step: They are sending a technician out in 2 days to "fix the problem".

That would be the problem. <2 MB/s is too slow. If you have 300 MB+ you need the DOCSIS 3.1 Cable Modem. DOCSIS 3 will go up to 300 MB. At least that is what I read.

So, to get 500 MB/s you need a 3.1 modem.

We have 100 MB, but our speed test routinely gets us 100 to 105. Even if you could get 75 would would be fine.

Hopefully they can figure out that the problem is. Bad splitter or weak signal. If you have been paying for 500 for long, I would request a credit of some sort.

 

[trapperjohn]

I do have a DOCSIS 3.1 modem. It says I’ll handle up to 1.5Gb transmission.

I’ve only been paying for the higher speed for 2 months.

Hopefully they’ll find and fix the problem.

 

[bUU]

Comcast is raising fees also. The savings will probably remain about the same.

It has been about a year since they've raised the price for Internet service. I expect that next. Time will tell how Comcast will target price increases for Internet service at cord-cutters, but there is little doubt that they'll figure out a way to do so.

 

[Midpack]

It has been about a year since they've raised the price for Internet service. I expect that next. Time will tell how Comcast will target price increases for Internet service at cord-cutters, but there is little doubt that they'll figure out a way to do so.

But there will still be significant savings. All else being equal (e.g. channels, features), the costs for cord cutters will probably be more than today but less than traditional cable/satellite when an equilibrium is reached. In the meantime we’re saving over $500/year without cable/satellite - it’s great!

And so far Comcast has not increased our internet cost, in fact they increased our Mbps rate by 2.5X without us asking and without a price increase. They may increase cost, but not yet.

 

[bUU]

There is no reason to believe that the early adopter advantage for cord-cutters will survive long-term, and every reason to believe that economics will prevail, returning parity between different modes of obtaining the same content.

 

[ncbill]

I do have a DOCSIS 3.1 modem. It says I’ll handle up to 1.5Gb transmission.

I’ve only been paying for the higher speed for 2 months.

Hopefully they’ll find and fix the problem.

I hope so!

I'm getting speeds 10x yours...on my backup internet (LTE hotspot on AT&T's $29.99/month "tablet" plan)

 

[Midpack]

There is no reason to believe that the early adopter advantage for cord-cutters will survive long-term, and every reason to believe that economics will prevail, returning parity between different modes of obtaining the same content.

If the underlying costs between streaming and cable/satellite were the same there would be parity eventually. Fortunately the equipment and support costs for streaming are demonstrably lower and there’s more and more competition in streaming every day, so the streaming equilibrium will be higher than today but lower than cable/satellite. Content costs should be about the same.

 

[Chuckanut]

There is no reason to believe that the early adopter advantage for cord-cutters will survive long-term, and every reason to believe that economics will prevail, returning parity between different modes of obtaining the same content.

That may be true. For now, I simply pay for what I value the most. And I get the total for far less than any deal the local cable company offers.

The local cable company seems to like offering me what appear to be great deals (a big basket of TV for $40 a month!) but then takes it away with various additional fees, and by being able to raise various fees while I am locked into a contract and can't cancel without a penalty. Not so good.

 

[The Cosmic Avenger]

If the underlying costs between streaming and cable/satellite were the same there would be parity eventually. Fortunately the equipment and support costs for streaming are demonstrably lower and there’s more and more competition in streaming every day, so the streaming equilibrium will be higher than today but lower than cable/satellite. Content costs should be about the same.

Right, you've touched upon two fundamental differences between cable and streaming services. First, cable requires a huge investment in infrastructure, and for that reason they are usually granted a franchise by the local government, often giving them a monopoly. Therefore, classical economic theory of competition doesn't fully apply to cable TV.

Second, streaming video is fungible and infrastructure-agnostic, meaning it doesn't matter how it gets to you, they're all provided relatively the same way, and streaming services are more easily scalable. For a cable company's customer base to grow, they need to at the very least send out techs and provide loaner equipment, and at worst invest in expanding their infrastructure. Meanwhile, the most streaming companies usually need to do to upgrade is scale up their streaming servers, and maybe request higher quality encodes (4K/UHD) from the content providers....assuming they're not the content provider! But as was said before, the cost of creating content should be equal regardless of the means of consumption.

And third, one that wasn't mentioned really, is that streaming services are a la carte, and so provide more flexibility of content choice than cable services, which like to package channels in huge tiers regardless of what you actually want or need. You can sign up for as many of the streaming services as you want, and adding or dropping any of them is not dependent on any of your other streaming services (there are a few exceptions like HBO Go, but they are few and far between). So there's a lot of friction and restriction moving from streaming to cable, but not in the other direction.

So while the gap may narrow a bit as telecoms try to stanch the bleeding, I don't think they'll ever be able to directly compete with streaming services.

 

[explanade]

Supposedly 5G connections for home will be rolled out this year.

So far they're saying no caps.

 

[Cobra9777]

Supposedly 5G connections for home will be rolled out this year.

So far they're saying no caps.

+1

I've been reading about 5G. When fully deployed and mature (may take several more years), this will likely render wired ISPs (cable, DSL, fiber) obsolete for many consumers. There's no reason to pay for two internet providers, like most of us do today, when the mobile connection is faster than today's typical wired broadband connection.

I don't expect wired ISPs to go away, especially fiber, although not many people have access to fiber-to-the-home. But when 5G is fully deployed and mature, the wired providers will have to compete on price with 5G networks. I think this will end the price gouging for cord cutters who only want internet service from the cable company.

The economics of having Gigabit capability at home, without digging up streets and maintaining all the cables and equipment, is going to be very compelling. There will still be lots of new fiber and antennas required for 5G. But without wired connections to every home and business, the operating cost should be considerably lower.

 

[bUU]

If the underlying costs between streaming and cable/satellite were the same there would be parity eventually.

Only suckers price discretionary services based on cost. Pricing in a market is based on perceived value.

 

[timo2]

I do have a DOCSIS 3.1 modem. It says I’ll handle up to 1.5Gb transmission.

I’ve only been paying for the higher speed for 2 months.

Hopefully they’ll find and fix the problem.

Is your modem separate from your router or they both in the same box? If they are separate, what is the Ethernet cable between them? I have a separate router (Linksys EA7300 AC1750) and modem (netgear CM1000 DOCSIS 3.1) and upgraded from the cat 5e to a cat 7 Ethernet wire for that connection, and then I used a Cat 6 from the router to the Hopper. The cables me up to what I was paying for, as the Cat 5e Ethernet was not doing the job.

 

[ExFlyBoy5]

The changes we see are significant and happen lightning fast. The "new to us" home we just moved into was built in 2007 and is wired for ethernet, surround sound, cable television and telephone...and all of that is really outdated...in a short 10'ish years. The 5G stuff is intriguing to me, especially the part where devices really won't even require software, it will all be cloud based.

Where will we be in 10-20 years? I don't know, but I bet it will be pretty awesome.

 

[ncbill]

I'm skeptical of the "it will cost the same" argument.

With a traditional cable package you're forced to pay for an enormous amount of content, far more than you could possibly consume.

I used to buy cable shows on a per-episode basis from Amazon Unbox when I first cut the cord (antenna for broadcast shows) and that option was far cheaper than any cable package.

 

[Animorph]

Probably the first thing the tech will do is hardwire to the router (or modem) and see if the download speed is OK with that connection (no Wi-Fi). Is 5 GHz Wi-Fi working for you? Can you transfer files between computers in the house (or Tablo recordings)?

 

[Midpack]

Only suckers price discretionary services based on cost. Pricing in a market is based on perceived value.

And competition is a myth in your view. Lower costs drive down prices, and streaming has lower infrastructure and support costs. No receivers, no DVR's, no additional cables or dishes, and no army of service techs/equipment/vehicles. We agree to disagree, time will tell...