John Hancock and LTC - changes

[rpguy4]

I know there are a few people on the forum that have John Hancock's LTC policy, and was just curious to know what people's thoughts are about the new options JH is now giving us. If you have a John Hancock's LTC policy what option did you choose ?

Background :
JH LTC insurance was offered by my previous employer in 2004, and at the time my wife and I thought it was great deal. Once I retired, we continued to pay the premiums. The original idea of purchasing the policy, was for it to help supplement our LTC needs.


Option 1 :
We bumped our Daily Maximum Benefit(DMB) to $140 at the beginning of 2022, but now for the same coverage JH wants to increase our premium by 25% (which is what the NC state insurance will allow). However, that 25% increase will happen again over the next 2 years until we reach a predefined monthly premium that JH wants us to pay for the $140 DMB

Option 2 : is to reduce our DMB to 'almost' what it was previously, and JH wants us to share the cost of any claims we submit. For example, if our DMB is $100, and we submit a claim for $100, JH will reimburse only 80% ($80) and we pay the rest ($20)

Option 3 : Nonforfeiture Benefit. We stop paying for LTC insurance and whatever money we have already paid to JH over the past 18 years can be used for LTC claims until that money runs out.

We have until August 25th to make a decision. The new rate
takes effect Oct 1,2022.

After reading some of the comments posted here, I'm tempted to just stop paying, and take option 3:
https://www.consumeraffairs.com/ins...re-insurance.html?page=2#sort=recent&filter=1

 

[phil1ben]

Both my inlaws had LTC policies from JHC. Both died at 86 and neither lived through the deductible period to be paid anything. I realize it is insurance for a bad case scenario but pay attention to the deductible period also which greatly minimizes your ability to access dollar 1 from the policies.

 

[Montecfo]

I know there are a few people on the forum that have John Hancock's LTC policy, and was just curious to know what people's thoughts are about the new options JH is now giving us. If you have a John Hancock's LTC policy what option did you choose ?

Background :
JH LTC insurance was offered by my previous employer in 2004, and at the time my wife and I thought it was great deal. Once I retired, we continued to pay the premiums. The original idea of purchasing the policy, was for it to help supplement our LTC needs.


Option 1 :
We bumped our Daily Maximum Benefit(DMB) to $140 at the beginning of 2022, but now for the same coverage JH wants to increase our premium by 25% (which is what the NC state insurance will allow). However, that 25% increase will happen again over the next 2 years until we reach a predefined monthly premium that JH wants us to pay for the $140 DMB

Option 2 : is to reduce our DMB to 'almost' what it was previously, and JH wants us to share the cost of any claims we submit. For example, if our DMB is $100, and we submit a claim for $100, JH will reimburse only 80% ($80) and we pay the rest ($20)

Option 3 : Nonforfeiture Benefit. We stop paying for LTC insurance and whatever money we have already paid to JH over the past 18 years can be used for LTC claims until that money runs out.

We have until August 25th to make a decision. The new rate
takes effect Oct 1,2022.

After reading some of the comments posted here, I'm tempted to just stop paying, and take option 3:
https://www.consumeraffairs.com/ins...re-insurance.html?page=2#sort=recent&filter=1

When we were confronted with these decisions for MIL, the kids convinced her to pay up for the coverage. Reasoning was her perceived risk profile had not changed, and the reduced cost options we expected benefit the insurer, statistically.

Having said that, I am not a fan of buying LTC for a variety of reasons. But having a plan in place tilts the playing field.

MIL passed peacefully at 93 in independent living, during the elimination period. $0 reimbursed.

 

[badatmath]

Hmm, I have JH LTC and have not been notified but different state. You could consider calling them and see if they have options not listed in your form letter. I believe sometimes they can make other offers. (Have not tried this).

 

[REWahoo]

You could consider calling them and see if they have options not listed in your form letter. I believe sometimes they can make other offers.

^ This.

Our LTC policies are with a different insurer, and when they provided a couple of options in lieu of accepting another in a series of price increases, they said to contact them for additional options.

An option they offered, and we accepted, was to freeze our benefit amount where it currently stood and remove the annual 5% benefit increase going forward. In return, our premium was reduced by roughly 50%, to an amount near what we were paying when we took the policies out more than 20 years ago.

 

[rpguy4]

Will give JH a call tomorrow to see if there are other options. Thank you

 

[Graybeard]

I've had a JH LTC policy since 2010 or 2011. Things were static then about 4 or 5 years ago there's a premium increase. Then there's one every year. I'm in the 2nd year of a 3 year increase. I have no intentions of changing or dropping it. The premiums are now about 75% higher than initially. I may never use or I may need it. 90 elimination period with 5% inflation, $100 per day but the 5% inflation has been bumping that up each year.

 

[Koolau]

I know there are a few people on the forum that have John Hancock's LTC policy, and was just curious to know what people's thoughts are about the new options JH is now giving us. If you have a John Hancock's LTC policy what option did you choose ?

Background :
JH LTC insurance was offered by my previous employer in 2004, and at the time my wife and I thought it was great deal. Once I retired, we continued to pay the premiums. The original idea of purchasing the policy, was for it to help supplement our LTC needs.


Option 1 :
We bumped our Daily Maximum Benefit(DMB) to $140 at the beginning of 2022, but now for the same coverage JH wants to increase our premium by 25% (which is what the NC state insurance will allow). However, that 25% increase will happen again over the next 2 years until we reach a predefined monthly premium that JH wants us to pay for the $140 DMB

Option 2 : is to reduce our DMB to 'almost' what it was previously, and JH wants us to share the cost of any claims we submit. For example, if our DMB is $100, and we submit a claim for $100, JH will reimburse only 80% ($80) and we pay the rest ($20)

Option 3 : Nonforfeiture Benefit. We stop paying for LTC insurance and whatever money we have already paid to JH over the past 18 years can be used for LTC claims until that money runs out.

We have until August 25th to make a decision. The new rate
takes effect Oct 1,2022.

After reading some of the comments posted here, I'm tempted to just stop paying, and take option 3:
https://www.consumeraffairs.com/ins...re-insurance.html?page=2#sort=recent&filter=1

Big question is, now that you are older, do you have a feel for whether you are more likely to need the coverage than not? If you need it, it may be worth the inflated cost.

Note on option 3: Do you think it any more likely they will treat you fairly when you submit a claim to get your own money back?

Honestly, I'm surprised a state regulatory committee would allow a second increase UNTIL the company (2 years later) could prove that they needed it to survive. In theory, the company's viability is generally the key to rate hikes IIRC - not happy share holders as far as I know. I'm telling you way more than I know for a fact so YMMV.

 

[REWahoo]

Big question is, now that you are older, do you have a feel for whether you are more likely to need the coverage than not? If you need it, it may be worth the inflated cost.

Another way to look at it is, now that you are older, are you in a financial position to self-insure or at least partially self insure? Do you still need the policy in full or would reduced coverage (and reduced premiums) cover your potential needs?

As I mentioned previously, after having our LTC policies 20+ years we opted to reduce coverage (stop any future inflation adjustments) in return for reduced premiums. We are at the point where the remaining coverage will allow us to self-insure for any potential shortfall.

 

[Dash man]

We’ve have JH LTC policies that I got through my employer back in 2002. It has a $610/day benefit and half that for home care. Every three years there is an inflation increase if we choose. We typically do and that is what has increased our rates. We pay about $6,200/yr for both of us.
I’ve heard when the home has a patient advocate, things typically go smoother. We found that out with DW’s stepmom when DW had to battle with Medicaid.

 

[Koolau]

Another way to look at it is, now that you are older, are you in a financial position to self-insure or at least partially self insure? Do you still need the policy in full or would reduced coverage (and reduced premiums) cover your potential needs?

As I mentioned previously, after having our LTC policies 20+ years we opted to reduce coverage (stop any future inflation adjustments) in return for reduced premiums. We are at the point where the remaining coverage will allow us to self-insure for any potential shortfall.

That's a good way to look at it. I may call my LTC company to see if changes like that are available. I think I recall my LTC company suggesting increasing the wait time. But "benefit" would change premiums even more, I would think. At my age, I know about what my stash is (and, hopefully, what it will be.) I could calculate the potential of partial self insurance.

Probably time anyway to review my coverage (see what the 5%/year increased benefit is up to, etc.)

 

[rpguy4]

OP here, for comparison purposes, we talked with a local Mutual of Omaha's agent, and received a quote for a similar DMB, with a non-forfeiture rider. Even with the JH premium increases over the next couple years for the $140 DMB, JH is still cheaper. We are going to stay with JH and keep the $140 DMB.

One Note - Mutual of Omaha's LTC uses MMB (Monthly Maximum Benefit) instead of Daily Maximum Benefit (DMB).

 

[rpguy4]

Thanks to everyone that read and responded to my post. Much appreciated.

As mention above, we elected to keep the $140 DMB, at the new higher rate. We probably could self-insure, but would prefer to share the costs, especially if both of us (DW and I) ended up in assisted living at the same time.