More DIY Expertise Needed- Gutters

[zinger1457]

I have an issue where heavy rain runoff from the roof overshoots the gutters, lived with it for many years since the resulting problems created from it were minimal. Recently upgraded my patio with porcelain paver tiles and the overshoot from the first heavy rains wreaked havoc on the polymeric sand joints.
So, today was watching an older episode of Ask This Old House and Tommy was helping someone fix their gutters. One thing he mentioned was that top outside edge of the gutter should be somewhat aligned with the slope of the roof. Took a look at my gutters and they weren't even close, used a straight edge along the roof line and extended it out above the gutter, there must have been 3" between the top outside gutter edge and the straight edge (see attached photo).
Any suggestions for a fix? I'm guessing just moving them up would be the obvious fix but maybe I'm missing something.

 

[finnski1]

Yeah Tommy is right and one of my go to references. It looks like you have some room to raise them up.

 

[Scrapr]

I have seen a piece of flashing "stuck" into the gutter to block & direct the water into the gutter.

 

[Telly]

Hmmm, roofing tiles... never had nor built with tiles.

Is the gutter a regular 5" K-gutter?
What I think I'm seeing in your pic, top to bottom, is tiles, drip edge flashing, K-gutter.

Unlike other forms of roofing, tiles have large vertical dimensional change from max to min (hill to dale) across them. Wouldn't raising the gutter UP allow water to back up UNDER the tiles if downspouts or gutter further along plugs up, and the water level in the gutter rises to the top? Certainly don't want water to enter the structure!

 

[Sunset]

I have seen a piece of flashing "stuck" into the gutter to block & direct the water into the gutter.

That's what I was thinking, maybe rivet it to the inside of the gutter along the edge farthest from the wall, so rain hits it and runs down into the gutter. They sell flashing already colored in standard colors, so matching the gutter should not be an issue.

 

[Aerides]

I have a shingle roof, but a similar problem. Or, a problem but I didn't know there might be a solution until this thread.

In heavy rain, small shingle gravel will get washed off the roof. In the back, I have a 4' overhang, and then the pool is 2' further back. In a good florida storm, some of that gravel bounces right off the roof into the pool. I vacuum it up, but it can't be good for the marcite.

Moving the gutters or something might help. Not a DIY job for me, but it might be a good idea to call our gutter company before next rainy season...

 

[zinger1457]

Hmmm, roofing tiles... never had nor built with tiles.

Is the gutter a regular 5" K-gutter?
What I think I'm seeing in your pic, top to bottom, is tiles, drip edge flashing, K-gutter.

Unlike other forms of roofing, tiles have large vertical dimensional change from max to min (hill to dale) across them. Wouldn't raising the gutter UP allow water to back up UNDER the tiles if downspouts or gutter further along plugs up, and the water level in the gutter rises to the top? Certainly don't want water to enter the structure!

It's hard to make out from the photo but the dark area just below the tile is metal attached to the roof end that's contoured to the shape of the tile, the tan section just below that is the metal drip edge that goes down maybe 3". Definitely would want to keep the gutter below the top of the drip edge. The gutters seem to drain well, never noticed any overflow but then again during really heavy rains a lot of water is shooting over the gutter.

 

[zinger1457]

About the flashing, are you referring to something like in the photo below? I do have that on my gutters in the valley sections and it does seem to work, maybe could just get straight pieces and extend it along the entire gutter.

 

[finnski1]

Also, can't tell from your photo but the wider the gutter the better especially with tile roofs because it is harder to get the top edge up high enough.
Out east we don't see many tile roofs and the gutter installation is a lot more straight forward.
Tile roofs can benefit from gutters around 7 inches wide.

 

[Sunset]

About the flashing, are you referring to something like in the photo below? I do have that on my gutters in the valley sections and it does seem to work, maybe could just get straight pieces and extend it along the entire gutter.

Yes.

 

[zinger1457]

As I took a closer look at it I don't think I could easily raise the gutters, the drip edge actually sits out from the fascia board about 3/4" and the back side of the gutter is positioned below and inside it. You can also see from the photo that the black plate above the drip edge has weep holes to drain any water that might get under the tiles. The only way to raise the gutter would to be to install it on the drip edge and if I did that any water coming out of the weep holes would probably drain behind the gutters. Wider gutters would probably work but might try the splash guard fix first, faster and cheaper.

 

[pb4uski]

As I took a closer look at it I don't think I could easily raise the gutters, the drip edge actually sits out from the fascia board about 3/4" and the back side of the gutter is positioned below and inside it. You can also see from the photo that the black plate above the drip edge has weep holes to drain any water that might get under the tiles. The only way to raise the gutter would to be to install it on the drip edge and if I did that any water coming out of the weep holes would probably drain behind the gutters. Wider gutters would probably work but might try the splash guard fix first, faster and cheaper.

Shouldn't the inside edge of the gutter be aligned with the top of the fascia? The red line in the picture below.

Or are you saying that the red line is the top of the drip edge and not the top of the fascia? If so, that looks like a wide drip edge but perhaps that is the way it works with clay tile roofs.

 

[JoeWras]

Tile roofs have some unique challenges. You need wider gutters.

Now I know why so many of the houses in my area in FL (back in the 80s) didn't have gutters. Everything is on slab anyway. Gutters still help for splashback, though.

 

[zinger1457]

Shouldn't the inside edge of the gutter be aligned with the top of the fascia? The red line in the picture below.

Or are you saying that the red line is the top of the drip edge and not the top of the fascia? If so, that looks like a wide drip edge but perhaps that is the way it works with clay tile roofs.

The red line is the top of the fascia and the top of the drip edge. They also attached a board (~3/4" thick and 2 1/2" wide) to the top of the fascia and that is what the ~3" drip edge is attached to, the metal drip edge extends about 1/2" past the bottom of that board, the top of the inside edge of the gutter sits in that ~1/2" slot. Hope I explained it clearly enough.

 

[pb4uski]

The red line is the top of the fascia and the top of the drip edge. They also attached a board (~3/4" thick and 2 1/2" wide) to the top of the fascia and that is what the ~3" drip edge is attached to, the metal drip edge extends about 1/2" past the bottom of that board, the top of the inside edge of the gutter sits in that ~1/2" slot. Hope I explained it clearly enough.

I think I get it... the dark piece just above the red line is the drip edge and the yellow board below the red line is the fascia? and the existing gutter is below the fascia and inset from the fascia?

What is the gutter currently attached to?

Could you relocate the gutter so the top of the gutter is close to the top of the fascia (yellow board)? If so, that would move it out some as well as up and the water should flow into it better... or at least it looks that way to me. Is there enough structure to attach the gutters to to do that?

 

[zinger1457]

The drip edge is the tan ~3" thin metal strip just below the black piece, should be L shaped, one section sitting over the top edge of the fascia but not certain how it was installed.
The gutter is attached directly to the fascia.
I thought about moving the gutter up and attaching it to the drip edge. My concern was that water coming out of the weep holes on the black section would flow behind the gutter but maybe that's not a big deal, doubt there's much water coming out of those weep holes.

 

[pb4uski]

Have you talked with a "gutter guy" about potential solutions?

 

[Surewhitey]

Have you talked with a "gutter guy" about potential solutions?

I would have expected a gutter guy to never install something that he probably knew did not work. I'd say either a wider gutter as most pictures I've seen or fur-out behind the gutters (less like this one)...

Is there a way to diffuse the "pour over". Think gutter guard mesh thingy...

 

[zinger1457]

Probably didn't explain it very well, here's a cross section diagram with the fascia board. It was our local gutter guy who installed it, it was many years ago so not sure if that company is still around.

 

[pb4uski]

That diagram is helpful. I would consider relocating the gutter so that the top of the gutter is just below the top of the drip edge... that will move it up and out. And perhaps put silicone caulk along the top of the gutter where it is attached to the house.

Alternatively you could attach the gutter with thin (1/8") plastic washers between the fasteners and the drip edge so any water that dribbles out of the holes will just dribble down the drip edge and onto the ground.