Any natural gas code experts?

[corn18]

I decided to hook up the outside natural gas line to my firepit. This is a pic of where the 1/2" line comes out of my house and hooks into the 1/2" CSST that runs under my porch to the other side of my patio where the grill is. The underground part is in 1 1/2" PVC that is sealed. I still need to seal where the CSST comes out of the ground.

I tested all the connection with soapy water and got no bubbles. Firepit works great.

Can someone in the know tell me if there are any code issues with this part of the hookup?

Thanks,

Corn

 

[Jerry1]

I’m not qualified to answer your question, but from the looks of it and my general experience, I would think there needs to be a bracket securing that pipe to the foundation. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with the materials or the connections that were used. I have similar connection in my house. That flex pipe is code but they like the black pipe anywhere they think there’s a possibility of it being punctured. My runs are mostly the flex pipe but black pipe runs down the walls. I’m talking about the connections for my stove and my dryer.

 

[corn18]

I’m not qualified to answer your question, but from the looks of it and my general experience, I would think there needs to be a bracket securing that pipe to the foundation. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with the materials or the connections that were used. I have similar connection in my house. That flex pipe is code but they like the black pipe anywhere they think there’s a possibility of it being punctured. My runs are mostly the flex pipe but black pipe runs down the walls. I’m talking about the connections for my stove and my dryer.

Good call on securing it to the wall. Will do that.

 

[CardsFan]

Don't know about the code, but I don't like that kink you have in the flex hose, with it resting on the PVC pipe. Over time, movement WILL cause that hose to abrade. How long? Who knows. But I would want a straight shot down.

JMHO

 

[Jerry1]

Don't know about the code, but I don't like that kink you have in the flex hose, with it resting on the PVC pipe. Over time, movement WILL cause that hose to abrade. How long? Who knows. But I would want a straight shot down.

JMHO

It doesn’t look like the flex pipe is touching the edge on the pvc. I think the point is more that the pipe should be secured so that there is no movement. That “kink”, which is actually just a bend, doesn’t seem to be an issue.

 

[ERD50]

Don't know about the code, but I don't like that kink you have in the flex hose, with it resting on the PVC pipe. Over time, movement WILL cause that hose to abrade. How long? Who knows. But I would want a straight shot down.

JMHO

I'm also wondering about a shutoff? I know the code says there must be one in easy reach, but it might also be required before the flex hose? Even if it wasn't required, I think a shut off there would be a good idea, I'd do it, code or no code. It might meet the code for a shutoff anyhow, so it wouldn't be extra.

I'm also not sure the flex is approved for that part of the run. I'm thinking it is only for the 'last leg' where you need some flexibility to attach/detach from the appliance. You should consult your local codes. Similar to how extension cords aren't to be used for any 'permanent' wiring.

It doesn’t look like the flex pipe is touching the edge on the pvc. I think the point is more that the pipe should be secured so that there is no movement. That “kink”, which is actually just a bend, doesn’t seem to be an issue.

Looks kinky to me (insert joke here). But seriously, just doesn't look right to me - see above.

-ERD50

 

[Jerry1]

Agree with the shut off. I had a run from my meter to my pool water heater and there is a shut off at each end.

Now that I think about it, a gas line should have a wire that runs with it underground. They use it to find it when you call about digging on your property. Here it’s called Ms. Dig (811).

In my pool run, they did use the flex tubing underground and before it broke ground level, they switched to the black pipe. However, the main feed from the gas company is a flexible tubing and that breaks the ground before it transitions to metal pipe running the last foot or so into the meter.

Again, these are just my observations of jobs that have all been inspected by our city inspector and done by licensed contractors.

 

[corn18]

Agree with the shut off. I had a run from my meter to my pool water heater and there is a shut off at each end.

Now that I think about it, a gas line should have a wire that runs with it underground. They use it to find it when you call about digging on your property. Here it’s called Ms. Dig (811).

In my pool run, they did use the flex tubing underground and before it broke ground level, they switched to the black pipe. However, the main feed from the gas company is a flexible tubing and that breaks the ground before it transitions to metal pipe running the last foot or so into the meter.

Again, these are just my observations of jobs that have all been inspected by our city inspector and done by licensed contractors.

There is a shutoff valve where it exits the house and there is a shutoff where it enters the firepit.


The NEC code says the CSST must be inside a PVC pipe no smaller than 1" bigger than the CSST, which we used for this. When using CSST, I did not see a requirement for a tracer. There was a requirement if using plastic pipe.

 

[Jerry1]

Nice that there’s a shut off. Nice of them to put it so close to the foundation. I’m sure that would be easy to operate in an emergency. Though it probably does meet code.

 

[zinger1457]

Not sure if that's pipe dope or white PTFE tape you're using but I was told if using tape to use yellow PTFE tape instead of white for gas lines, it's a thicker seal tape.

 

[Stormy Kromer]

If you ever plan on selling your house someday....will it pass a buyer's home inspection?

 

[corn18]

If you ever plan on selling your house someday....will it pass a buyer's home inspection?

That's my question. I will hire an inspector.

 

[corn18]

Wanted to follow up and thank everyone for their input. I do not know enough to hook this up per code, so I capped it off at the house like it was when I bought the house. I will get a permit, Invite my buddy over that is a licensed plumber and figure out how to do it right. Then get it inspected. Then turn it back on. For now, I bought a propane conversion kit (just a new orifice) for the firepit and I am running it directly off a propane tank.

 

[iloveyoga]

Wanted to follow up and thank everyone for their input. I do not know enough to hook this up per code, so I capped it off at the house like it was when I bought the house. I will get a permit, Invite my buddy over that is a licensed plumber and figure out how to do it right. Then get it inspected. Then turn it back on. For now, I bought a propane conversion kit (just a new orifice) for the firepit and I am running it directly off a propane tank.

I think this is excellent. Good choice.

 

[Jerry1]

You can never be too safe, but I think you would have been fine waiting until you and your friend re-plumbed the line. No doubt though to get it looked at and permitted. I don’t know this to be true, but I’ve always thought insurance would deny payment for any damage that happens from something that did not get a permit/inspection.

 

[iloveyoga]

I think this is excellent. Good choice.

I should have added, DH worked for the local gas company for many years and my son owns a heating and cooling company, so I have heard many gas lines stories.

 

[jazz4cash]

I don’t know about code either but I don’t like the vertical opening where the flex goes into PVC. Allowing water to enter just does not seem like a good idea.

We had flex lines installed to convert furnace and WH from electric to gas. Permits required. The local utility had contractor install shutoff valves with test ports at the transition from black pipe to flex. They plugged the appliance end of the flex, installed a test gauge and charged the line with nitrogen. Inspector came back after 2 days to confirm the line test pressure held.

 

[corn18]

UPDATE:

We have the firepit running off of a 40 lbs propane tank to a 200,000 BTU 2 stage regulator then a 3/4" hose to the valve for the burner. Holy crap, that thing is a flamethrower at full tilt. Looks like I can get 4-5 hours at full blast, but I don't think we will run it that way all the time. We were out on a couple of 35 deg nights and once the lava rock heats up, we can turn it down and get good warmth without the flamethrower. We decided to stick with propane vs. spending $5,000 to run a dedicated LNG line from the meter.

The 1/2" LNG line coming from the house will stay capped off. We could hook it up for our BBQ grill, but we don't grill very often and a 20 lbs LPG tank lasts a long time for us. We'll leave that option for the next owners.

One thing I wanted to pass on is the bluetooth sensors I am using to monitor my LPG tank levels. I found out about them on the RV sites I frequent and they are the bee's knees. Accurate and easy to use. I have them on the two 40 lbs tanks for the firepit, the grill tank, the patio upright heater and the two 30 lbs tanks on my RV. Here's a link if anyone is interested:

https://tweetys.com/tank-check-024-...el-sensing-system-w-bluetooth-technology.aspx

 

[Rich225]

Looks like Wardflex to me and needs to be installed according to the manufacturer's installation instructions including bonding requirements:
http://www.wardmfg.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/WARDFLEX_DI_GUIDE_english-2017.pdf

 

[Stormy Kromer]

Wanted to follow up and thank everyone for their input. I do not know enough to hook this up per code, so I capped it off at the house like it was when I bought the house. I will get a permit, Invite my buddy over that is a licensed plumber and figure out how to do it right. Then get it inspected. Then turn it back on. For now, I bought a propane conversion kit (just a new orifice) for the firepit and I am running it directly off a propane tank.

Does your licensed plumber buddy have General Liability Insurance that would cover his inspection ? If I was him I wouldn't do it.

If you have a gas accident your Homeowners Insurance Company will hire investigators and everyone will be questioned. Under Oath. It's not worth it unless you hire him as a professional.

About 10 miles south of me a couple was killed last year by a gas leak that filled their home, they turned on the lights in the morning and the house blew up. A licensed and insured contractor did something wrong and it went bad. Don't mess with gas.

 

[corn18]

Does your licensed plumber buddy have General Liability Insurance that would cover his inspection ? If I was him I wouldn't do it.

If you have a gas accident your Homeowners Insurance Company will hire investigators and everyone will be questioned. Under Oath. It's not worth it unless you hire him as a professional.

About 10 miles south of me a couple was killed last year by a gas leak that filled their home, they turned on the lights in the morning and the house blew up. A licensed and insured contractor did something wrong and it went bad. Don't mess with gas.

I didn’t say my buddy would inspect it.

 

[eytonxav]

Since you are getting a permit, perhaps your city will actually come out and inspect the installation.

 

[ExFlyBoy5]

That's my question. I will hire an inspector.

I wouldn't get an inspection just to get one. None of them are the same. Inspector "A" will find issue 1,2,3 and 4. A week later, Inspector "B" will find issue 1,4,6,7. Not only that, many times they will identify flaws that aren't an issue at all just to justify their fee.

I would ask the gas company what they recommend for a safety inspection. Where we are, they will send out a tech AT NO CHARGE to make sure it's good to go. YMMV.

 

[Stormy Kromer]

Spend the money to do it right. Leave your buddy out of it, he could lose his house if something goes wrong. So could you. Worse yet, people could get hurt.

I've seen stuff blow to hell and burn to the ground that was done by licensed HVAC guys. They all got sued. After my firemen put it out....

 

[Bamaman]

Take your pictures by a LP business and ask what they'd suggest doing. I was going to say pile up about 8" of rock in the corner, and no one will know the difference.

Codes makes it such a big deal about natural gas lines, but there's hardly even any pressure in the lines. My plumber used gray (thick) teflon tape and a pipe dope and tightened down the lines. He didn't even check it for leaks. The city inspector drove by and waved at us.

We now live 10 miles out and everyone has electric heat pumps. Huge LP tanks are to run a couple of fireplaces, and they're habitually within 10' of the house and in front of a foundation vent--not to code. When we moved here, I made'em get rid of that LP tank because I couldn't afford to fill it for 2 low line gas log fireplaces.