Asking about ethnicity?

[Aerides]

Like most things it's all in context and nuance. And location, who is doing the asking, who is being asked, etc., are all factors.

A couple of examples:

I have a rarely-noticed physical genetic mutation. Every now and then a complete stranger I have just met will point it out - usually quite stupidly - "DID YOU KNOW YOU HAVE....!!!"
I know it's a totally innocent question and reaction, but It freezes me whenever it happens as, it's pretty rare someone notices, and when they do it feels almost piercing. When a friend finally notices (and many never do), it's no big deal and I laugh and say what took you so long.

I used to have an accent. I learned very quickly that a small but noticeable number of people would not listen to what I was saying, but simply how I was speaking. They'd respond with some dazed over smile and, ignoring what I'd said or asked, go "where are you from?" then I'd get "no, what part?", "oh where's that?", "I've been to london, is it near that?", "do you watch Dr. Who?" - and seriously no this gets annoying. And this would be at work, so I really learned to speak as american as I could.

I know both are examples of people just being curious and no ill intent, but both make me feel singled out, and are usually a distraction or an interruption, or an embarrassment. I'm not embarrassed by my accent or my mutation, I'd just rather not have a big deal made when I'm out minding my own business.

When it comes to asking about accents or skin or background, I love this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DWynJkN5HbQ

[mountainsoft]

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeea "Are you black?" "Are you Mexican?" You think everyone wants that? You think that shows appreciation?

Obviously that was my example of what NOT to ask, but it's funny how some have latched onto that as if I would actually speak to people that way. Or that I'm singling out people because of their race. Ironic that a question meant to find out how to politely discuss someone's heritage ended up being offensive.

Clearly the answer is to keep my curiosity and comments to myself. That's sad.

I've been teased most of my life for being different. First as the Kindergartner who was raised by his grandparents and dressed like an old man at 5 years old. Then as the new white kid at the mostly black grade school. When we moved to Washington I was teased for my southern accent. In high school kids called me Disco Kid because my mom bought me satin shirts and gym shorts (and no, I didn't dance). In college I was teased as "the boy" since I skipped senior year of high school and went straight to college. As a young father I put up with the stink eye for being one of the first Mr Mom's before that was common (long before there were changing tables in men's restrooms). And I've never fit into the usual social norm of talking about sports or work.

Having experienced it myself, I would never tease or harass someone for being different. I genuinely take an interest in what makes a person unique and special. I live by the old rule "do unto others", and would never ask something of someone I would be uncomfortable answering myself.

Let's see, I can't ask anything personal, can't talk about religion or politics, don't know anything about sports, so I guess I'm left with "nice weather we're having". It's no wonder people walk around with their nose in their phones not talking to one another.

[DFDubb]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mountainsoft Obviously that was my example of what NOT to ask, but it's funny how some have latched onto that as if I would actually speak to people that way. Or that I'm singling out people because of their race. Ironic that a question meant to find out how to politely discuss someone's heritage ended up being offensive. Clearly the answer is to keep my curiosity and comments to myself. That's sad. I've been teased most of my life for being different. First as the Kindergartner who was raised by his grandparents and dressed like an old man at 5 years old. Then as the new white kid at the mostly black grade school. When we moved to Washington I was teased for my southern accent. In high school kids called me Disco Kid because my mom bought me satin shirts and gym shorts (and no, I didn't dance). In college I was teased as "the boy" since I skipped senior year of high school and went straight to college. As a young father I put up with the stink eye for being one of the first Mr Mom's before that was common (long before there were changing tables in men's restrooms). And I've never fit into the usual social norm of talking about sports or work. Having experienced it myself, I would never tease or harass someone for being different. I genuinely take an interest in what makes a person unique and special. I live by the old rule "do unto others", and would never ask something of someone I would be uncomfortable answering myself. Let's see, I can't ask anything personal, can't talk about religion or politics, don't know anything about sports, so I guess I'm left with "nice weather we're having". It's no wonder people walk around with their nose in their phones not talking to one another.

Did you enjoy being teased about the way you were dressed? About being a minority (I too was a rare white boy at a predominately black middle school)? About your weird accent? I imagine you weren't a big fan of people bringing it up, but that's just a guess.

If only there were something we could do as a society to try and change this behavior in our kids.

[Gumby]

If only there were something we could do to prevent people from becoming self appointed arbiters of what is and is not considered offensive by groups of people who are not them.

[mountainsoft]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DFDubb Did you enjoy being teased about the way you were dressed? About being a minority (I too was a rare white boy at a predominately black middle school)? About your weird accent? I imagine you weren't a big fan of people bringing it up, but that's just a guess.

There's a big difference between making fun of someone "Haay Y'all Dern Tootin", and asking if I grew up in the south. And no, I didn't mind if people were genuinely curious.

[Chuckanut]

Many years ago my parents were friends with a couple whose parents migrated from Spain to the USA. Their last name was Martinez. The man worked for a MegaCorp in the 80's and the company was trying to prove it hired lots of people from various ethnic groups.

When filling out newly required information card for HR, the HR rep looked at the husband and said "So you are Mexican-American. Great!". His reply, said with pride and perhaps a touch of arrogance, was priceless, "No. I am Castillian".

[Nemo2]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gumby If only there were something we could do to prevent people from becoming self appointed arbiters of what is and is not considered offensive by groups of people who are not them.

Naah, there are too many careers at stake riding this particular pony.

[Chuckanut]

I learned a long time ago that all Asians are not the same. I remember a Korean man telling me that many older South Koreans would not mind if a North Korean missile flew over South Korean territory on its way to Tokyo. They remember the brutal occupation of their country prior to WW2.

As an Italian-American, if I dress appropriately, and don't carry a camera, tour book and other such tourist items, I am routinely assumed to be a native born Italian when in Italy. Alas, my response must be "Mi dispiace. Sono Americano. Non parlo l'italiano molto bene".

I grieve that modern diversity and multiculturalism seems focused on emphasizing our differences, and dividing us into warring groups. When my mother made 'Spanish Rice' (aka. paella) our friends with Spanish heritage did not scream about cultural appropriation. Instead, they ate it with great gusto.

[pj.mask]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuckanut I remember a Korean man telling me that many older South Koreans would not mind if a North Korean missile flew over South Korean territory on its way to Tokyo. They remember the brutal occupation of their country prior to WW2. ... I grieve that modern diversity and multiculturalism seems focused on emphasizing our differences, and dividing us into warring groups.

Some people focus on negatives and talk about other countries/ethnicities/people that way. Others are curious. It is easy to tell the difference.

[candrew]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gumby If only there were something we could do to prevent people from becoming self appointed arbiters of what is and is not considered offensive by groups of people who are not them.

Agreed.

And if only there were something that we could do to help people understand that their racially ambigous/ethnic/"other" curiosities should never come at the expense of another individual's right to disclose/discuss that information on their terms absent the unsolicited and sometimes awkward prying of others. Regardless of how innocent or well intentioned those inquiries may be.

A previous poster mentioned that he feels the only fair game left is talking about the weather. Yep, that's a great place to start. DW and I are perpetual travelers. Asking another person's opinion about our current locale is another good place to start. We'll ask about places to eat, sites to visit. Who knows, those discussions may end up satisfying your curiosity anyway without having to ask loaded questions or making inquiries that are couched in compliments about skin tone, hair, accent, etc. And if that person doesn't go there, then let it be!

It bears repeating - just because "I" have no problem with you or anyone else for that matter asking me about my origins/ethnicity/religion/skin color/whatever, (and I don't) that does not automatically mean that everyone else is fair game, as well. If I don't want to answer, then I won't. Other folks may not feel empowered to do the same and should not be put in a position of having to explain themselves out of a desire on their part to ameliorate an otherwise avoidably awkward encounter on my part.

[Teacher Terry]

Mountain, there was nothing wrong with the question you asked. Obviously when you mentioned skin color versus accent it was evident that was your example of what not to do.

[Gumby]

Quote:

Originally Posted by candrew Agreed. And if only there were something that we could do to help people understand that their racially ambigous/ethnic/"other" curiosities should never come at the expense of another individual's right to disclose/discuss that information on their terms absent the unsolicited and sometimes awkward prying of others. Regardless of how innocent or well intentioned those inquiries may be. A previous poster mentioned that he feels the only fair game left is talking about the weather. Yep, that's a great place to start. DW and I are perpetual travelers. Asking another person's opinion about our current locale is another good place to start. We'll ask about places to eat, sites to visit. Who knows, those discussions may end up satisfying your curiosity anyway without having to ask loaded questions or making inquiries that are couched in compliments about skin tone, hair, accent, etc. And if that person doesn't go there, then let it be! It bears repeating - just because "I" have no problem with you or anyone else for that matter asking me about my origins/ethnicity/religion/skin color/whatever, (and I don't) that does not automatically mean that everyone else is fair game, as well. If I don't want to answer, then I won't. Other folks may not feel empowered to do the same and should not be put in a position of having to explain themselves out of a desire on their part to ameliorate an otherwise avoidably awkward encounter on my part.

The essence of good manners and gracious behavior is not making other people uncomfortable. I personally would never ask about or comment on another person's physical appearance because it risks doing just that. For the same reason, I would never directly ask them about the way they speak. But, in my view, it is officious and wrong to chide someone for the very fact of being curious, as at least one poster here has done. As I mentioned in my very first post on this thread, people are curious the world over.

[Ronstar]

I have never asked the ethnicity of anyone. And I won’t because it could make someone uncomfortable.

[braumeister]

I've always had a very good ear for accents. Growing up in NYC I could usually tell which of the five boroughs a person was from after listening to them for a few minutes.

And being well traveled, I can generally identify where a person grew up from their accent, sometimes even which part of a country.

Since I rarely have the opportunity to ask directly, I'll often try to find out someone's origin obliquely, and I get a big kick out of it when I find that I'm right. If I find that I was wrong, that just adds another data point to my internal database of accents. It's a lot of fun.

[Dtail]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nemo2 Naah, there are too many careers at stake riding this particular pony.

Slipped that one in.
Very good.

[tmm99]

Just ask. I know some people think it's rude. Some people don't care. I ask. And some of my friends go, "Oh, tmm99" like they're embarrassed. I am curious as to where people are from when they have an accent. But I have an accent myself. I ask other Asians especially, hoping I will meet another Japanese person where I live (Canada) especially in the volleyball scene. I do ask other people too if I am curious. I've never seen anybody looking annoyed, maybe because I have an accent myself? I don't know. Sometimes, I'd say "I'm from Japan. Where are you from?"

People ask me too. People ask me without really knowing me at all, like when I am shopping in a grocery store. Sometimes they come up to me and say "Chinese or Japanese?" "Korean or Chinese?" A bit annoying, but I don't care. Sometimes, when I say I'm Japanese, they may say a word or two in Japanese. They seem satisfied with that.

What used to annoy me was "How did you get a name like that (say, Hansen)?", looking at me (Asian). That's a stupid question IMHO. Some variation in answering that one. "I was married to a Hansen but decided to keep the name after my divorce." I sometimes anwered "I'm adopted."

DH is from the UK living in Canada and he gets a lot of "Are you from Australia?" This happens in different places, like with workers at stores. He is a Geordie. He finds their assumption quite amusing.

From my experience, people are proud of where they're from, and they don't mind telling you where they're from.

This isn't related to this thread directly, but when I first moved to the US/California (high school), kids would ask me where I was from and once they knew I was from Japan, they would ask really silly questions like "Do you guys really live in houses made of paper?" "Are Gozilla shows popular in Japan too?" "Is that true you guys eat whale?" Stuff like that. Older kids asked pretty direct questions about Pearl Harbour, stomic bombs, etc (They must have taken a history class or something.). Kids are neat. They are curious and they don't have to be afraid of asking whatever questions t that came to their mind.

[Nemo2]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmm99 I'm Japanese

Made me recall a story.....my oldest & best friend of some 52 years was born in a Japanese internment camp in the centre of British Columbia during WWII....he looks Japanese but he's culturally Canadian.

Back in the 1960s, in our single days, I was a tad late getting to a (very crowded) party.....found him cornered by a ('real') Japanese girl who was talking a mile a minute.

He's 'responding' with variations of "Uh Huh", but must've "Uh'd" when he should have "Huh'd" because she stomped off.

I asked him what she'd said.....he replied "Dunno, I don't speak Japanese".

[Major Tom]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmm99 From my experience, people are proud of where they're from, and they don't mind sharing this particular information.

Of course they don't because in your post, you are talking about asking people based on their accents. Most of the varying opinions in this thread have been based on the question of whether it's OK to ask someone about their origins, based on their appearance (skin color, facial features etc).

In my opinion, it's often fine to ask people about their accents. Brief compliments on clothes, as Amethyst mentioned, are often well-received too ("Hey - cool shirt!" or "Wow, the pattern on your dress is beautiful!") Comments based on physical appearance can sometimes work out though, unless you genuinely know what you're getting into, I think it's best to defer. As others have said, so much depends on the precise context of the conversation, and other subtle nuances that would be hard to fully catalog here.

When it comes to commenting on physical appearance, my general thought would be to think that, if it is the only, or the main thing, about a person that is registering with you, your connection with them is minimal to none.

[kgtest]

Was out in a small town near my home that is sometimes "touristy". My curiosity sort of got the best of me as I had seen a bunch of people "different from me" and was just super curious.

So I blurted "Where ya from?" Totally random, total strangers...the mom and dad evil eyed me but their son told me they were from Iran. I thought it was cool we had people all the way from Iran visiting this small town near me.

Did I need to know? Not really.
Did they need to answer... No.
Could I have went about it differently? Maybe.

Sometimes I just toss out a guess, and if I'm wrong, I'm wrong. Does it matter? Probably not but I am curious and outgoing.

I told the Iranians... Right on! Glad you were able to come visit our beautiful city and I hope you enjoy it. I also mentioned as a local it was easily one of top ten cities in the state. They didn't seem to care and scuddled on.

[davebarnes]

I just ask.
I cannot be embarrassed.
Cargo shorts are always in style.