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01-09-2019, 07:55 AM
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#21
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Northern Illinois
Posts: 16,543
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I would start by painting the common wall with the heavy duty oil base kilz and a coat of regular paint. Caulk any cracks in the wall. It could be that your furnace system is such that the returns are not pulling as much air as the output requires. Then the system pulls the air from other places. So your system could be pulling air from their side of the wall into your side.
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01-09-2019, 08:07 AM
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#22
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 11,701
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronstar
I would start by painting the common wall with the heavy duty oil base kilz and a coat of regular paint. Caulk any cracks in the wall. It could be that your furnace system is such that the returns are not pulling as much air as the output requires. Then the system pulls the air from other places. So your system could be pulling air from their side of the wall into your side.
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+1
There are even thicker paints for cinder block designed to create a moisture barrier. Might look into those too.
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01-09-2019, 08:19 AM
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#23
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 9,373
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronstar
I would start by painting the common wall with the heavy duty oil base kilz and a coat of regular paint. Caulk any cracks in the wall. It could be that your furnace system is such that the returns are not pulling as much air as the output requires. Then the system pulls the air from other places. So your system could be pulling air from their side of the wall into your side.
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I would do this after I got in contact with owner and tell him your dilemma. Then go from there.
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01-09-2019, 08:45 AM
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#24
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Moderator
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 9,070
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Regarding the thought that this is coming from the furnace intake. I’m no expert, but wouldn’t that be a bigger problem? I thought the air coming from the intake was only for combustion. Combustion air should not be reaching inside the house. Do you have a carbon monoxide detector?
__________________
Every day when I open my eyes now it feels like a Saturday - David Gray
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01-09-2019, 09:07 AM
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#25
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 5,170
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry1
Regarding the thought that this is coming from the furnace intake. I’m no expert, but wouldn’t that be a bigger problem? I thought the air coming from the intake was only for combustion. Combustion air should not be reaching inside the house. Do you have a carbon monoxide detector?
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We have a carbon monoxide detector on each floor.
As for the intake for the furnace, it's in front of their house (a side of our house - our houses are not side-by-side), and they don't seem to smoke there.
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01-09-2019, 09:09 AM
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#26
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 5,170
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We ordered this from Amazon a couple of days ago. I'm hoping we could tell something using this cheapy device...after either raising our room temp much higher or lowering it by a huge margin to create some temp difference for air leaks.
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B00...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
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01-09-2019, 09:15 AM
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#27
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 2,581
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Quote:
Originally Posted by njhowie
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+1
Buy a high quality, high volume HEPA air filter and put it nearest the most likely place(s) the smoke is coming in. And, if you haven't already, I'd try upgrading your HVAC filters to ones that are rated for smoke and microscopic allergens. Look for at least MERV 13 or FPR 10 rating.
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01-09-2019, 09:20 AM
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#28
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 5,170
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunset
A 12'' thread with a ping pong ball glued to it would blow in a light breeze indicating the direction if you have something to hang it from.
If anybody asked, you could say it stops birds from flying into the window.
The floor joists in the basement when you look up, are they extending from the duplex side to the other side, if so they may be embedded into the block wall (or a steel beam could be), and is there any chance if the neighbors are smoking in the basement that it comes in that way?
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The ping pong ball idea sounds good. I'll talk to DH.
Ah, as for the floor joists in the basement, it doesn't look like anything is extending out from our side. It's possible that they are smoking in the basement, but I cannot detect any smoke smell in the furnace room. The other side of the furnace room is our garage, but the garage has so many different smells that I just can't tell what smells are there.
I'll post photos later.
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01-09-2019, 09:31 AM
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#29
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 5,170
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jazz4cash
If it's cinderblock and not poured concrete it is very porous (moisture and air). I wonder if covering that wall with drywall and/or sealing it with a vapor barrier (plastic sheeting or paint) might help. That would be more effort than many of the other ideas being tossed about.
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I actually don't know if it's cinderblcok or concrete... I emailed the agent (who used to be a builder) who sold this house to us with the question.
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01-09-2019, 09:43 AM
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#30
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 13,184
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Have you asked your neighbors where they smoke? Just say you are trying to figure out how the smoke smell is getting into your house and how to eliminate it, not that you are asking them to stop. Maybe they will also take a hint to smoke on the other side of their house.
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01-09-2019, 09:50 AM
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#31
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 1,760
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If the cigarette smoke is coming into your house, your house and furnishings will smell like cigarettes too. You said after speaking to the owner that the smell miraculously disappeared. It normally won't disappear, it lingers until you clean it. Is it the smoke you smell or the dirty ashtrays and butt bucket? My husband use to smoke, only in our detached garage. You could smell (only if you were not a smoker, smokers don't smell it) the residue from the cigarettes on all the paperwork kept out there, there was a yellow film on all surfaces, 1 convertible that was stored in 1 of the back garages had to have the convertible top and upholstery professionally cleaned. We had to clean and repaint all surfaces, all paper had to be left in a covered plastic tub with open cannisters of baking soda to get rid of the smell. I just got a cardboard box down from the attic and you can still faintly smell cigarettes. He quit about 5 years ago. We did all the clean up after he was quit for a while and he could smell it and it bothered him. He asked me how I could stand the smell. He said it was like sitting in the middle of a dirty ash tray. Smokers don't realize about the smell until they stop. Sorry, I'm no help in how the smell is getting into your home.
I am also surprised that you have a bare block wall. In my area of the U.S., the walls have a vapor barrier and sheetrock over the block walls.
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01-09-2019, 09:59 AM
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#32
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 3,865
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Along the shared wall build an inner wall but leave a gap of a couple inches, then run an exhaust fan to ventilate the space between.
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01-09-2019, 10:05 AM
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#33
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 11,701
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry1
Regarding the thought that this is coming from the furnace intake. I’m no expert, but wouldn’t that be a bigger problem? I thought the air coming from the intake was only for combustion. Combustion air should not be reaching inside the house. Do you have a carbon monoxide detector?
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Some newer systems, and now most commercial systems, have an fresh air intake that mixes with the heated forced air. This is to cause positive pressure and air turnover in tight homes. This setup is uncommon on older homes.
Combustion input is a different matter and should not cause any smells. Condensing furnaces all have these.
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01-09-2019, 10:12 AM
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#34
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 5,170
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sojourner
+1
Buy a high quality, high volume HEPA air filter and put it nearest the most likely place(s) the smoke is coming in. And, if you haven't already, I'd try upgrading your HVAC filters to ones that are rated for smoke and microscopic allergens. Look for at least MERV 13 or FPR 10 rating.
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I bought two of these and paid over $130CAD each at Lowe's I believe. They don't do squat even when I put two of them together. Do air filters ever work??
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B00...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Costco has a more heavy duty one for like $400CAD, but I'm hesitating a bit. I could always return it if it doesn't work, so I should probably just do it, but I want to spend big money to try to eliminate the cause.
I didn't know about HVAC filters for smoke etc. I will definitely get one of those! Thank you!
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01-09-2019, 10:13 AM
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#35
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hooverville
Posts: 22,983
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrayHare
Along the shared wall build an inner wall but leave a gap of a couple inches, then run an exhaust fan to ventilate the space between.
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This is an interesting idea, but I believe it is much more likely that the smell comes in via the outdoors, or some as yet undiscovered portal.
If Canada has a similar concentration of smokers as the US, it won't be long until these renters move and non-smokers move in. In Seattle, there are essentially 3 groups of smokers: Old people who could not quit, poor people, and hipsters.
In any case, almost anywhere north of the Rio Grande smokers are close to being an insignificant minority.
Ha
__________________
"As a general rule, the more dangerous or inappropriate a conversation, the more interesting it is."-Scott Adams
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01-09-2019, 10:25 AM
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#36
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 5,170
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So sorry everyone. The common wall does have drywall over it. DH just came home and said it does have drywall on top. He said he drilled through it so he knows (the first part went in easily and then it hit the hard wall.) So sorry for giving you misinformation. DH doesn't want to take the drywall down and add this klin oil painting over it if he could help it since taking off the drywall evidently makes a huge mess. Would it help to add oil-based paint over the drywall?
As for the wall, the agent didn't know what kind it is. DH thinks it's a cinderblock wall. he drilled holes in it to hang a picture frame, and he thinks the concrete wall would be harder to drill through, but that's just a guess.
Here's the common wall (garage).
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01-09-2019, 10:40 AM
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#37
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 5,170
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Quote:
Originally Posted by haha
This is an interesting idea, but I believe it is much more likely that the smell comes in via the outdoors, or some as yet undiscovered portal.
If Canada has a similar concentration of smokers as the US, it won't be long until these renters move and non-smokers move in. In Seattle, there are essentially 3 groups of smokers: Old people who could not quit, poor people, and hipsters.
In any case, almost anywhere north of the Rio Grande smokers are close to being an insignificant minority.
Ha
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I am leaning on the outdoor theory, too, plus some other leaks somewhere maybe? I never smell the food smell coming from their side. It's just strange we didn't detect any cig smell for 3 months straight though.
There seem to be a lot of smokers here - cigarettes cost a lot here too, but it doesn't seem to deter them.
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01-09-2019, 10:43 AM
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#38
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 3,865
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If the smoke were coming from outside the OP would have noticed the smoke during the summer while the neighbors were smoking outside. Instead the OP noticed the smoke when the neighbors moved their smoking indoors, hence its mostly coming from indoors.
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01-09-2019, 10:53 AM
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#39
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 14,328
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I wonder if something like this could be added to your furnace return duct to positively pressurize the house. https://www.builderonline.com/produc...-ventilation_o
Quote:
The system you describe, a duct from outdoors to the return side of your air handler, is one of the simplest supply-only setups. An add-on control for the heating and cooling system, the AirCycler (www.aircycler.com), will open and shut the intake damper as required and run the air handler fan on a user-specified schedule (typically, for 10 minutes every ½ hour to 1 hour).
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This article is interesting in that it discusses reasons for negative pressure including wind. https://www.ecohome.net/guides/2221/...r-house-blows/
Quote:
Wind creates either positive or negative air pressure on a particular side of a building, forcing air in on some sides and forcing it out on others. Aside from being blocked by other buildings or planting a stand of evergreen trees, the only thing you can do to stop wind pressure is to work overtime when you are sealing up your house in the first place.
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01-09-2019, 10:53 AM
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#40
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 5,170
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Quote:
Originally Posted by splitwdw
If the cigarette smoke is coming into your house, your house and furnishings will smell like cigarettes too. You said after speaking to the owner that the smell miraculously disappeared. It normally won't disappear, it lingers until you clean it. Is it the smoke you smell or the dirty ashtrays and butt bucket? My husband use to smoke, only in our detached garage. You could smell (only if you were not a smoker, smokers don't smell it) the residue from the cigarettes on all the paperwork kept out there, there was a yellow film on all surfaces, 1 convertible that was stored in 1 of the back garages had to have the convertible top and upholstery professionally cleaned. We had to clean and repaint all surfaces, all paper had to be left in a covered plastic tub with open cannisters of baking soda to get rid of the smell. I just got a cardboard box down from the attic and you can still faintly smell cigarettes. He quit about 5 years ago. We did all the clean up after he was quit for a while and he could smell it and it bothered him. He asked me how I could stand the smell. He said it was like sitting in the middle of a dirty ash tray. Smokers don't realize about the smell until they stop. Sorry, I'm no help in how the smell is getting into your home.
I am also surprised that you have a bare block wall. In my area of the U.S., the walls have a vapor barrier and sheetrock over the block walls.
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The accumulation of cig butts was much smaller when the cig smell disappeared miraculously a day after we complained to the landlord. Actually, it took maybe half a day to a day for it to clear, but it stopped and didn't come back for months. I think your case is a little different from this. It's not like they're smoking in our living room. I stayed with a friend who smoked inside her house and it was like what you described- everything reeked of cig smell. My case is some smoke smell seeping in from the other side. Like the blanket I have on the couch, if I put that over my nose, I can't smell any cig smell.
I'm thinking about how to approach the ashtray issue with our neighbor. I really really do not want to talk to them, but we may have to if the landlord doesn't step up...
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