Emotional support animals in restaurants/stores

[Souschef]

A number of airlines are now taking a harder line on service animals. No pigs, roosters, peacocks, etc.

 

[Mr._Graybeard]

I was flipping through a Costco travel brochure recently and noticed some transatlantic cruises that provided accommodations for pets. If I was making a move across the pond, that would be an attractive option.

 

[GravitySucks]

Too many scammers ruining it for the truely needy.
Ran across some one with a service vest on a little longer dog that tried to bite everyone that went by it last week.
Obviously not a trained service animal.

 

[Dreaming of Freedom]

I wonder what states have laws against having your pet impersonate a service animal? I know it is a crime in California. I wonder how they enforce it?

 

[travelover]

..............Ran across some one with a service vest on a little longer dog that tried to bite everyone that went by it last week.
Obviously not a trained service animal.

Maybe it was trained to be a Surrogate Aggressor, for antisocial people that just can't bring themselves do the attacking themselves.

 

[lwp2017]

I fully agree.

Animals are unsanitary and should not be allowed where food is sold or prepared.

I own dogs but don’t allow them in my home.

I recently watched a mutt urinate on the carpet in an airport terminal lounge. The owner walked off.
Then dozens of people unwittingly walked through the dog urine before a worker placed an orange cone on the spot.
It was infuriating to see such a cavalier response by the owner.

 

[Dreaming of Freedom]

I fully agree.

Animals are unsanitary and should not be allowed where food is sold or prepared.

I own dogs but don’t allow them in my home.

I recently watched a mutt urinate on the carpet in an airport terminal lounge. The owner walked off.
Then dozens of people unwittingly walked through the dog urine before a worker placed an orange cone on the spot.
It was infuriating to see such a cavalier response by the owner.

I am not a smoker or a dog owner, but I do wish airports had more pet relief and smoking areas after security. Heck, I wish there was a place to go outside for the rest of us stuck in a stuffy airport all day. My favorite airport: Palm Springs!

 

[Teacher Terry]

IWP, if your dogs aren’t allowed in your home you shouldn’t have them. Dogs are pack animals and no more unsanitary than people.

 

[lwp2017]

IWP, if your dogs aren’t allowed in your home you shouldn’t have them. Dogs are pack animals and no more unsanitary than people.

You have your opinion, I have mine.

My dogs live in an outdoor kennel. They are well treated and have the run of my rural property in which they enjoy themselves immensely outdoors without disturbing others.

I don’t want dog hair, dog urine, and dog feces on my floors and furniture, to me that is unsanitary.

Pets defecate and urinate at will, thus for public health safety reasons, should not be allowed in public areas that serve or sell food.

What you do in your home is your right.

 

[Teacher Terry]

Trained dogs do not do their business at will. They do what they are trained to do. I hope you spend tons of time outside with them or why bother to have them. They are pack animals and need to be with their people. They are no more unsanitary than people. They

 

[ABQ2015]

I've seen two people in public with emotional support cats. Both of the cats looked very unhappy while the "emotionally insecure" owners were introducing their pets to other customers, explaining their own disabilities and the reason for the pet, and enjoying being in the spotlight. As an animal lover, this disgusted me that someone would put their desire for attention above the needs of their pet.

 

[marko]

In Europe it's very common to see a couple in a restaurant sitting there for an hour or two. Only when they get up do you see that they had a dog sleeping quietly under the table. Euro-dogs and children seem to behave better in restaurants for some reason.

OTOH, I'm quite bothered by people who, for $125 get a certificate for their "support animal" for no other reason than they want the animal to go wherever they want.

My friend (a very 'by the rules' guy) did that so that he can walk his dog on the beach where dogs are not normally allowed.

 

[Midpack]

I don't have a problem with well behaved pets (or children ) in most public places, but they should not be welcome in all places or if not properly looked after.

I didn't know before reading this thread, but many people may assume emotional support animals have the same rights to public places as bonafide service dogs (I wouldn't have known better), evidently that's largely not true. And buying an emotional support jacket online isn't enough either, the owner can be required to present a "special letter from a licensed mental health professional documenting the individual’s need for an emotional support animal." However, most people probably don't know to ask for documentation (I wouldn't have).

Even in housing, a landlord may be able to refuse an emotional support animal with a no pet policy (not as simple as that, but it has worked in some cases). And another landlord was able to refuse a tenant because she was legitimately allergic to pets, and had the right to access her property. Maybe a bogus tenant letter (all to easy these days) should be met with a bogus landlord allergy letter? https://www.abc15.com/news/let-joe-know/are-emotional-support-animals-protected-under-law

This is just like handicap parking, some selfish, thoughtless people routinely abuse that privilege if no one intervenes (admittedly easier said than done).

The ADA guarantees people with disabilities who use service dogs equal access to public places such as restaurants, hospitals, hotels, theaters, shops, and government buildings. This means that these places must allow service dogs, and the ADA requires them to modify their practices to accommodate the dogs, if necessary.

However, these protections only apply to dogs that satisfy the ADA’s definition of “service animal.” The ADA defines a service animal as a dog that is "individually trained" to "perform tasks for the benefit of an individual with a disability.” The tasks a dog has been trained to provide must be directly related to the person’s disability.

Housing
Under the Fair Housing Act, an individual with a disability may be entitled to keep an emotional support animal in housing facilities that otherwise do not allow pets. An emotional support animal—which can include animals other than dogs—must be permitted as a reasonable accommodation when an individual requires the animal in order to have an equal opportunity to use and enjoy the housing. The assistance the animal provides must relate to the individual’s disability.

Airlines
Under the Air Carrier Access Act (ACAA), a commercial airline must permit emotional support dogs and other animals to accompany qualified passengers with a disability on a flight. Airlines cannot require a passenger traveling with a service animal to help with a physical disability to provide written documentation that the animal is a service animal, but the same is not true for a psychiatric service animal or emotional support animal.
In both the housing and airline context, an individual with a disability will likely need to acquire a special letter from a licensed mental health professional documenting the individual’s need for an emotional support animal.

https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclop...rt-animals-access-public-places-settings.html

Even if a person qualifies for a reasonable accommodation under the statutes, a landlord does not have to waive a "no pets" policy if doing so would cause a great financial or administrative burden, if a "no pets" rule is a fundamental part of the housing program, or if the disabled person is not able to follow general rules of tenancy. However, to date, a landlord has not been able to refuse waiving a "no pets" policy to a qualifying mentally disabled person because of any of the above reasons.
In addition, if a tenant compromises the safety of other tenants or their property, or if the animal poses a danger to other tenants, the tenant does not qualify under the statutes and the landlord does not have to allow the tenant in housing or waive a "no pets" policy.

https://www.animallaw.info/intro/emotional-support-animals-and-waiver-no-pets-rules-landlords

 

[Amethyst]

I don't have a dog in this fight (lol) but I think this is a very recent attitude about pet dogs.

I seem to recall, as a little kid in the 1960's, almost every family on the street had a dog, whose purpose was to play outside with the kids. The dogs did not come into the house, at least not that I ever saw. Each dog had an outdoor doghouse and usually, a fenced-in piece of yard to run and [-]poop[/-] [-]bark[/-] play in. When it was cold/snowy outside, the dog would be housed in the garage.

Not saying this was fair to dogs, just saying that's how it generally used to be, at least in the suburbs I frequented.

IWP, if your dogs aren’t allowed in your home you shouldn’t have them. Dogs are pack animals and no more unsanitary than people.

 

[Midpack]

I don't have a dog in this fight (lol) but I think this is a very recent attitude about pet dogs.

I seem to recall, as a little kid in the 1960's, almost every family on the street had a dog, whose purpose was to play outside with the kids. The dogs did not come into the house, at least not that I ever saw. Each dog had an outdoor doghouse and usually, a fenced-in piece of yard to run and [-]poop[/-] [-]bark[/-] play in. When it was cold/snowy outside, the dog would be housed in the garage.

Not saying this was fair to dogs, just saying that's how it generally used to be, at least in the suburbs I frequented.

I don't doubt family pet practices may have changed some, but most family dogs I've ever known of spent quite a bit of time in the house, even when I was a kid. Anyone who left their dog outside or in the garage ALL the time was considered cruel. Dogs are social animals, they don't thrive if left alone all their lives, that hasn't changed. But we may have grown up in different places.

 

[marko]

. The dogs did not come into the house, at least not that I ever saw. Each dog had an outdoor doghouse and usually, a fenced-in piece of yard to run and [-]poop[/-] [-]bark[/-] play in. When it was cold/snowy outside, the dog would be housed in the garage.

Heck when we were kids our dog slept in our beds! We used to fight over who got to sleep with the dog that night

 

[marko]

A number of airlines are now taking a harder line on service animals. No pigs, roosters, peacocks, etc.

But I just saw on TV news yesterday that one airline is allowing "service horses!" Seriously. Seems you can take your miniature horse onboard with you.

 

[mystang52]

I'm in the camp of "it bothers me a LOT." And it bothers me because I doubt the validity of those service dog leashes. Call me naive, but I would think a service dog would be trained and well-behaved. I generally don't see that.
Frankly, I'm neutral if I see someone with a well behaved dog in Lowes. But I don't think I should be imposed upon at a restaurant. Here are 2 real-world examples from just the last 2 weeks:
I took 3 of my young grandchildren to a self-serve frozen yogurt place. In walks a woman with a supposed service dog.....on a long leash that was obviously too inconvenient to make shorter. She had the nerve to tell me to keep an eye on my grandkids, who by the way were well behaved.
A week ago I had same-day surgery on my shoulder. While in the recovery area, a man walks in with a big rambunctious dog. The nurses immediately blocked him from getting in further and forced him to leave.....over his objections.

I'm sure there are some real needs for service dogs. But this has been abused to the point the powers-that-be need to rethink this.

 

[ponyboy]

We now live in an entitled society. People think they can do whatever they want regardless of the rules.

We'll take our dog to pet friendly places...but we've never thought about getting an emotional support vest or service dog vest, etc. My MIL does take our dog to an old person home where her mother is. The old people like him.

 

[kcowan]

We are dog and cat lovers. They always travelled with us in the animal compartment on the planes. This got them totally anxious. But they survived. We did pay to have the smaller cats on the planes but they were under the seats and passengers were unaware of them in their carriers.

We think people needing emotional support should not fly. Sorry.

 

[JustCurious]

And buying an emotional support jacket online isn't enough either, the owner can be required to present a "special letter from a licensed mental health professional documenting the individual’s need for an emotional support animal." However, most people probably don't know to ask for documentation (I wouldn't have).

That is only in the housing and airline contexts, does it apply to restaurants and grocery stores? I think the problem is the definition of "service animal" under the ADA is not well defined and not subject to verification or proof of any kind in terms of restaurants and grocery stores.

 

[DFDubb]

A week ago I had same-day surgery on my shoulder. While in the recovery area, a man walks in with a big rambunctious dog. The nurses immediately blocked him from getting in further and forced him to leave.....over his objections.

I've had a lot of surgery, oddly enough about 6 or 7 shoulder surgeries. The recovery areas, even for out patient procedures is well behind many layers of locked doors that someone with a dog could never get close to.

Are you sure you're not mobb'ed up and weren't getting operated on by a vet that honeymoons as a mob doctor out of the back of his animal hospital?

I'm joking, but seriously, I'd have MAJOR concerns about what you just described. I mean, the waiting area sure? My wife cannot even be brought back to recovery until cleared by the the staff. A random with a dog isn't getting past the reception area.

 

[swakyaby]

I've had a lot of surgery, oddly enough about 6 or 7 shoulder surgeries. The recovery areas, even for out patient procedures is well behind many layers of locked doors that someone with a dog could never get close to.

Are you sure you're not mobb'ed up and weren't getting operated on by a vet that honeymoons as a mob doctor out of the back of his animal hospital?

I'm joking, but seriously, I'd have MAJOR concerns about what you just described. I mean, the waiting area sure? My wife cannot even be brought back to recovery until cleared by the the staff. A random with a dog isn't getting past the reception area.

Actually, a determined person can get in the recovery room. I once personally witnessed a hysterical father follow the surgeon from the waiting room into the recovery room, shove a baby bottle in the mouth of his still anesthetized infant son in the recovery room, and cause his son to awaken, coughing, and sputtering. The recovery room nurse immediately pulled the bottle out of the child's mouth and told him, "You can't just come in here! We haven't sent for you yet." The father began hollering, "I am the father! I can do whatever I want! He's my son!" I said, "You're causing him to choke." Eventually, 3 people and the surgeon guided him back out to the waiting room. The young surgeon returned and said apologetically, "I didn't let him in, he just followed me in here."

 

[NW-Bound]

But I just saw on TV news yesterday that one airline is allowing "service horses!" Seriously. Seems you can take your miniature horse onboard with you.

How 'bout a snake for emotional support? A boa wrapped about one's neck?

... We think people needing emotional support should not fly. Sorry.

Aw, you are too mean. Snake lovers need to fly too.

 

[Winemaker]

What about those with pet allergies? DW is extremely allergic to cats; well not actually the cat, but the dried saliva (dander) that drys on the cat while grooming itself. My son used to have an allergy to dogs. If we bend over backwards for those with peanut allergies, why start to antagonize those with pet allergies? Current airline policy is to defer the allergy passenger to a later flight, but what the dander that was left from the previous flights. I haven't seen any airline employee run a HEPA vacuum between flights.