How to force a sale?

[Buckeye]

My sister and BIL are living in the same house and are legally married but in name only.

BIL is a total deadbeat and hasn't really made any money for the 20+ years he and my sister have been married. It all came crashing down when she lost her job a couple of years ago because she was the main (only?) breadwinner.. They almost lost the house a couple of times over the last couple of years. They filed for Chapter 13 about 3 months ago where their unsecured debt was discharged and the house payment was set at $1600 for 3 years to make up what was in arrears.

My sister currently has 2 part-time jobs that total about 30-35 hours per week at about $15-$17 per hour. BIL contributed $30 to the house payment last month and $100 the month before. As you might guess, my sister is stressed to the max and extremely angry he is living in the house but not paying his way.

Can the bankruptcy court force a sale (which my sister would initiate) or will that have to be done by a divorce decree? There is $75,000 - $100,000 equity in the house so my sister definitely wants to sell it versus letting it be repossessed. Unfortunately, BIL probably won't leave the house unless the sheriff is pointing a gun at him and ordering him out. It could take awhile for the divorce to be final because there is a minor child involved. My sister wants this over tomorrow! She is going soon to talk to the bankruptcy lawyer but I was wondering what anyone knew about how to force a sale sooner rather than later.

 

[pb4uski]

Sounds like she should be seeing a divorce lawyer rather than a bankruptcy lawyer.

 

[Buckeye]

Sounds like she should be seeing a divorce lawyer rather than a bankruptcy lawyer.

That was my suggestion but she was going to check if there might be a faster route through the bankruptcy lawyer. There's no charge for the visit.

 

[Walt34]

Either lawyer will refer her to the other if necessary I would hope, much as physicians refer patients to specialists all the time.

She's in for a rough time until the dust settles on this and she has a chance to start over.

 

[Buckeye]

Either lawyer will refer her to the other if necessary I would hope, much as physicians refer patients to specialists all the time.

She's in for a rough time until the dust settles on this and she has a chance to start over.

+1

It's been a rough 20 years and there's a few more to go.

 

[Lazarus]

Why does BIL not work when they are in such bad financial shape?

That said my household operated on a single paycheck, mine for 30 years. Wife did not work or worked little. You still have to live within your means.

Is BIL spending money above necessities?

 

[Buckeye]

Why does BIL not work when they are in such bad financial shape?

That said my household operated on a single paycheck, mine for 30 years. Wife did not work or worked little. You still have to live within your means.

Is BIL spending money above necessities?

If you ask BIL, he IS working and working hard! Unfortunately, it's at his own business (can you call it that if you never seem to have any profits?) designing and hosting websites (at least that's the most recent incarnation). He's a master BS'er but it's all talk and no results and he couldn't meet a deadline if his life depended on it. The world revolves totally around him and his needs and he uses everyone around him. A total and complete jerk although with some charisma that fools people until they finally figure out there is nothing under the surface.

No, there is no extra spending and never has been. We are just talking about the basics of shelter, food, utilities, medical bills, home repair, etc. My sister held it together until she got laid off and things really got bad because he did nothing to pick up the slack after she had been the main breadwinner for 20 years.

 

[Sarah in SC]

If there is any consolation to be had in this situation, it is that at last your sister is ending this parasitic relationship and can go on with the rest of her life without the albatross around her neck.
I don't know which way is faster, but I sense that she is going to be visiting a lot of lawyer's offices to make this happen!

 

[Lazarus]

If you ask BIL, he IS working and working hard! Unfortunately, it's at his own business (can you call it that if you never seem to have any profits?) designing and hosting websites (at least that's the most recent incarnation). He's a master BS'er but it's all talk and no results and he couldn't meet a deadline if his life depended on it. The world revolves totally around him and his needs and he uses everyone around him. A total and complete jerk although with some charisma that fools people until they finally figure out there is nothing under the surface.

No, there is no extra spending and never has been. We are just talking about the basics of shelter, food, utilities, medical bills, home repair, etc. My sister held it together until she got laid off and things really got bad because he did nothing to pick up the slack after she had been the main breadwinner for 20 years.

I would say that your sister should end the relationship. Divorce will force a sale.

 

[Buckeye]

If there is any consolation to be had in this situation, it is that at last your sister is ending this parasitic relationship and can go on with the rest of her life without the albatross around her neck.
I don't know which way is faster, but I sense that she is going to be visiting a lot of lawyer's offices to make this happen!

+1

Great description.....parasite!

 

[Texas Proud]

If there is any consolation to be had in this situation, it is that at last your sister is ending this parasitic relationship and can go on with the rest of her life without the albatross around her neck.
I don't know which way is faster, but I sense that she is going to be visiting a lot of lawyer's offices to make this happen!

I wonder why if a man decides to stay home and not work, he is an albatross in a parasitic relationship..... but if a woman does it, it is OK


This guy might be a jerk, but the lady was married to him for 20 YEARS, so she knew what he was and agreed to it... I do not see it as a parasitic relationship...

However, now that things have changed and he is not doing anything (or little) to help if the OP is correct, then I can see where people can get upset... but would you be just as upset at her if the roles were reversed If not... well....

 

[haha]

I wonder why if a man decides to stay home and not work, he is an albatross in a parasitic relationship..... but if a woman does it, it is OK

All the deluded gentlemen on this board who are now or have in the past considered retiring or semi-retiring or becoming house husbands while their better halves continue to work, take heed.

Nothing is more certain than whatever a society is most at pains to deny, is certainly true. In America we supposedly have equal expectations of the genders, but just reading this board it is obvious that this not true. Look how men here accept honey-do lists, which are actually only warranted in a boss/employee relationship.

It is very easy for a woman to lose respect for her man, if he is not carrying a good portion of whatever she considers the family load. Tens of thousands of years of human evolution support this.

Men, your wife will never admit this, but you forget it at your peril.

Ha

 

[RetiringAt55]

I wonder why if a man decides to stay home and not work, he is an albatross in a parasitic relationship..... but if a woman does it, it is OK

Both genders would be parasites unless there is a mutual agreement between the spouses that one should stay home.

 

[pb4uski]

Both genders would be parasites unless there is a mutual agreement between the spouses that one should stay home.

+1

 

[LakeTravis]

All the deluded gentlemen on this board who are now or have in the past considered retiring or semi-retiring or becoming house husbands while their better halves continue to work, take heed.

Nothing is more certain than whatever a society is most at pains to deny, is certainly true. In America we supposedly have equal expectations of the genders, but just reading this board it is obvious that this not true. Look how men here accept honey-do lists, which are actually only waranted in a boss/employee relationship.

It is very easy for a woman to lose respect for her man, if he is not carrying a good portion of whatever she considers the family load.

Men, your wife will never admit this, but you forget it at your peril.

Ha

Damn. That actually makes sense.

 

[Sarah in SC]

I wonder why if a man decides to stay home and not work, he is an albatross in a parasitic relationship..... but if a woman does it, it is OK

Sorry, did I say it was okay for a woman? Missed that, I guess. Lazy people come in all shapes, sizes, and even genders. If you aren't holding up your end of the bargain, however made, then there's a problem.

My marriage is made of sterner stuff than a lot of y'all's were/are, I guess. 20 years and still heading in the same direction.

 

[Buckeye]

I wonder why if a man decides to stay home and not work, he is an albatross in a parasitic relationship..... but if a woman does it, it is OK


This guy might be a jerk, but the lady was married to him for 20 YEARS, so she knew what he was and agreed to it... I do not see it as a parasitic relationship...

However, now that things have changed and he is not doing anything (or little) to help if the OP is correct, then I can see where people can get upset... but would you be just as upset at her if the roles were reversed If not... well....

If he was truly a house-hubby (cooked, cleaned, shopped, did laundry, made sure all the kid stuff was taken care of, did the yard work), it would be a different story. Unfortunately, my sister worked full-time and did most of the other chores also. She didn't want to be raising two kids completely on her own, so she made the calculation it was better to stay. She was starting to get her head screwed on right about 4 years ago but then the job loss and her choices became very limited. He also severely undermined her self-confidence and convinced her she couldn't do it all on her own which was really funny to those of us on the outside since she was ALREADY doing it all on her own!

 

[Buckeye]

Both genders would be parasites unless there is a mutual agreement between the spouses that one should stay home.

+1

He always shirked virtually all household and most parental responsibility (unless it was something fun like helping with a kid's sports team) because he was always so "busy" with whatever loser business he was working on. It wasn't "one work in the home, one work outside the home" situation. My mom paid years of Boys and Girls Club fees for good after-school care because BIL was "too busy" to watch the kids after school while my sis was working.

 

[Texas Proud]

Both genders would be parasites unless there is a mutual agreement between the spouses that one should stay home.

Kind of my point... she was there for 20 years, so there must have been some kind of mutual agreement...

She changed... he did not... to me that is the problem...

 

[Texas Proud]

Sorry, did I say it was okay for a woman? Missed that, I guess. Lazy people come in all shapes, sizes, and even genders. If you aren't holding up your end of the bargain, however made, then there's a problem.

My marriage is made of sterner stuff than a lot of y'all's were/are, I guess. 20 years and still heading in the same direction.

Agreed you did not say it, which is why I asked...

It seems like the hubby was holding his end of the bargain... even if it was way lopsided to her... or she would have divorced him many years ago.... at least that is my take on it...


I had a friend who had a co-worker who met and married a guy.... she was the only one who worked... they did not have kids... he stayed home and read books etc... lots of people disapproved of him because he was lazy... but they would not disapprove of a woman who did not work and went and played tennis etc... for me, as long as the other person is fine with the setup, why should I stick my nose in thier business....

I learned this from one of my BILs who one told me 'don't stick you nose in our marriage'...

 

[Texas Proud]

If he was truly a house-hubby (cooked, cleaned, shopped, did laundry, made sure all the kid stuff was taken care of, did the yard work), it would be a different story. Unfortunately, my sister worked full-time and did most of the other chores also. She didn't want to be raising two kids completely on her own, so she made the calculation it was better to stay. She was starting to get her head screwed on right about 4 years ago but then the job loss and her choices became very limited. He also severely undermined her self-confidence and convinced her she couldn't do it all on her own which was really funny to those of us on the outside since she was ALREADY doing it all on her own!

I agree... sometimes relationships are strange... and sometimes you wonder what the heck they see in their partner... I have a sister who was in one... she never saw his faults... she was in love... and they enjoyed 35 years of marriage... so, it worked for them... I learned how to deal with the guy... and he was actually a pretty neat guy if you did not have to deal with him all the time...

 

[Buckeye]

Kind of my point... she was there for 20 years, so there must have been some kind of mutual agreement...

She changed... he did not... to me that is the problem...

Yes, she changed. She basically had a nervous breakdown because she couldn't carry the load and the mental abuse anymore. If you didn't agree with him, his solution was to yell louder.

 

[Lazarus]

People change over time - or don't. Thats why divorce happens. Sometimes its best. No one should put up with abuse.

My wife has never made much money but has contributed in many other ways. I don't worry about it. It does seem that men who don't carry the financial load are looked down on. Even if that was the agreement.

 

[Buckeye]

I just reread some of the responses and I got the impression some of you might have assumed I was busting on BIL for his lack of financial support simply because he was "the man of the house" and was expected to "bring home the bacon." That's not the case at all and it never crossed my mind. In my family, my mom, my sister, and I have all been the primary breadwinners.

BIL should be help support his family financially because he's part of a team and the whole thing is going to go down the tubes if the bills aren't paid. I guess he assumes my sister will get the job done as she has done for the last 20 years. The ride on the gravy train might be over sooner than he thinks.

 

[ERD50]

All the deluded gentlemen on this board who are now or have in the past considered retiring or semi-retiring or becoming house husbands while their better halves continue to work, take heed.

Nothing is more certain than whatever a society is most at pains to deny, is certainly true. In America we supposedly have equal expectations of the genders, but just reading this board it is obvious that this not true. Look how men here accept honey-do lists, which are actually only warranted in a boss/employee relationship.

It is very easy for a woman to lose respect for her man, if he is not carrying a good portion of whatever she considers the family load. Tens of thousands of years of human evolution support this.

Men, your wife will never admit this, but you forget it at your peril.

Ha

There is a lot of truth to what you say. But I think you may be misreading some of the 'honey-do list' comments.

I've probably talked about my 'honey-do list'. And if it sounds like it's being forced on me, that's in jest (oh poor me, gotta do this or I'm in trouble!).

The reality is, I don't 'accept' those jobs as in a boss/employee relationship (do it or else). It's a team thing - she might mention that she thinks it would be nice to have a corner shelf added to the 4-season room, could I make one out of the cedar scraps we had left over so it all matches? And I say, yeah, I think so, and that sounds like a good idea. Or no, it would be in the way, maybe this or that instead, or forget about it. It usually goes smoothly, occasionally not, but life's not perfect.

And we each have a ton of jobs that never make it to any 'to-do' list, but we do what makes sense, again as a team. She's not going to fix and maintain cars, appliances or most typical 'handyman' type jobs (though I know some women are far handier than some men), would prefer I do the taxes and other financial matters. So I do those and she does a host of other things, meals most nights, shopping, the laundry, and on and on.

I agree with your 'evolution' comment, and I have sensed that from time to time. I find the cure is to do something more 'visible', so she sees the result of the work I do.

-ERD50