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Old 08-17-2019, 12:05 PM   #41
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My Son moved to California, became a resident, and attended Berkeley damn near free.

"Resident" is the key word.
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Old 08-17-2019, 01:31 PM   #42
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I don't think I can stomach ~300K for a 4 year degree (and heaven help us if it's a 5 year program) and I don't want him saddled with loans (under any circumstance). We do have a sizable amount saved in 529 but still have a very significant gap.
Just some food for thought, but for $300K you could buy a house for your offspring in a low - medium cost of living area, plus pay for a state school degree or get a degree alone from a more elite school. If I was given that choice, personally I would pick the house, live mortgage free my adult life, pick a good state school and major with a high ROI, and retire early.
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Old 08-17-2019, 02:40 PM   #43
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For $300K one can meet and marry a graduate that should have a great job and keep one living the dream for the rest of their life.
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Old 08-17-2019, 04:29 PM   #44
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So, Northeastern is a school that he is exploring that has a very good co-op program. I don't know all the details but it works similar to how you described below - they have a 4.5 Year Version and Full 5 Year Version from what I understand.
DH used to have co-op students from Northeastern on his teams at work. He always thought it was an excellent program and I know the company hired several of them full-time after graduation. Of course he also has stories about a few who saw it as more of an opportunity to experience Southern California than to gain work experience, and he had to have a few "shape up or ship out" conversations and a couple of them did get fired.

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My Son moved to California, became a resident, and attended Berkeley damn near free.

"Resident" is the key word.
I guess this was a while ago? Berkeley is far from free for CA residents nowadays, and you can't claim residency until you've lived here for at least a year and can prove that you've supported yourself from your own earnings for two years. This is probably not a viable path for OP's son if he wants to start college next year.

One other thing to look at is the 4-year graduation rate for whatever school he attends. Cal Tech, while probably just as expensive as an Ivy, is a great engineering school that graduates over 80% of its students in 4 years. A lot of state schools (including the UCs) can't make that claim, and when you figure 5+ years there vs 4 years at the more expensive private school, the cost differential can shrink quite a bit.
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Old 08-17-2019, 04:44 PM   #45
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I posted this on another site, but think it might belong here too.

This is going to sound snotty... but it's not meant to be.
For the student AND the parent... the college decision should be the number 1 priority, and accordingly, the preparation may well be the most important part of the next four years... monetarily as well as for future well being.

Unfortunately the selection process does not always reach to that level. Too often it is influenced by preconceived notions ... "We can only afford community college", "The guidance counselor suggested 'XYZ' or, "Your cousin Joey went there".

I'd like to cite as example that I know of (My Daughter in Law's work with her three children to work with and select the optimal school, and cost.) For each of the two sons and one daughter, she spent many.. many hours... researching, writing, visiting and seeking out the best combination of aid and future potential. This involved much work on the part of the kids, too.. as now, many schools not only look at grades, SAT scores or records of achievement outside of school... but also require the writing of essays.

In each case, submission of admission requests to as many as seven or eight colleges. I thought "crazy" at the time, but here's what happened. (I should add that all three kids are somewhat above average, so that helped.)

#1. Four year renewable scholarship for the first four years, and now in the second year of post graduate for which he also received a large subsidy.

#2. Received a Stamps scholarship
Stamps for four years... 100% Tuition, room and board, books, and $10,000 for an international trip during the last years of school. (he now has offers for postgraduate scholarships for his doctorate.

#3. Full tuition scholarship @ U of F in Tampa, and now a paid Associate in the Advanced Psychology Program pursuing PG degree.

Along the way dozens of rejections or failure to receive scholarship offers. Never talked about it this way, but I would guess many hundreds of hours in research and prep.

At this point, in today's dollars, I would guess between $800K and $1+M... and maybe more.

More discipline than I could muster, but a wonderful payoff, allowing my Son and DIL to retire @ 60, with no debt.
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Old 08-17-2019, 04:56 PM   #46
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Instead of quoting... best thing to do is to go to Niche, for specific ratings, costs and admission policy.

And, about "need" being required... yes and no... My school nominal costs is about $65K/yr, but the average scholarship is $41+...
Annual scholarship fund is $35M, for 1800 students.

Check it out here, for Bowdoin, and any other school.

https://www.niche.com/colleges/bowdoin-college/
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Old 08-17-2019, 05:04 PM   #47
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I'm pleased to see that my old school is #23 and priced below it's neighbors on the list.

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Old 08-17-2019, 05:19 PM   #48
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Georgia Tech has a co-op program and interesting research opportunities.
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Old 08-17-2019, 05:54 PM   #49
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Georgia Tech has a co-op program and interesting research opportunities.
I know a young man who just graduated with highest honors in computer engineering from there—he could have gone anywhere including Ivies and no question that his parents would have paid, and he picked Tech.
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Old 08-17-2019, 05:57 PM   #50
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1. Choice of major is most important decision. This is difficult for a 19yo to do (allow him to change his mind). The important part is to choose one with income potential (Engineering over liberal arts is a great start). Twenty years of moderately satisfying work can earn you the ability to do what you want for 30+ years.

2. Choice of school is about the culture at the school. This means to go visit, and talk to current students (especially the ones not giving the tour).

2a. Once school starts, pick classes from only the best professors until the choice of major is final.

3. I think the advantage for highly selective schools is only the network. For an introvert like myself, that wouldn't be capitalized upon. If the student is an extrovert, then he'll get the advantage of that network.

4. Scholarships come from many more sources than the school. Make the student apply for them if you can't "afford" the bill. BTW, with your income you can afford the bill, it's just a matter of what is more important to you.
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Old 08-17-2019, 06:20 PM   #51
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I posted this on another site, but think it might belong here too.

This is going to sound snotty... but it's not meant to be.
For the student AND the parent... the college decision should be the number 1 priority, and accordingly, the preparation may well be the most important part of the next four years... monetarily as well as for future well being.
Dayum. My parents told me they'd pay for state schools. I chose the one my boyfriend attended which was also Dad's alma mater. (And then the BF transferred to a school on the other side of the country.)

I like your DIL's approach though, because there are so many mediocre schools and programs out there now that employers can be very picky. I hope I'm around to influence my grandchildren's choices- the oldest is only 5 so I have awhile.
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Old 08-17-2019, 06:28 PM   #52
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I forgot to add that I also had a guaranteed job when I graduated.
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Old 08-17-2019, 11:38 PM   #53
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Talk to the admissions officers of the schools you are interested in. Schools have vastly different priorities in admissions and you may find that there are other opportunities that can help defray the cost during his tenure, or even a new rationale for you on how to get your head around it. Fore example, after the first year, many corporations will recruit summer interns from the best schools and offer employment to STEM students and even tuition reimbursement for those they want to ultimately recruit and hire. I had employees who got their undergrad degrees and MBAs paid for by my company.

Student loans, is another way to access money for school that the student can try and get their employer to pay when they are hired. If your son is a high-achiever and is committed to achieving his goals, the investment will pay for itself. (If not, it's a terrible waste of money.)

I learned a lot by visiting colleges with my nephew. CalTech for example is a school who chooses their students carefully and has no financial challenges to get the students they want to have. The flip side is that it is incredibly selective. But the programs - like the Mars Rovers - are unbelievable. Your son would have to bring a lot to the table - but some can. And it would be worth it even if you had to come up with 100%, which you ultimately wouldn't.

If your son isn't a valedictorian, there are plenty of great schools that are affordable, and have successful alumni; but are not Ivy League or Stanford. It's hard to get in to those schools and applying to both easier/more affordable and harder/more expensive schools is always a good strategy. Receiving a letter of acceptance is when the decision-making really happens. Good luck!
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Old 08-18-2019, 06:59 AM   #54
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Killing Them with Kindness

I'm happy to hear your portfolio is rolling along nicely. Just to add some context - the jump in income is very recent and we live in a HCOL area. Our goal is to find VALUE for MONEY investing in our child's education. It's an investment. The intent of The post was to try to understand different options and get information from parents/students of Top Schools. And I have received such great feedback and want to thank everybody for their advice. Thanks to some other posters, I was able to find that Northeastern awards up to 30K annually for the National Hispanic Merit Scholar (which my son earned ) Just one correction on your statement below. Many of the Ivy schools are need blind. So, those that are less fortunate can attend despite their family's limited resources at drastically reduced rates. It's an easy decision for those families (and may God bless them). It's not such an easy decision if you are fortunate to have resources. And therein, lies the conflict. It's a form of wealth re-distribution (with the University as the broker), IF you DECIDE to partake in it. And that's a BIG IF for us.

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This thread is about a non-problem in my opinion. I was early retired with 2 kids in college at one time. Our portfolio was up 2 years in a row by more than the TOTAL cost of a 4-year Harvard/Yale/Princeton/MIT/Stanford education. With income as high as the jt999 (the OP) reports which is several times my highest income, I realize that posting is about garnering sympathy, but it ain't coming from me.

Basically, somebody has to attend these expensive colleges and it might as well be the children of people who can trivially afford it such as the OP's family. The child probably won't get in anyways since they are very selective, so it is not something to really worry about.
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Old 08-18-2019, 07:24 AM   #55
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When I was younger, my mother would call this "cryin' the blues."
Time to give up the cash (get a loan) or go to second tier of choices.
Unless you're ultra-rich, paying for multiple college degrees is gonna hurt.
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Old 08-18-2019, 07:27 AM   #56
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That's a Great Story

Really went the extra mile to make it happen and it paid off!


Quote:
Originally Posted by imoldernu View Post
I posted this on another site, but think it
might belong here too.

This is going to sound snotty... but it's not meant to be.
For the student AND the parent... the college decision should be the number 1 priority, and accordingly, the preparation may well be the most important part of the next four years... monetarily as well as for future well being.

Unfortunately the selection process does not always reach to that level. Too often it is influenced by preconceived notions ... "We can only afford community college", "The guidance counselor suggested 'XYZ' or, "Your cousin Joey went there".

I'd like to cite as example that I know of (My Daughter in Law's work with her three children to work with and select the optimal school, and cost.) For each of the two sons and one daughter, she spent many.. many hours... researching, writing, visiting and seeking out the best combination of aid and future potential. This involved much work on the part of the kids, too.. as now, many schools not only look at grades, SAT scores or records of achievement outside of school... but also require the writing of essays.

In each case, submission of admission requests to as many as seven or eight colleges. I thought "crazy" at the time, but here's what happened. (I should add that all three kids are somewhat above average, so that helped.)

#1. Four year renewable scholarship for the first four years, and now in the second year of post graduate for which he also received a large subsidy.

#2. Received a Stamps scholarship
Stamps for four years... 100% Tuition, room and board, books, and $10,000 for an international trip during the last years of school. (he now has offers for postgraduate scholarships for his doctorate.

#3. Full tuition scholarship @ U of F in Tampa, and now a paid Associate in the Advanced Psychology Program pursuing PG degree.

Along the way dozens of rejections or failure to receive scholarship offers. Never talked about it this way, but I would guess many hundreds of hours in research and prep.

At this point, in today's dollars, I would guess between $800K and $1+M... and maybe more.

More discipline than I could muster, but a wonderful payoff, allowing my Son and DIL to retire @ 60, with no debt.
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Exactly
Old 08-18-2019, 07:31 AM   #57
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Exactly

We are looking at ALL choices (I wouldn't call them second tier). Loans are a big no-no for us. Now, I like the idea of settling on an amount we are willing to pay and then having our son take out a loan to pay for 1 year (have some extra skin in the game) IF he decides it's worth the extra cost.


Quote:
Originally Posted by target2019 View Post
When I was younger, my mother would call this "cryin' the blues."
Time to give up the cash (get a loan) or go to second tier of choices.
Unless you're ultra-rich, paying for multiple college degrees is gonna hurt.
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Old 08-18-2019, 08:34 AM   #58
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Originally Posted by target2019 View Post
When I was younger, my mother would call this "cryin' the blues."
Time to give up the cash (get a loan) or go to second tier of choices.
Unless you're ultra-rich, paying for multiple college degrees is gonna hurt.
Did you mean second tier pricing or second tier quality? They are not the same thing. I hate to think society has reached the point where it's OK to shame parents that don't want to shell out 300K for a bachelors degree for a teenage.
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Old 08-18-2019, 08:46 AM   #59
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Originally Posted by target2019 View Post
When I was younger, my mother would call this "cryin' the blues."
Time to give up the cash (get a loan) or go to second tier of choices.
Unless you're ultra-rich, paying for multiple college degrees is gonna hurt.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ivinsfan View Post
Did you mean second tier pricing or second tier quality? They are not the same thing. I hate to think society has reached the point where it's OK to shame parents that don't want to shell out 300K for a bachelors degree for a teenage.
Second tier of choices. It's precisely that in the post I made. Parent and child make a list of choices, right?
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Old 08-18-2019, 08:54 AM   #60
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I would echo what the other posters have written about having discussions about what you'll support and what you won't. It is very good to talk with your child about the amount of money available, what your priorities are (some parents want influence/input on the decision based on school / major / location - not me, but it's a reasonable option). I like systems where the kid has incentives to at least consider cost in their process.

OP, you are correct that the Ivy League doesn't offer merit scholarships. They are *incredibly* selective these days. These schools could take an entire entering class, throw them out, and replace them with a set of the next best students and arguably not even notice any reduction in quality. They turn down thousands of kids every year who are valedictorians with ridiculously good SAT scores, athletic achievements, community service, etc., etc. etc. Bottom line, they don't have to offer merit scholarships.

If I were you I would not put the Ivies on a pedestal though. They can be good schools, but the top notch schools just below the Ivies can be just as good or even better depending on how well the student fits at that school. Students at Stanford can pretty much write their own ticket, but it's not an Ivy. I went to an Ivy for the first five semesters of undergrad, then finished at a top-notch regional liberal arts university. I got a better education at the latter, in my opinion, and I've worked alongside Ivy grads here and there doing the same job getting the same pay. Ivies will get you connections in areas like investment banking and executive positions in major metro areas, so depending on what degree your son chooses and how ambitious he is, that could pay off. But most of the time, the kid who could get into an Ivy will do just as well regardless of school - I believe there are studies showing that to be true in terms of salaries at least.

What I did with my second and third kid was to talk about career options in high school and have them at least have some ideas about what direction they wanted to go. We added in school size, location, and selectivity to the mix, aiming for schools where they were in about the 75th percentile of the student body, which helps get scholarships and is a good idea per Outliers (Maxwell) I think. I'm dropping the second kid off at college today, and the third kid already has school and major picked out and will go a year from now. It seems to be working, but of course, lots of ways to skin a cat.

Good luck!
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