Poll: How Many Of Us Are Professional Engineers

[Nords]

Those that go into power systems or controls engineering seem to get it at least occasionally. I have one of those working for me now! He also used to design/spec a lot of industrial HVAC systems.

One of my shipmates got his EE in college, finished out his Navy obligation by getting his MSEE on shore duty, and then got a EE job in Oregon.

The first thing they did was send him back to school for his EE PhD (at their expense). After that he finally got around to pursuing a PE...

One very happy ex-nuke.

 

[Alan]

It's rather unusual for a EE to get their PE certification. It's simply not needed in most EE careers. Now that I think about it, once I graduated college I don't remember it ever coming up - at my company nor at the many high tech firms I interacted with.

I actually did a 4 year EE degree (normally only 3 years in the UK) that included 18 months in industry and was an EIT on graduation. I continued working with the company that sponsored me and since it was a Defence contractor and I was working as a radar engineer on guided weapons systems, then becoming a PE was important.

After I'd switched careers, into the Chemical industry, I found it wasn't necessary to keep it up.

 

[Ed_The_Gypsy]

PEs are desirable in the engineering/construction business but less so in other industries. It is taken as a sign of competence. A US PE has impact. It is by test and requires recommendation by other PEs.

I got mine because my (international E&C) company at the time paid another $300/month if you got one. Never used it. Never bought a stamp. But it certainly helps me get work.

 

[Htown Harry]

Pursuing a PE in nuclear engineering sounds like a terrible life, if indeed such a designation even exists.

Here you go Nords: misery on a CD-ROM.

ANS / Store / Special Publications / Professional Engineering Examination Study Guide for Nuclear Engineers

 

[cashbalancetrouble]

PE in Ohio, Retired and let registration lapse as they did not have a retired status. Still have the license on the office wall.

 

[Omalley]

Graduated in Civil from Kansas State. Worked as bridge engineer, environmental engineer, and general civil. Let my PE lapse after finishing MBA. Now work in accounting at super-mega Corp.

 

[Nords]

Here you go Nords: misery on a CD-ROM.
ANS / Store / Special Publications / Professional Engineering Examination Study Guide for Nuclear Engineers

Yikes!

I think I'll pass that one right on down to the next generation...

 

[Htown Harry]

Software Engineering exam ready to

From my P.E. quarterly newsletter:

In the April 2013 exam administration, NCEES will implement changes to two examinations and introduce a new examination.
• PE Software Engineering—The Principles and Practice of Engineering (PE) Software Engineering exam will be offered for the first time in April 2013. The new exam specifications will be posted on ncees.org. IEEE-USA (the sponsoring technical society) will publish study materials later this year.

Here's the outline:

http://engineers.texas.gov/downloads/ncees_PESoftware_2013.pdf

Seems to me both the breadth and depth of subjects covered is pretty impressive, representative of someone with a Masters of Computer Science in EE or CS with knowledge well beyond the code. In fact, unless I missed it, there's nothing in the exam specifically about code.

I be interested in the reaction from those in the field.

 

[M Paquette]

From my P.E. quarterly newsletter:

Here's the outline:

http://engineers.texas.gov/downloads/ncees_PESoftware_2013.pdf

Seems to me both the breadth and depth of subjects covered is pretty impressive, representative of someone with a Masters of Computer Science in EE or CS with knowledge well beyond the code. In fact, unless I missed it, there's nothing in the exam specifically about code.

I be interested in the reaction from those in the field.

Reaction? BWA..HaHaHa...

Seriously, though, It's a Good Thing. I very much prefer that there be some sort of standard reflecting a breadth and depth of knowledge before someone can call themselves an engineer. (Plus there's the whole guild thing, what with there being multiple generations of Professional Engineers of assorted flavors in my family.)

I have my doubts about most folks with a job title of Software Engineer passing this exam.

Far too many employers tag every software coder and tester in the business with the title of Software Engineer. There's much more to software engineering than coding. We generally don't put up with titling everyone drafting a blueprint as a Civil Engineer or Structural Engineer, for good reasons. Drafting skills, while darn useful, are not the primary thing I'd be looking for in someone to design and supervise the construction of a dam or a major power line.

As software moves from an interesting peripheral to projects to becoming a major component, good engineering becomes more important. We could tolerate bad software in an automobile entertainment system. Any software glitches in an engine control system are undesirable and could put the driver in a bad situation. With autonomous vehicles like the Google self-driving car, software bugs have the potential to be very dangerous to the occupants and others around them. Good engineering skills, from requirements specifications, through detailed design, proper error handling and safe failure mode specifications, into solid coding and detailed test and test coverage analysis become very important.

 

[RunningBum]

Far too many employers tag every software coder and tester in the business with the title of Software Engineer. There's much more to software engineering than coding. We generally don't put up with titling everyone drafting a blueprint as a Civil Engineer or Structural Engineer, for good reasons. Drafting skills, while darn useful, are not the primary thing I'd be looking for in someone to design and supervise the construction of a dam or a major power line.

As software moves from an interesting peripheral to projects to becoming a major component, good engineering becomes more important. We could tolerate bad software in an automobile entertainment system. Any software glitches in an engine control system are undesirable and could put the driver in a bad situation. With autonomous vehicles like the Google self-driving car, software bugs have the potential to be very dangerous to the occupants and others around them. Good engineering skills, from requirements specifications, through detailed design, proper error handling and safe failure mode specifications, into solid coding and detailed test and test coverage analysis become very important.

Maybe that's why companies call their programmers "engineers". They want them to have the engineer mentality, exactly those things listed. People can tolerate bad software in non-critical pieces but it does cost the company plenty in support, bug fixing, and loss of sales. Call someone an engineer, and hopefully they'll think like an engineer, even without the certification.

I never called myself an engineer other than to state what my job title was just so there was no confusion with some other term I'd choose to use instead. But I did think of the process of my work as engineering.

Someone earlier mentioned the term "Doctor". Unless you really consider a PhD a Doctor, I think that's an even more misused term.

 

[Htown Harry]

Good comments. I agree.

As I think about this, I am wondering who will actually take the exam.

Typically, a candidate for a license takes a "fundamentals" exam around the time he /she graduates from college. The subject matter is heavy on sophomore- and junior-level engineering course work common to all of the engineering disciplines, with some flexibility available for the candidate to pick a few modules of the test that are specific to his major. (At least that's what I remember.)

Later, having posted a passing score on the fundamentals exam, paying some money to be designated as an EIT, gaining 5+ years of documented experience in engineering work, and with recommendations from P.E.'s, the candidate can sit for a "principles and practice" exam that is 100% discipline specific. That would be mechanical, electrical, etc. And now "software".

The registration rules also have some pretty tight restrictions on the education side. It's possible to get registered as a P.E. without a B.S. in engineering, but it's a very steep hill to climb. And getting tougher as the years go by.

I see that IEEE or one of the other electrical engineering associations took the lead in preparing this exam outline.

I'm thinking the most likely candidate for pursuing "P.E., software engineering" is someone like DFW_M5 or gsparks, an experienced engineering graduate who has the BSEE and an old EIT designation, but never saw the need to sit for the EE exam.

But why would someone sign up now, given the pain of taking the P&P exam?

 

[packrat44]

EIT CIRCA 1977, never pursued the license.

Similar. EIT 1971. Did not have a need for a PE.

 

[RE2Boys]

EIT since 1971, never did anything more as never was a requirement for a job.

 

[H2ODude]

Had to have it to move up in consulting. Then worked public sector, requirement pretty much. Father was chem-e in industry, always sort of ridiculed the PE thing as most in his area were "huh? what's a PE?" Son (chem-e) had to get his to move up in consulting firm, felt sorry for him as he discovered this need at about 32, EIT is a hard thing to take that far out of school.

 

[Koogie]

How many of you are Unprofessional Engineers ? ha

 

[FUEGO]

How many of you are Unprofessional Engineers ? ha

I work with a few of those...