Retire Early – “When you come to a fork in the road take it.”

[dex]

I am at that point in my Retire Early (50 y/o single – planning for 4/06 out) process where I am reminded of choices and opportunities wherever I look. The other night was another example of this.

I was out to dinner with several young people in a high priced steak restaurant. One of the young people was a boy still in college who just got back from 6 months in Europe. A second was a young man on his second job out of college still paying his dues in a low paying position. The third was a younger woman in her second position out of college also. She had three majors in college and received her MBA afterward because she realized that her college majors would not pay her bills.

So while I sitting there I’m looking around the restaurant at the patrons thoughts of forks in the road came to mind. The restaurant was crowed and had that paneled look you would expect in a high-level steak restaurant. The food and wine were first rate. The young women were mostly very good-looking and very well dressed. There was also the members of the old money club there – the men and women in their late 60’s or early 70’s out for the night. Now, I did not come from money and my family could not afford to go out to dinners together. The only dinners out I remember were for school graduations and those stopped as time went on so I appreciate a good restaurant and meal on many levels.

For the young people it was not unusual in some ways – their parents are well off and pay for their expenses. This is not to say they did not appreciate the dinner. They dressed well and were interesting to talk with about their experiences and where they are in their lives.

So how does this all play into early retirement? From the young person’s point of view I am the old (er) man who has accomplished much and in some respects they want to get to where I am. I am where some desire to be. From my point of view I see the restaurant as road not taken when I RE (yes I will be able to afford to eat at this restaurant again but, at $100 per person not every week). It is a goal that I have been raised to want to reach. I never really had other goals and I never felt joy in working in the corporate world. (There is so much easy money to be made there with a little work.) I could continue to keep working but in truth while I like the restaurant I don’t eat there that often.

Reading this may lead you to believe that I am leaning towards not RE. No, to the contrary; it puts things in perspective. I am not those young people starting out in life and while I enjoy a good meal, I am not one the patrons in the restaurant. This exercise help me to define how I want to live my life in early retirement. Simply stated I want to approach it with the energy, drive and curiosity of the young and enjoy its fruits with the appreciation of the old.

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“Never suffer a thought to be harbored in your mind which you would not avow openly. When tempted to do anything in secret, ask yourself if you would do it in pubic. I you would not, be sure it is wrong.” Letter from Thomas Jefferson to his grandson Francis Eppes, age 14. “But Jefferson was not instructing Eppes in social niceties; neither was he denying him the privacy of his own mind nor cautioning him against hypocrisy. Jefferson was suggesting that by nurturing unexpressed ideas, each of us risks becoming a cult of one, our beliefs untested and unsupported. It is by airing our thoughts that we can discover their flaws and our fatuities.” Randy Cohen

[Nords]

Even more than some of the alleged food items I've eaten over the years, the idea of paying $100 for a meal makes me want to gag...

[Jarhead*]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nords Even more than some of the alleged food items I've eaten over the years, the idea of paying $100 for a meal makes me want to gag...

Nords, you're a hoot.

(Although at this stage in my life, I totally agree with you.)

Especially if there are crows in the restaurant.

[Nords]

Quote:

Originally Posted by TromboneAl Especially if there are crows in the restaurant.

I was thinking about the Vietnamese-cuisine restaurant on Monterey's 1980s Cannery Row that always had a herd of feral kitties hanging around the back door where the chefs cleaned the fish. The back door fronted the bicycle/pedestrian trail where we took our evening strolls.

One evening we noticed that the herd had thinned out a little.

When the news broke, the restaurant went through an interesting dichotomy. Of course all the mainstream diners vacated the premises & never returned. However the ethnic gourmands, so to speak, came from far & near to boost the business until the Board of Health shut them down for good.

We used to eat at a wonderful (& cheap) Chinese restaurant a few miles away. We were also volunteer guides at the Monterey Bay Aquarium and one night our crew decided to go out for a shift dinner. When we found out that the restaurant had a regular menu for the farangs and a special menu for those who could speak Mandarin, we were able to arrange a seafood dinner of the same species that we'd been showing off in the Aquarium's touch tank that day... yummy, but not something that we felt we had to repeat.

[preben]

Good original post - not much to add. Many of my friends are just finishing university (I do all the "young" stuff still and am mentally still around 16...) and are also seeing me as some kind of role model... little do they know .
I have, while working, done my fair share of fine dining at 5 star hotels Etc. with both the bill being picked up by my company and with myself paying.
I realized a while ago that paying $100+ for a meal was not something that made my enjoyment stronger - but like the dex it is nice to know that I CAN do it - should I want to.
What makes the enjoyment better for me is the company/friends I have during the meal - even Macd is OK in good company!
(Ps. and I also like a good deal...)
Cheers!

[maddythebeagle]

I dont think that I would eat at such a joint even if somebody paid for it for me.

[laurence]

Well, after the company golf tournament last week (came in 4th, not bad!), me and a co-worker were asked out to dinner by two business contacts who were at the tournament. They wanted to chat about "future work we might do together". My buddy and I weren't sure we were up for it until they said, "We were thinking Ruth's Chris Steakhouse, is that o.k.?"

Bombay Saphire Gin and Tonic, Cabernet with my Filet Mignon (Medium Rare, thank you) and a latte with dessert. I truly enjoyed the meal, but no way going back if I have to pay!

...so I won't mind grilling my own if that let's me ER.

Great post, dex.

The realization that you are giving up a certain lifestyle, as well as the ego gratification from earning a position to which others aspire is understandably unsettling.* Or at least enough to put you in a contemplative place.* However, as much as you never derived joy from your corporate position, it was a significant part of you life.* By taking an early retirement, you are forcing yourself out of your comfort zone.

That ain't a bad thing...

[cute fuzzy bunny]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laurence Cabernet with my Filet Mignon

At least you werent forced into any ridiculous wine pairings

Quote:

...so I won't mind grilling my own if that let's me ER.

But will you buy the whole filet wholesale and cut your own?

[deserat]

I have had over $100 meals, but they were few and far between--and usually the tab was picked up by someone else. Funny story, I was at a very high end restaurant in San Francisco and someone at the table wanted to order wine - my colleague was enamored of Pinot Noir and to impress us, the vendor ordered a $250 bottle of the supposed gold medal winner Pinot Noir. It came to the table and I tried it. Immediately I tasted mold and made a comment to that - a doctor friend of mine echoed the complaint. My colleague and the vendor pooh-poohed us, but I told the sommalier to take it away and bring me a simple red wine. I personally think the wine had gone bad....as I've had many Pinots from Alsace since then and don't remember any mold-like taste. Wasn't worth it in my estimation.

Actually, the secret to enjoying something like an excellent dinner out is to make it happen not so often so that one can truly enjoy it and consider it a treat. Like when one is hungry and food tastes great - it's having gone without that makes one's senses come alive with the new (or fairly new) sensation. You create a mini-SEE (significant emotional experience) with the concommitant memory imprint.

Off soapbox-Bridget

[dex]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ben I have, while working, done my fair share of fine dining at 5 star hotels Etc. with both the bill being picked up by my company and with myself paying. I realized a while ago that paying $100+ for a meal was not something that made my enjoyment stronger - but like the dex it is nice to know that I CAN do it - should I want to. What makes the enjoyment better for me is the company/friends I have during the meal - even Macd is OK in good company! (Ps. and I also like a good deal...) Cheers!

Ben,
I have found that there is an inverse relationship between the need for high quality/price food and wine and the quality of the company. (This excludes you siginficant other; because making him/her happy makes you happy.)
You sound as if you are on a good path.

[unclemick]

Fine dining - down by one of the seafood docks - before Ms Paula shut down and ducked taped two freezers shut for TS Cindy. Take out for three - $ 27 - spicy chicken breasts, sallopini chicken, tuna salad, angel hair pasta with garlic/oil, peas, corn, fried cheese sticks. Canary Islander ancestry so her spices aren't say Creole. Tropical storm special - so extra portions of everything. Beverage supplied at home. Good stuff - not a hurricane party - just good food.

Fancy dining is a memory of working days and tdy or expense accounts, first job out of college(penthouse period), and when I first hit New Orleans. Never became habit forming.

[MJ]

I have never spent $100 on a meal. The closest I got was $140 about 10 years ago for myself and telcomm vendor. She was leaving her company and she sorta convinced me to take her out for a payback dinner. She kinda suckered punched me by recommending this expensive restaurant. I sweated a bit when I handed in the bill. I was pretty sure that they would reject it but they didn't.

The food and wine was great !

[MRGALT2U]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MJ I have never spent $100 on a meal. The closest I got was $140 about 10 years ago for myself and telcomm vendor. She was leaving her company and she sorta convinced me to take her out for a payback dinner. She kinda suck punched me by recommending this expensive restaurant. I sweated a bit when I handed in the bill. I was pretty sure that they would reject it but they didn't. The food and wine was* great !

I've gone over $100 lots of times (for 2). Can't recall that the extra money
produced all that memorable a dining experience. I do remember that it
was always better when someone else picked up the tab.

JG

[Martha]

Growing up rural and all, I have always been uncomfortable in the fancy pants restaurants. And my husband is too good of a cook.

I remember when I was first an associate at my firm. Me and about 5 others were pretty new. They gave us each a credit card and encouraged us to take clients out on the firm's dime. Instead, we all went out together, ate and drank too much, and the bravest of us all put the event on the firm credit card. We would have been fired but there was so much work to do that they settled for a stern lecture. It was worth it.

[dex]

I didn't think there would be so many comments about the cost of the meal.

[Jarhead*]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martha Growing up rural and all, I have always been uncomfortable in the fancy pants restaurants.* And my husband is too good of a cook. I remember when I was first an associate at my firm.* Me and about 5 others were pretty new.* They gave us each a credit card and encouraged us to take clients out on the firm's dime.* Instead, we all went out together, ate and drank too much, and the bravest of us all put the event on the firm credit card.* We would have been fired but there was so much work to do that they settled for a stern lecture.* It was worth it.

Martha: You're a naughty girl.

[unclemick]

That's because some of us cannot match the deep philosophical insights of your original post.

Still thinking about it. $ I relate to instantly.

Heh, heh, heh.

[preben]

He,he - yeah dex, I had nothing to add to your great initial post - but meal prices is a favorite subject!
I just the other day had a great chicken/curry with steamed veggies+rice and a cold beer for $2 in Thailand - hard to beat!
Cheers!