RV's---never again

[youbet]

My 5th wheel RV is fiberglass. No problems so far.

My Aliner hard-sided pop-up is fiberglass. They switched from aluminum construction a while back. It's only 4 years old, but so far no issues with frame rust, soft floors or skin delamination. It's stored outdoors and still looks new. Hope this keeps up!

 

[MRG]

In '78 I was in a 3 month trade school. One of the other students had his parents old Airsteam. I think he said it was a '39. Seemed pretty nice, of course expectations change in 36 years.
MRG

 

[ls99]

My last one was an Argosy, made by Airstream.

No problems at all with Aluminum skin. However there were some really stupid design/implementation problems.

The bottom was fully enclosed, good. The bottom panels curved upward to meet the side skin. They lapped the bottom to the OUTSIDE of the side skin, thus any water running down would go inside the bottom skin.

Door, a suicide door. If the lock gave way the door would open and them be blown backwards, likely ripping off the hinges. Made special bracket to to ensure it would stay closed even if lock broke.

The door lock. A miserable construction, had to be extremely gentle in closing, as it was prone to breakage. It was unobtanium. To replace with anything else required surgery to remove old one.

As in all older RV's the Converter/charger was very efficient at boiling battery acid.

The battery box, just large enough for a smallish battery, to use anything with larger AH capacity would require surgey again. Fortubatly nowadys sealed battery can be had and put inside, no venting required.

A minor pain, the antenna downlead was well buried twin lead, thus routed next to the aluminum skin totally messed up the impdeance, to replace with coax required removal of interior paneling. Lots of riveting but doable about 8 hours of labor. I set it up for an Amateur radio 2 meter foldback antenna.

But it towed real nice, and sold it for more $ than I paid for it after using it for about 5 years.

 

[Fermion]

The bottom was fully enclosed, good. The bottom panels curved upward to meet the side skin. They lapped the bottom to the OUTSIDE of the side skin, thus any water running down would go inside the bottom skin.

That is just pure stupid. We have never built a camper before this one and we got that correct! (aluminum roof laps OVER the side skin, side skin laps OVER the bottom skin)

 

[travelover]

......... However there were some really stupid design/implementation problems............

I don't think that most RVs are actually engineered - mostly just assembled in a pole barn somewhere.

 

[Purron]

I have enough trouble dealing with a regular vehicle. Plus, after reading "Doctor Sleep", I find RV's kinda scary....

 

[ls99]

I don't think that most RVs are actually engineered - mostly just assembled in a pole barn somewhere.

Airstream/Argosy was founded by a couple of former aircraft design engineers. Can't remember what brand.

Edit add: by the way AVION RVs of old were supposedly far better than Airstream anything. Hard to find them nowadays. THe new fiberglass ones I know zero about.

 

[Gumby]

The treated wood in your trailer probably contained chromium copper arsenate (CCA), which used to be the standard wood preservative. It, and almost every other newer wood preservative, contains copper of some type. That copper in contact with the aluminum was likely the source of your trouble.
Aluminum and copper are some distance apart on the galvanic corrosion table, indicating a good chance that corrosion will occur if conditions are right.
The issue with PT wood corroding aluminum is well known in the building trades: Aluminum nails and fittings aren't used with pressure treated wood and any aluminum flashing needs a barrier between the wood and the AL to prevent corrosion.
I guess the builder of the trailer just didn't care.
From what I've seen, builders of many RV's have great faith in the ability of caulk to keep water out. In my opinion, any design that depends on caulk as the primary/only water barrier between surfaces that are subject to vibration, exposure to UV light, and to large changes in temperature is a design for failure.

So it would seem wise to have some replaceable zinc bolted to the aluminum to act as a sacrificial anode.

 

[youbet]

As in all older RV's the Converter/charger was very efficient at boiling battery acid.

It is amazing how far they have come with converter technology. The WFCO in my Aliner includes a 25A three stage charger which does a great job on everything from float to rapid charge. I was able to get 4 years out of the original cheapo deep cycle battery thanks to proper charging

The battery box, just large enough for a smallish battery, to use anything with larger AH capacity would require surgey again.

This hit me in spades. After four seasons, I wanted to get a new battery and figured I might as well put in a size 27 in place of the size 24. I already had a size 27 battery box in the garage I used to use for the trolling motor on the boat. But wait....... ! When I tried to mount the size 27 box where the size 24 box had been, it interfered with the two propane tanks. Now I'm figuring out how to jury rig a way to mount it without having to do any cutting and welding of the L brackets that hold the battery box. There's always something........

 

[ls99]

Just to add to the "design features";

All of the marker lights, incandescent of course, were fed from tow vehicle's headlight switch's accessory contacts. Which are reted just good enough to run the TV's own accessory lights.

On my Argosy I added a relay, which was activated by the accessory line from the 7 way plug, and the actual marker lights were fed via the relay contacts from the RV's battery, which was fed from the TV's battery line a far hevier wire and not routed through any switch.

 

[travelover]

Airstream/Argosy was founded by a couple of former aircraft design engineers. Can't remember what brand.

Edit add: by the way AVION RVs of old were supposedly far better than Airstream anything. Hard to find them nowadays. THe new fiberglass ones I know zero about.

Agree - Airstream / Argosy are more an exception to the rule as far as RVs go. Most are just slapped together.

I always admired the GMC motor homes. Quirky, but with more actual engineering than most.

 

[NW-Bound]

Regarding the OP's bad experience with his Lance truck camper, I found that this manufacturer was not too badly rated by buyers, according to the following site. Admittedly, the count of responses for each manufacturer is not that high, so the ratings may not be accurate as they would be across a larger sample.

RV Rating - Customer Survey of RV Makes and Models

It shows that Lance is rated 4.5 stars, the same as Lazy Daze. There are a few makers that are rated 5 stars, and many I have never heard of. I have read that many top brands went defunct because the sales price was higher than the norm; quality does not come cheap.

On the other hand, things do not last forever, and a lower cost vehicle that lasts as long as the owner's interest in this traveling mode is perhaps the most suitable. My generic class C had only 25K miles when I bought it. The 1st owner drove it 15K miles, the 2nd owner 10K miles. It's at 45K miles now, which would be a lot higher if it were not for my wife's occupied time to tend to my late FIL, and then for my sudden health problem last year. I hope to return to RV'ing this year, so I can drive it to the ground.

All motorhomes have some problems. I found a blog of a Roadtrek owner who bought his expensive motorhome new. He had to take it back to the dealer several times for warranty repair, but he still loved it. There were even a few features that were never installed correctly or only half-way, and the dealer and he did not know enough to check out thoroughly at delivery inspection.

 

[samclem]

So it would seem wise to have some replaceable zinc bolted to the aluminum to act as a sacrificial anode.

As a practical matter, approx how far away could the zinc be located and still "donate" across the aluminum? It could be a good backup to other methods of protection.

I've always depended on physical separation of the dissimilar metals, when possible. Neoprene washers, plastic film, etc.

 

[samclem]

On the other hand, things do not last forever, and a lower cost vehicle that lasts as long as the owner's interest in this traveling mode is perhaps the most suitable.

But a trailer (as opposed to a motorhome, van conversion, etc) is a very simple thing with few parts subject to wear, etc. It should be practical and not costly at all to build one correctly from the start. For example, it would have cost virtually nothing to put plastic between the aluminum and the treated wood in the OP's trailer, and only a few dollars to use fasteners that are of the proper type to avoid galvanic corrosion. It costs virtually nothing to put things subject to wear (water pumps, batteries, relays, etc) in places where they can be accessed and serviced easily.
I guess the problem ultimately is attributable to consumers. If they don't demand a well-engineered and built product then the mfgrs won't make them right and won't see any value in trumpeting the longevity features in their marketing. The trailer with the coolest stickers on the outside wins.

 

[bjorn2bwild]

For example, it would have cost virtually nothing to put plastic between the aluminum and the treated wood in the OP's trailer, and only a few dollars to use fasteners that are of the proper type to avoid galvanic corrosion.

My last two trailers had 1/4' plywood over the untreated wood studs to which the aluminum siding was stapled. I think the OP's treated wood camper was the exception, not the industry standard.
I view RV ownership the same way I view home ownership. They will need to be regularly maintained in order to prevent reabsorption into the earth.

 

[NW-Bound]

But a trailer (as opposed to a motorhome, van conversion, etc) is a very simple thing with few parts subject to wear, etc. It should be practical and not costly at all to build one correctly from the start. For example, it would have cost virtually nothing to put plastic between the aluminum and the treated wood in the OP's trailer, and only a few dollars to use fasteners that are of the proper type to avoid galvanic corrosion. It costs virtually nothing to put things subject to wear (water pumps, batteries, relays, etc) in places where they can be accessed and serviced easily.
I guess the problem ultimately is attributable to consumers. If they don't demand a well-engineered and built product then the mfgrs won't make them right and won't see any value in trumpeting the longevity features in their marketing. The trailer with the coolest stickers on the outside wins.

I cannot speak about aluminum-skinned RVs, as I do not own one.

My motorhome is built with now standard fiberglass construction. The large sidewalls and the rear cap are continuous flat pieces. It had a few leaks that I was able to detect and stopped before it got too late. Some were seal deterioration at the seams where the large components meet. These have to be inspected and maintained.

However, some leaks were due to poor workmanship, for example leaks at the running lights mounted high at the nose of the MH, at the overcab bed area. I found that they did not put down any sealant there at all, and water leaked into the holes cut for the wires. The lazy assembler apparently skipped this step.

I did find a couple of problems that were due to poor design, not workmanship. But overall, this motorhome did not give me that much trouble. It requires some maintenance, not unlike what one does for a stick-built house.

 

[HFWR]

When I tried to mount the size 27 box where the size 24 box had been, it interfered with the two propane tanks.

Good to know they conveniently mount the battery next to the propane tanks...

 

[travelover]

Good to know they conveniently mount the battery next to the propane tanks...

That is so if you can't get the battery's hydrogen to fire off, you have a second chance with the propane.

 

[NW-Bound]

Travel trailers typically have the propane tanks and the battery box out on the tongue, in open air. So, the risk of battery gas explosion is minimal. My MH has the batteries boxed in a steel case, with a steel lid.

There are quite a few RV fires each year, and I suspect that loose or chafed wiring is often the cause. I have told the following story, which is worth repeating.

After getting the MH, I went through all the electrical wiring because I had a few mods in mind and wanted to know about the existing wiring and how things worked. I put a load on the batteries by turning all the lights on, and measured the voltage drop across each connection, each contact point. I found a big drop of perhaps a few tenths of a volt across a battery post contact. That was way too high for a current of perhaps 20A max.

So, I wiggled the wire while measuring the voltage, and saw that the voltage drop fluctuated. Then, the big AWG2 cable in my hand came off its crimped lug! This was a short cable that linked the two batteries.

Holy smoke! If this happened while I was driving, the end of this loose cable would short against the battery steel housing which was grounded. Result: a fire, and possible loss of the MH. It was hair raising, just thinking of the potential problem.

So, I redid all the heavy cables, using good tin-plated marine cable and good marine solder cup lugs. I also put in 200A inline fuses to support the added 2KW pure sine wave inverter.

I also found that the house batteries were linked to the engine starting battery (via an isolation relay) by a long AWG2 cable that snaked under the chassis and through the engine compartment. No fuses at all! If this big cable got chafed and shorted to the chassis, imagine what would happen. So, I put a fuse at each end.

 

[Nobulife]

Warped doors on truck campers have caused me much grief over the years. Traveling on a very dusty gravel road in the Chilcotins many years ago I had to wipe a layer of dust from every surface when we set up camp each night. One evening we ended up bouncing down a very rough track to a lovely little lake. On opening the camper door I discovered that the fridge door had burst open. The interior of the rv was coated with blobs of thick pea soup flung from a large bowl that exited from the fridge. The whole soupy mess was coated with an overlay of gritty dust.
Many years later we spent 6 weeks traveling in an 8ft camper with no washroom from Vancouver BC to the Yukon. We drove the Dempster Highway as far as the Arctic Circle but couldn't continue to Inuvik and the Arctic Ocean because of bad weather. The road was extremely muddy and again the door was warped. Instead of wiping dry dust I spent my time sluicing out mud from the floor and walls.
Fun times, great memories. Of course rvs are cheaply made but that makes them affordable and its the bumps in the road that make life interesting - if you want smooth sailing stay home!!!!!!

 

[Fermion]

Of course rvs are cheaply made but that makes them affordable and its the bumps in the road that make life interesting - if you want smooth sailing stay home!!!!!!

Ding ding ding, winner. RVs are cheaply made so they can be affordable. If you don't want cheap, go with something like an earthmover. Having spent at least 800 man hours and well over $25,000 in materials for our buildout I do not see a profit in manufacturing a decent quality camper and selling it for $30,000 to $35,000 even if you get materials wholesale.

 

[Walt34]

Traveling on a very dusty gravel road in the Chilcotins many years ago I had to wipe a layer of dust from every surface when we set up camp each night. One evening we ended up bouncing down a very rough track to a lovely little lake. On opening the camper door I discovered that the fridge door had burst open. The interior of the rv was coated with blobs of thick pea soup flung from a large bowl that exited from the fridge. The whole soupy mess was coated with an overlay of gritty dust.
Many years later we spent 6 weeks traveling in an 8ft camper with no washroom from Vancouver BC to the Yukon. We drove the Dempster Highway as far as the Arctic Circle but couldn't continue to Inuvik and the Arctic Ocean because of bad weather. The road was extremely muddy and again the door was warped. Instead of wiping dry dust I spent my time sluicing out mud from the floor and walls.
Fun times, great memories.

Uh, for fun times like that I'll pass. Motel 6 sounds much better. Guess I'm just not an RVer.

 

[travelover]

........ I also put in 200A inline fuses to support the added 2KW pure sine wave inverter................. So, I put a fuse at each end.

Same here. I was shocked to see no fuse on the main battery cable on my camper. I installed both a fuse and a shutoff switch.

In the bad old days, rural farmers without electricity used automotive batteries to arc weld with. So, they can easily incinerate a wood stick motor home or camper trailer with a short circuit.

 

[Sarah in SC]

Nobulife, I'm contemplating that same trip (BC to Yukon/Dempster Hwy) in mid May as would like to know more about the timing and stories behind yours. We will be in a '92 school bus and camping. Thanks!

 

[NW-Bound]

I once looked at flying up to Anchorage and renting an RV there. The Web site of an RV place showed the highways the renters could travel on. For the Dempster, there was an admonition: "Don't even think about it!".

One cannot drive up to the Arctic Ocean. The last 20 or 30 miles from Inuvik had no road probably due to swampy land. One must take a short flight to go up to the Arctic Ocean to say he/she has been there.

I am afraid I will not be driving my RV on the Dempster either, when I make the trip. My wife would have a fit if I make an attempt. So, to compensate for that, I spent a bit of time on Google Street View to see the scenery along this road. See the link below for the turn-around at the end of the road going north from Inuvik. Google sent two camera-cars up there, and one happened to capture the other one as it already turned around heading south. Move the view up 100 ft and you will see the turnaround at the end of the road.

See: http://goo.gl/maps/xZk69