Stores closing at record pace

[Red Badger]

I hate driving. I'm an introvert and have no desire to contend with clerks, cashiers, etc. I like having dozens (or hundreds) of choices. I value items that have hundreds, even thousands of reviews. Ergo, I do spend a lot on-line, most with Amazon.

I do buy a lot at Lowe's. Yard and garden stuff, mostly. We get all major appliances at Lowe's, as we value free delivery, set up/install and haul away of old unit (the 10% veteran discount doesn't hut either).

At the other end, we patronize a local grocery store and the farmers' market. We try to eat local and are willing to pay more for better food.

[Amethyst]

That's 'cause nobody knows what Amazon shoppers look like. You never saw a "People of Amazon" joke site, now did you?

Perception is everything, stupid as that is.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ponyboy Funny how everyone seems to love bezos (amazon) who did more for killing brick and mortar stores than any other company...yet everyone universally hates the waltons (walmart owners.) Double standard much?

[timo2]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ponyboy Funny how everyone seems to love bezos (amazon) who did more for killing brick and mortar stores than any other company...yet everyone universally hates the waltons (walmart owners.) Double standard much?

It might be because, as others have stated, Wal Mart is the original B&M killer. Version.1.0 if you will. People took it personal when Walmart wiped out whole swaths of mom & pop stores, pharmacies, etc. In little towns. Now that Walmart is being subjected to version 2.0 of B&M killers in Amazon, people don't care as much. What goes around comes around.

DW has a niece who is a pharmacist in an independent pharmarcy that owes its existence to the fact that it, while seemingly in the middle of nowhere, is too far away from the nearest Wal Mart to be put out of business by them.

But Amazon is more than just a B & M killer, the also kill other online outlets. So while I avoid Walmart like the plague, I avoid Amazon like a cold. If one looks around they can find other online retailers to buy stuff that are comparable in price to Amazon. One problem is that so many other online outlets just outsource their checkout to Amazon,it is sometimes frustrating. [A shout-out to Crutchfield for being an totally independent online electronic outlet]

(My own problem will the Walton family is more personal.....Members of that family purchased and then destroyed my favorite NHL team.)

[CaptTom]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amethyst You never saw a "People of Amazon" joke site, now did you?

Now THAT it'd like to see! Then again, I'm not usually at my best when I shop on Amazon. Come to think of it, I don't bother to get too dressed up to go to WalMart, either

OK, my real point was an interesting tidbit I picked up in that Atlantic article linked above:

Quote:

Cashiers and retail salespeople are the two largest job categories in the country, with more than 8 million workers between them, and the median income for both occupations is less than $25,000 a year.

I guess I never thought of it that way. I understood that technology tends to reduce labor requirements, often at entry-level positions. But when it impacts the two largest job categories, it's bound to have a structural impact.

[MichaelB]

Big box stores put small shops out of business across the retail spectrum. Bookstores, hardware stores, office supplies, large supermarkets. Wal-Mart put the rest out of business. Amazon successfully challenged the large booksellers, but there is no evidence to show it is the cause of other large stores difficulties.

Whole Foods Market is in the news as of late. It has enjoyed amazing sales growth. That, however, is the result of opening new stores - same store sales are declining. In the higher density areas, supermarkets are just as overbuilt, as are pharmacies.

Low interest rates and easy access to financing are the reason businesses overbuild. That, and the fact that executive team is well compensated for the short term results.

[CaptTom]

Quote:

Originally Posted by timo2 ...If one looks around they can find other online retailers to buy stuff that are comparable in price to Amazon. One problem is that so many other online outlets just outsource their checkout to Amazon,it is sometimes frustrating. [A shout-out to Crutchfield for being an totally independent online electronic outlet]

I really do look around. I agree Crutchfield is a good source. But even some of my former go-to marine parts suppliers are sometimes significantly more than Amazon. I'm down to using very few other on-line retailers. Most of those are very specialized, for example (and a shout out to) GenuineDealz.com, who sells marine-grade electrical wire.

Beyond those few stand-outs, I'm still finding a lot of on-line sites hide the real price behind phony "shipping" costs that aren't revealed until after you fill in all your personal information. Or their shipping times are significantly longer than Amazon's. Some don't have good descriptions for their products, or the products are difficult to locate on the site. Selections for many lines tend to be much more limited than Amazon, and comparing similar items can be difficult. Amazon's reviews and return policies make it much less risky to purchase on line.

That combination is hard to beat.

[JoeWras]

I grumble a bit when I see some of my favorite on-line retailers (one was for shoes, the other for air filters) also selling on Amazon for LOWER price than their outlet.

[timo2]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptTom . Beyond those few stand-outs, I'm still finding a lot of on-line sites hide the real price behind phony "shipping" costs that aren't revealed until after you fill in all your personal information. Or their shipping times are significantly longer than Amazon's. Some don't have good descriptions for their products, or the products are difficult to locate on the site. Selections for many lines tend to be much more limited than Amazon, and comparing similar items can be difficult. Amazon's reviews and return policies make it much less risky to purchase on line. That combination is hard to beat.

I have found that, just like people go to the B&M store to look and then buy on Amazon, I go to amazon for the product descriptions and reviews, then go buy elsewhere online, if the pricing allows.

[Steve40th]

Wal Marts online shopping is getting pretty darn good.. No comparison to Amazon, but, give them time... i see them competing for the online purchase market too.

[Which Roger]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptTom I understood that technology tends to reduce labor requirements, often at entry-level positions. But when it impacts the two largest job categories, it's bound to have a structural impact.

I agree about the impact, but it won't necessarily be negative. 100 years ago farm laborer was by far the biggest profession, and look what technology did in that area.

[RunningBum]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptTom I guess I never thought of it that way. I understood that technology tends to reduce labor requirements, often at entry-level positions. But when it impacts the two largest job categories, it's bound to have a structural impact.

I struggle with this. Am I really supposed to subsidize these jobs? I haven't visited my horse & buggy dealer in awhile, I hope they are still doing ok and are keeping their people employed. Point is, things change, and people and businesses need to adapt. I don't know the full answer for the loss of jobs, but I'd rather pay for people doing service jobs for things that bring me value, rather than things that don't.

I don't exclusively shop online because there are some things I need immediately or want to see first hand before buying. Food is definitely one of those things so I don't ever see shopping for groceries online. I understand the need to buy at those places enough to make sure they are there when I need them. But I can bag my own groceries, and do it a lot better than most of the baggers do (don't get me started).

I have switched to buying running shoes locally, because there's a local store owned by friends and they do a lot for the local running community that mail order will not do. Plus I get personalized shoe advice. So I'll pay $20-30 more, at least for now.

[timo2]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptTom Now THAT it'd like to see! OK, my real point was an interesting tidbit I picked up in that Atlantic article linked above: I guess I never thought of it that way. I understood that technology tends to reduce labor requirements, often at entry-level positions. But when it impacts the two largest job categories, it's bound to have a structural impact.

Our future robot overlords will take care of those jobs. Seriously though, I don't use the self-checkout lanes and use the person powered checkout just as my way of pushing back against the machines.

[Nemo2]

Quote:

Originally Posted by timo2 I don't use the self-checkout lanes and use the person powered checkout just as my way of pushing back against the machines.

"Resistance is futile."

[explanade]

I noticed more stores offer wifi. Not sure what's the strategy behind that.

A few years after everyone started getting smart phones and data plans, the stores were wary of "show rooming" where people go check out stuff at brick and mortar but at the same time, shop the price online of the things they see.

Wifi suppose to make that better? Or maybe they want you to use their app, which can track your presence. There used to be talk about how with bluetooth, they would bring your attention to specials two aisles from where you were in the store. I haven't seen that nor them popping in coupons to make those impulse purchases.

[timo2]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptTom I really do look around. I agree Crutchfield is a good source. But even some of my former go-to marine parts suppliers are sometimes significantly more than Amazon. I'm down to using very few other on-line retailers. Most of those are very specialized, for example (and a shout out to) GenuineDealz.com, who sells marine-grade electrical wire. Beyond those few stand-outs, I'm still finding a lot of on-line sites hide the real price behind phony "shipping" costs that aren't revealed until after you fill in all your personal information. Or their shipping times are significantly longer than Amazon's. Some don't have good descriptions for their products, or the products are difficult to locate on the site. Selections for many lines tend to be much more limited than Amazon, and comparing similar items can be difficult. Amazon's reviews and return policies make it much less risky to purchase on line. That combination is hard to beat.

example: was recently looking for an iSMART alarm bundle, and compared Amazon to best buy, home depot etc, but the best overall price and selection, including shipping , was from the ismart alarm company themselves. Amazon does not always have the best deals

[samclem]

Quote:

Originally Posted by timo2 Seriously though, I don't use the self-checkout lanes and use the person powered checkout just as my way of pushing back against the machines.

Go the next step: Take a Sharpie to the bar codes on a few of your items to help employ more folks as they run around to price check items. 😀 As a bonus, you'll have an opportunity to chat with your neighbors in line.
We're working at cross purposes-- I bring extra carts from the parking lot back to the store as I come in.

[braumeister]

Quote:

Originally Posted by explanade I noticed more stores offer wifi. Not sure what's the strategy behind that.

You'll be seeing much more of that. Since the phone in your pocket is constantly searching for wifi and/or bluetooth signals, they are beginning to track your movements within the store so they can see what displays you linger at, which ones you bypass quickly, etc., etc. That's valuable information they can not only use but sell on to others.

[Walt34]

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeWras I grumble a bit when I see some of my favorite on-line retailers (one was for shoes, the other for air filters) also selling on Amazon for LOWER price than their outlet.

I noticed that too when I was buying picture frames. I forget the name of the company but the price was lower on Amazon than on their site, but only for standard-size frames. When I wanted a couple custom made I had to order from the maker's site.

[audreyh1]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beldar Radio Shack has just completed another round of closings. 2 more closed in our area in the last month. Naturally, I visited them to see what type of bargains they were offering (none really). But seeing the original sticker prices for many items sure gave me an idea why their business model has failed (twice or more the online price). The Apple store here puzzles me as well. It's almost impossible to buy anything there (there's no checkout counter). Instead, you have to corral one of the sales kids and nearly demand to buy an item. They go out of their way to help you with any of the products, but seem to be hands-off when it comes to sales pressure. Strategery. _B

Not my experience. You walk in, tell the first employee you see "I want to buy X". They take your credit card, read it on their iPad, have you sign the screen, tell you to go to counter Y to pick it up, and simultaneously email the receipt. Fastest store in out I have ever experienced.

[audreyh1]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MichaelB Big box stores put small shops out of business across the retail spectrum. Bookstores, hardware stores, office supplies, large supermarkets. Wal-Mart put the rest out of business. Amazon successfully challenged the large booksellers, but there is no evidence to show it is the cause of other large stores difficulties. Whole Foods Market is in the news as of late. It has enjoyed amazing sales growth. That, however, is the result of opening new stores - same store sales are declining. In the higher density areas, supermarkets are just as overbuilt, as are pharmacies. Low interest rates and easy access to financing are the reason businesses overbuild. That, and the fact that executive team is well compensated for the short term results.

Very true sequence of events!