U.S. Demand for Electricity Declined in 2019 and ...

[MichaelB]

So far only 12 cities in California and one in Massachusetts have announced bans on gas in new home construction. I wouldn’t call it a trend or nationwide, it’s more like an anecdote or small experiment. It’s still not clear if it is legal.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/cities-are-banning-natural-gas-in-new-homes-because-of-climate-change/#

Since June, a dozen cities have banned natural gas equipment in new buildings. Berkeley, California, was the first, followed in the state by San Jose, Mountain View, Santa Rosa and Brisbane. A half-dozen other cities have passed laws to strongly encourage all-electric construction without banning fossil fuels outright.

On the East Coast, Brookline, Massachusetts, in November became the first city in the state to ban new gas hookups.

 

[marko]

So far only 12 cities in California and one in Massachusetts have announced bans on gas in new home construction. I wouldn’t call it a trend or nationwide, it’s more like an anecdote or small experiment. It’s still not clear if it is legal.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/cities-are-banning-natural-gas-in-new-homes-because-of-climate-change/#

What I should have said was that the topic seemed to be gaining steam if not in actual practice.

My town in Mass and a half dozen others near us are talking about it. My experience with my own town is that when they start "talking about it", they're already quietly in the planning stage. We like to be ahead of the curve!

BIL is the the gas industry...exploration financial end...and he told.me about this 3 years ago and I thought he was crazy.

 

[HFWR]

Snark notwithstanding, we passed clean air and water regs, and mpg standards and such, when there was plenty of resistance, but our air/water are much better for it.

Perhaps banning natgas connections is a bit premature, or even counterproductive, but sometimes, apparently, we have to be dragged kicking and screaming...

I believe it was Churchill who said America will do the right thing, after exhausting all other possibilities.

 

[Markola]

So far, none of our 2 to 5 year old LEDs have died. Having said that, in the old farm house I stay in during our yearly trek to the midwest, there are two old florescent tubes (over 60 years old) which still work when we (very) occasionally use them. YMMV

It was -4F yesterday morning in my town in the upper Midwest. My 4 old long fluorescents in the garage were groaning and flickering. I assume LEDs wold do better in the cold, yes? Probably time to recycle the old ones. I saw an LED bulb kit on Amazon that comes with the electronics you need to upgrade your bulbs within the existing housing. Looks pretty straightforward. You snip some wires and leave the old stuff in place, and screw in the new electronics and bulbs.

 

[CaptTom]

It was -4F yesterday morning in my town in the upper Midwest. My 4 old long fluorescents in the garage were groaning and flickering. I assume LEDs wold do better in the cold, yes? Probably time to recycle the old ones. I saw an LED bulb kit on Amazon that comes with the electronics you need to upgrade your bulbs within the existing housing. Looks pretty straightforward. You snip some wires and leave the old stuff in place, and screw in the new electronics and bulbs.

Yup, that's what I did. Same issue; florescents didn't work well in the cold.

Make sure you get the LED tubes which work the way you describe; snip out the ballast and connect power directly to the "tombstone" the tube fits into. There are some which claim to work with SOME ballasts, but I have two problems with that. (1) there's a compatibility list inside the box, in tiny print. Do you really know which type, brand and model ballast you have? And more importantly, (2) why would you want to keep an unneeded ballast around? It only wastes electricity and will eventually fail.

Also note there are two flavors of tombstones; power to just one side, or power to both sides. It'll all be in the wiring diagram which comes with the tube.

 

[ERD50]

...
Make sure you get the LED tubes which work the way you describe; snip out the ballast and connect power directly to the "tombstone" the tube fits into. There are some which claim to work with SOME ballasts, but I have two problems with that. (1) there's a compatibility list inside the box, in tiny print. Do you really know which type, brand and model ballast you have? And more importantly, (2) why would you want to keep an unneeded ballast around? It only wastes electricity and will eventually fail.

Also note there are two flavors of tombstones; power to just one side, or power to both sides. It'll all be in the wiring diagram which comes with the tube.

+100

I've replaced the old FL tubes with LEDs and have been very happy. Wire it to bypass the ballast - as noted above the ballast can only cause problems, there is no upside, only downside. You just connect direct, it's no extra work, just follow the directions.

No more flickering, no more buzzing.

-ERD50

 

[ERD50]

More directly to the point of the thread, I doubt that LEDs have had much of an effect on the decline in Electricity Demand. As many have said, they are replacing CFLs or FL tubes, and the energy usage isn't all that much less (compared to replacing incandescent/"Edison"/filament bulbs).

So while I turn lights off when I leave a room, I pass an empty building with hundreds of lights on. I doubt my savings makes a drop in a bucket.

I'd bet it has more to do with efficient A/C? That's a big draw, so efficiency there makes a difference. Maybe heat pumps to replace electric water heaters in places w/o access to Natural Gas? It must be something significant considering the increase in EV sales, those are sucking up a lot more than a few LED replacements.

-ERD50

 

[gerntz]

But!
While it's great that everyone is going to LED's, many cities and towns nationwide (mine in MA is now leaning aggressively in that direction) are planning to ban all future natural gas installations.

I love it. Expect that will help keep my NG cost down.

 

[gerntz]

So far only 12 cities in California and one in Massachusetts have announced bans on gas in new home construction. I wouldn’t call it a trend or nationwide, it’s more like an anecdote or small experiment. It’s still not clear if it is legal.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/cities-are-banning-natural-gas-in-new-homes-because-of-climate-change/#

The more bans the better. Cheaper NG is good.

 

[samclem]

I've also replaced most of my florescent tubes with LED tubes, and bypassing the ballast is certainly the best way to go. One other note: after I modify the fixture I write a note on it with a Sharpie saying what I did. It will save me or someone else some troubleshooting if they need to replace that LED bulb.

 

[CaptTom]

More directly to the point of the thread, I doubt that LEDs have had much of an effect on the decline in Electricity Demand. As many have said, they are replacing CFLs or FL tubes, and the energy usage isn't all that much less (compared to replacing incandescent/"Edison"/filament bulbs).

You may be right that there are other "big picture" efficiencies going on.

But replacing my 10, 40W florescent tubes in my barn with LEDs which use something like 15W each is a pretty significant reduction. And for every incandescent bulb I replace it's even bigger. I guess someone is going to have to google what percentage of domestic energy production goes into lighting.

I know that big companies are almost all replacing their florescents with LEDs as fast as they can. So I know there's money to be saved.

I've also replaced most of my florescent tubes with LED tubes, and bypassing the ballast is certainly the best way to go. One other note: after I modify the fixture I write a note on it with a Sharpie saying what I did. It will save me or someone else some troubleshooting if they need to replace that LED bulb.

Good point about marking them! I did the same thing. You don't want someone putting in an old-fashioned florescent tube if it's direct wired.

 

[Winemaker]

I replaced one of my recessed flo shop lights with a same size LED panel. It seems a little brighter, but I hope it puts out the same/similar light wavelength for my 2 Hawaiian lime trees. DW and I brought home 3 limes from Hawaii in 2009, took the seeds and planted. I know this seems like a stretch, but we currently have 2-4 foot tall trees now and producing limes! They are planted in wine barrel halves that I have to move inside in the winter, but I'm blown away. They don't get any bigger than ping pong balls, but the flavor is intense!

 

[HFWR]

I replaced one of my recessed flo shop lights with a same size LED panel. It seems a little brighter, but I hope it puts out the same/similar light wavelength for my 2 Hawaiian lime trees. DW and I brought home 3 limes from Hawaii in 2009, took the seeds and planted. I know this seems like a stretch, but we currently have 2-4 foot tall trees now and producing limes! They are planted in wine barrel halves that I have to move inside in the winter, but I'm blown away. They don't get any bigger than ping pong balls, but the flavor is intense!

Key lime pie!

 

[Winemaker]

^ This is only the 3rd year for the limes, so I only get about 12-15. So not enough for a pie. I have considered a single bottle of Lime/Lemoncella, though.

 

[Brat]

I live in a co-op constructed in 1959. Last year we replaced the elevator mechanism. Our Board Treasurer says the savings in our electrical bill was significant. Not only that but the Oregon Energy Trust (there is a fee for that on our electric bill) kicked in more than a nickel.

 

[NW-Bound]

I don't have Hawaiian lime or Key lime, but have a Kaffir lime tree. My wife just had to have it when we saw it at Costco. The leaves are used in some Thai dishes or hot pots. We eat this only a few times a year, but my wife cannot have enough trees.

P.S. Ugh, to bring it back to the thread topic, I have to add that citrus can live outdoors here where we rarely get down to freezing at night in the winter. No need for electricity for warming or lighting. Occasionally, there may be a freezing night, but that may be once a decade.

 

[eroscott]

I shifted to Solar-power in 2015.

Since I use solar-power, I have been trying to follow the industry. But I have noticed that Public Utilities only track the number of 'grid-tied net-metering' solar users exist. There is nobody collecting data on off-grid solar-power users.

Nobody honestly knows how many people in our nation have solar-power. We only know how many homes put solar-generated power onto the grid.

In my town alone there are four solar-powered homes, and three of them are off-grid.

As far as I can tell roughly 75% of all solar-powered homes are off-grid and effectively are no longer counted by the bean-counters.

Yes, I attend solar-power fairs each year. Most sales are for off-grid homes.

Not sure if you've seen/heard of this project to use satellite imagery to track solar installs. very cool.

Title: This project is mapping every solar panel in the country using machine learning
Devin Coldewey@techcrunch / 2:11 pm CST • December 19, 2018
https://techcrunch.com/2018/12/19/t...-panel-in-the-country-using-machine-learning/

They do have an interactive map to drill down to counties or other areas.

 

[Curmudgeon44]

This is an interesting decline in electric demand, but do we really think it is a trend? Modern AC systems are more efficient, and new houses tend to have less air leakage, better insulation etc.

I do think there will be upward pressure due to electric cars. As more people find out the benefits of electric cars, one effect will be to shift demand away from petroleum and toward electricity -- that should be measurable and big when it happens. Also the automobile dealership type of business will suffer as electric cars will have far fewer repair and service visits... don't overlook that the service department is a real profit center for dealerships. I expect their fortunes will decline, and there will be more direct sales from car maker to customer (as much as allowed by law).

Electricity is interesting. I worked in that field over a decade.

 

[audreyh1]

I don't have Hawaiian lime or Key lime, but have a Kaffir lime tree. My wife just had to have it when we saw it at Costco. The leaves are used in some Thai dishes or hot pots. We eat this only a few times a year, but my wife cannot have enough trees.

P.S. Ugh, to bring it back to the thread topic, I have to add that citrus can live outdoors here where we rarely get down to freezing at night in the winter. No need for electricity for warming or lighting. Occasionally, there may be a freezing night, but that may be once a decade.

Gosh - I’d love to have a kaffir lime tree! I have to order leaves from CA and store them in the freezer.

I had a tree when I lived in Central TX and it even produced a lime one year,much to our surprise. Now I live in citrus country, could probably plant one in the ground, but I’ve never seen one for sale.

 

[Offgrid Organic Farmer]

Not sure if you've seen/heard of this project to use satellite imagery to track solar installs. very cool.

That would certainly change the published data on how much solar power is generated in the US.

 

[jaga]

... Modern AC systems are more efficient, and new houses tend to have less air leakage, better insulation etc.

I do think there will be upward pressure due to electric cars. .

I agree. Overall usage may very well go up as electric cars become more common and more buildings/homes move away from natural gas.

But, lower electricity consumption doesn't need to be the goal, as long as the electricity is produced from clean sources (solar, wind, hydro power, geothermal, and maybe existing nuclear) and storage technology is implemented.

The new technology is great and super efficient: heat pump space heaters and water heaters, induction cooktops, etc.

 

[Sunset]

It does depend on where you live, I think. We're in the Boston area and pay about $400 a month just for electricity and have gas for heat, hot water, cooking, fireplace and grill.

Wow, our electric was $70 last month.

 

[Sunset]

I get quarterly "nasty-grams" from power company about how my power usage is 33% higher than my neighbors. They assume my house is the same size as everyone else. They don't know I have a wood shop, auto garage or a mini-winery. Both all brick buildings have R38 in the ceiling and R13 in the walls, I'd love to tell them to shove it; I pay for it promptly every month, and at 6.05 cents/kwh, they should be sending me loyalty gift cards!

Same here, we figure it's the empty foreclosed houses that are using less electricity than us, as our bill is pretty low.

 

[NW-Bound]

$400 for electricity in the winter in addition to using gas for heat is amazingly high.

Here in the SW, my highest usage was $350/month in the summer in July when my 5-ton AC ran around the clock. But with a 1.5-ton mini-split to cool just the downstairs using off-grid solar power because the upstairs rooms are unused, my highest bill last year was $162.

I already bought a smaller 3/4-ton mini-split for the master bedroom, and expect to get more comfort at night while using perhaps a bit less power.