West coast fires

[eytonxav]

Great comments by skipro. Forty years of mismanaged forestry and too many arsonists, but that is not to say that lightning and other means don't setoff these horrendous fires. However, trying to attribute climate change (manmade) to all these disasters needs more scrutiny.

[skipro33]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DFW_M5 Great comments by skipro. Forty years of mismanaged forestry and too many arsonists, but that is not to say that lightning and other means don't setoff these horrendous fires. However, trying to attribute climate change (manmade) to all these disasters needs more scrutiny.

Lightning is a cause for some fires and more so today than even 10 years ago. I'll tell you this about lightning though. It does strike the same place twice. Or at least the same area twice. My observation has been that the terrain in the forest is usually sloped if not steep with ridges. This forms micro climates that trigger weather events. I was able to quantifiabley measure that with snow course measurements and precipitation gauging. While in the field, I witnessed very specific areas that were targeted with lightning regularly. I've stood or been in my vehicle near trees that were hit by lightning many times. I called these areas, lightning alleys. Some of the forest biologists I worked with didn't believe me until I started pointing out in specific areas how the taller tree tops were missing or regrew a double top from being struck by lightning repeatedly. I was even able to take them to these places during storms so they could witness the events live. I was able to convince the electric utility company I worked with to route their transmission towers with this taken into consideration. I also recommended that these areas have fire breaks built around them. The utility company did procure their right-of-ways so that their access roads did construct fire breaks for their power lines. When fires struck, their lines were preserved. They did need to de-energize them because the smoke contained enough carbon to cause arcing between the phases of the conductors between towers. I helped with the design of a system that could measure the air quality near these lines so that the grid control center could manually manipulate those lines and isolate them during these conditions. Many fires are started from a lightning strike, but are exasperated by the utility company's energized lines coming down due to arcing and burning up when the carbon in the smoke arcs and takes out the conductor before tripping a breaker.

Maybe you've heard of PG&E here in California having their PSPS (public safety power shutoff) events. Normally these are staged prior to any fire, but once a fire is active, they also shut off lines that might be affected.

[skipro33]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Montecfo That any of this is due to climate change is conjecture, but it also is irrelevant, since there is no serious plan to limit carbon output sufficient to stop the earth from warming, much less to reduce temps assuming that is even possible.

I tend to agree that climate change is a global event, not isolated to the West Coast of the USA and it's unlikely that money spent to combat climate change by these states will have any effect. If climate change is man made, it will take the entire planet to have any appreciative effect and it will take many decades to see results. In the meantime, the forests burn, the hurricanes rage, the deluge floods intensify.

But climate change is the buzz of the politicians. I doubt that science will ever win out over politicians since they control the funding. So science needs to figure out a way to work with the politicians who fund their science and convince them of what ever the truth is about climate change. My hope is that politicians are truly interested in serving mankind and not controlling mankind. That is the rub....

[KCGeezer]

Great information skipro. Do you know if your observations and analysis were adopted in other areas? I would think that would become a standard wherever possible. What are the limitations to these types of management techniques being used more broadly?

[homestead]

A man in Oregon was arrested early Monday for setting "multiple" fires along a freeway in Portland, hours after he was released from custody for setting another brush fire along the same roadway, according to police.The Portland Police Bureau said in a news release that officers were dispatched around 3:37 a.m. Monday to a report of "multiple fires" burning along the west side of the Interstate 205 freeway.

"Portland Fire and Rescue extinguished three of them while passing community members put out the other three," police said. "All were caught early."

Officers found Domingo Lopez Jr., 45, walking alongside the shoulder and arrested him. A lighter was seized as evidence.

[skipro33]

Quote:

Originally Posted by KCGeezer Great information skipro. Do you know if your observations and analysis were adopted in other areas? I would think that would become a standard wherever possible. What are the limitations to these types of management techniques being used more broadly?

If they are, I'm unaware of it. As a small municipal utility company, ours was of limited scope. California grid is mostly private owned and under control by Cal ISO. Ours was self managed, but when ISO was first formed we were under them. Saw that it was to our disadvantage and we were granted self regulation by the CPUC. I am of the opinion that mega utilities, may need to be broken up like the telephone industry was decades ago. It was to a certain extent; breaking off generation from distribution and transmission, but that actually caused more issues with market manipulation for prices instead of opening competition.

Our small utility company was licensed under FERC. I don't know how private companies are licensed. As a federal agency, FERC required we be good stewards for the resources that belonged to the public under Federal control. Stuff like stream management for flora and fauna, flood control, even recreational opportunities like camping, white water rafting, fishing. I'm pretty sure the privately controlled don't as they probably also own the land their infrastructure resides on. I may be wrong though.

[Born2BRetd]

Thanks for your posts Skip Pro it was very enlightening.

[Oilcan]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Born2BRetd Thanks for your posts Skip Pro it was very enlightening.

+1

[Ronstar]

Although I've seen the wildfires on tv, I can't imagine what it would be like in person. We have haze in the air here in Illinois that is said to be from the western wildfires.

From today's hike at Starved Rock State Park in north central Illinois

[1242Vintage]

Another bad air quality day in the Golden State. Starting the day at the house with an Air Quality Index at 164, which puts us in the “unhealthy” range.

[stepford]

I guess we've been "lucky" in my little hunk of SoCal. AQI mostly in the 60-80 range - high enough that DW and I have been taking a break from cycling until things clear up, but low enough we can still hang out in the yard without choking...

[Fermion]

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1242Vintage Another bad air quality day in the Golden State. Starting the day at the house with an Air Quality Index at 164, which puts us in the “unhealthy” range.

You guys sent us all the smoke. It is still 400 here this morning in Washington.

[Keim]

208 in North Central Idaho.

[MuirWannabe]

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[harllee]

Here in my cabin in the mountains of NC the air quality index today is 26. We have been having a lot of rain this summer so I guess that helps keep the air quality good. I just saw on the news that the east coast above mid Virginia is getting haze from the western wildfires but evidently we are not getting any here in NC.

[Dtail]

Climate change still being questioned....

[Chuckanut]

If you can get above 4000-5000 feet, the air is fine. Anybody for bagging a peak today?

[aja8888]

Just checked our AQI for Conroe (relocated zone C78), Texas and it's at 22 at a station about three miles from our house.

At the location it's 89.6 F and 49% humidity. PM 2.5 is 14 micrograms per cubic meter. Wind at 10.3 MPH, and we are about 198' MSL.

[Montecfo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dtail Climate change still being questioned....

I think only the relevance is questioned. No thermostat to turn down the heat.

[Dtail]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Montecfo I think only the relevance is questioned. No thermostat to turn down the heat.

Okay then.