2016 Income Tax Status

[Fedup]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan I've been in receipt of an overseas pension for 10 years and the first few years I created a substitute 1099-R with associated form 4852. However this is really aimed at US firms that haven't issued a 1099-R (on the form you have to explain what steps you've taken to obtain a 1099-R and the fields don't support a foreign address etc.) A few years back I heard that it is much simpler and acceptable to add it to line 21 on the 1040 as other income. The tax is identical whichever method you choose and the IRS don't seem to care as I've never been questioned on it whichever way I choose to report it.

That's where I put, line 21 of 1040. But where do you put the tax they withhold. It's different outcome if I report as 1099-R. I get a lot more tax back. But I thought, US government is not going to give me money that was withheld by UK government, I mean it's not fair for US government. So the most they can do is to give you foreign tax credit to ease some of the pain, and that's the step I took. I hope I'm wrong. I want to take the right path to give me more cash back. This is half of a lumpsum, not annuity payment.
I'm trying to research from the U.K. Expat forum but my googling must not very good.

[Alan]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fedup That's where I put, line 21 of 1040. But where do you put the tax they withhold. It's different outcome if I report as 1099-R. I get a lot more tax back. But I thought, US government is not going to give me money that was withheld by UK government, I mean it's not fair for US government. So the most they can do is to give you foreign tax credit to offset some of the pain, and that's the step I took. I hope I'm wrong. I want to take the right path to give me more cash back. This is a lumpsump, or half of a lumpsum, not annuity payment.

The U.K. government should not be taking any tax if you are not resident in the UK, which has always been the case for me taking my UK pension. The US/UK double taxation treaty states which country has primary taxation of which stream of income depending on where you are resident.

The first month I received a pension tax was taken so I filed a form with the IRS who then informed the UK HMRC that I was a US tax payer and the tax was refunded in my next pension payment and my tax code changed to NT (no tax). See form 2002 I think.

https://www.gov.uk/government/public...ndividual-2002

[Fedup]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan The U.K. government should not be taking any tax if you are not resident in the UK, which has always been the case for me taking my UK pension. The US/UK double taxation treaty states which country has primary taxation of which stream of income depending on where you are resident. The first month I received a pension tax was taken so I filed a form with the IRS who then informed the UK HMRC that I was a US tax payer and the tax was refunded in my next pension payment and my tax code changed to NT (no tax). See form 2002 I think. https://www.gov.uk/government/public...ndividual-2002

They did, they sent us a letter to say the money was made in UK and therefore they took out some tax. We also did fake some form with the IRS and they communicated with UK HRMC that we are currently a US tax payer and they still took some tax anyway.
I don't mind about the tax, I just want to know where to claim it on my tax. My husband and I think of it as donation to the U.K. for his PhD degree. He earned it there and didn't work in the U.K. after he moved to USA.

[Alan]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fedup They did, they sent us a letter to say the money was made in UK and therefore they took out some tax. We also did fake some form with the IRS and they communicated with UK HRMC that we are currently a US tax payer and they still took some tax anyway. I don't mind about the tax, I just want to know where to claim it on my tax. My husband and I think of it as donation to the U.K. for his PhD degree. He earned it there and didn't work in the U.K. after he moved to USA.

IRS form 1116 is for claiming foreign tax credits so you could try that, but the IRS may well consider that they are the primary tax authority for foreign pensions as per the tax treaty. If the money you were receiving from the U.K. was indeed earned income then that would be different. Does HMRC also take NI contributions or just income tax?

[Fedup]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan IRS form 1116 is for claiming foreign tax credits so you could try that, but the IRS may well consider that they are the primary tax authority for foreign pensions as per the tax treaty. If the money you were receiving from the U.K. was indeed earned income then that would be different. Does HMRC also take NI contributions or just income tax?

It's like contribution to IRA in USA, you must have income to contribute. HMRC withheld just income tax on that amount we withdrew. But we paid NI separately for years to get UK SS pension.

[Alan]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fedup It's like contribution to IRA in USA, you must have income to contribute. HMRC withheld just income tax on that amount we withdrew. But we paid NI separately for years to get UK SS pension.

I was talking about my UK private pension, I'm not old enough yet to start drawing my UK SS (aka OAP) to which I continue to pay voluntary NI contributions. If the taxation agreement states that the UK is the primary taxation authority then claiming the tax back using IRS form 1116 should work, and the creation of the substitute 1099-R should provide a documentation trail of the source of income. (I'm not certain where the U.K. OAP should be reported on the 1040 as I've never had to do it)

[Fedup]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan I was talking about my UK private pension, I'm not old enough yet to start drawing my UK SS (aka OAP) to which I continue to pay voluntary NI contributions. If the taxation agreement states that the UK is the primary taxation authority then claiming the tax back using IRS form 1116 should work, and the creation of the substitute 1099-R should provide a documentation trail of the source of income. (I'm not certain where the U.K. OAP should be reported on the 1040 as I've never had to do it)

1040 form, it could be line 16 or 21.

[redduck]

I went to my CPA today. Turns out that California owes me $11.00

[MRG]

Our new CPA called. We owe $750! Oh my, I had a nightmare all dreamed up of all the stuff that could be wrong.

[RobbieB]

I got the last 1099, I'm in the home stretch!

Looks like I estimated the state pretty good this year, but blew the fed big time. Kinda forgot about the big solar tax credit and sent them way too much dough back in January.

Oh well, it won't be gone long and banks pay little interest.

[Fedup]

I redid my tax today, instead of claiming Foreign tax Credit, I claimed it as deductions on my schedule A for the tax amount that the UK HRMC withheld last year. The result is I get more tax back. I thought I would get more with Foreign tax credit. Less complication and more money. What's not to like. Almost done. Now I need to check a few things, hope to get it done before my trip for spring break. But I won't mail them until I get back from my trip.

[Gumby]

Got my refund check in the mail yesterday. Mailed my return in on 2/15.

[bingybear]

Got my 1099's in February and filled out the taxes. Sent the Fed's in yesterday... I wanted to give some time to get revised 1099... haven't seen any yet. I'll mail the state's tomorrow as I couldn't see paying $25 for state efile. I think we'll walk into the city's offices and have them fill ours out. No, they are not difficult, but I want to see if I can get an exemption from filling ever again. Unless I do something to get K-1 forms, go back to work or own rentals... I should not have anything taxed by the city.

refunds applied to next years taxes... have to do estimated payments.

[Lakedog]

Mailed return 2/14 and received direct deposit of the very small refund on 3/6.

[LOL!]

Yesterday I just got my 2015 tax situation finished off. NY state finally agreed that I had filled out my state income tax return correctly and that I did not owe them any taxes.

[gerntz]

Filed Saturday. Got LLC K-1's Tuesday, finished Wednesday & reviewed everything Friday. We didn't make as much from the LLC as I'd predicted, so grossly overpaid taxes and under withdrew from IRA's. Not the end of world. Did find $500 worth of deductions I'd missed in the review.

[RobbieB]

All done. E-filed both and paid the twenty five bucks for State. Feds accepted return one hour after file. Pin and driver license number and issue and expiration dates given. Gonna be hard to hack me.

Let the state keep all the dough and the feds keep half the dough. Estimated payments here too.

Now drinking rum & coke -

[CardsFan]

Thought I was done. Paid the state $9, got $1,800 back from the feds. First year in retirement so I am still trying to figure out what I need to have withheld from withdrawals.

BUT, since I did work for Megacorp for a few weeks in 2016, I also had W-2 income, and just got a W-2c. How a freaking MegaCorp with 52,000 employees can screw up w-2's 2 years in a row is beyond me. In 2015 I was still working, so the word got out not to file until the correction came out. For 2016, I had no warning, so I filed.

Now I need to file both state and federal amended returns, but hey, I get a total of $8 back!!

A royal PIA.

OK. Rant over.

[RobbieB]

State just accepted e-file.

Done -

[Fedup]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fedup Just sent in one of my kid's tax return. Waiting for kid #1 to come back from vacation to do hers. I've done mostly mine, except I need to check on Vanguard's 1099- Brokerage. I'm getting tax back, so not in a hurry. I mean I won't get into trouble for not doing it on time. But this week I have a piano midterm, so all my energy is going there.

My kid just got her tax return a few days ago. So about 20 days.