2017 Estimated end of year Distributions for Mutual Funds - some already published

[audreyh1]

I saw the Fidelity had published their preliminary estimates for end of year distributions from their mutual funds, and I discovered quite a few other fund companies had also published them according to this handy page from Mutual Fund Observer:
https://mutualfundobserver.com/discuss/discussion/35512/2017-capital-gains-estimates
There are more in the comments, so I recommend searching on your fund company name.

Most fund company estimates are published by Nov 15.

The Fidelity link is here:
https://www.fidelity.com/mutual-funds/information/year-end

 

[Amethyst]

T. Rowe Price has preliminaries out, but you have to search their web site for "year end distros." Vanguard says their preliminaries will be up by Nov 10th.

 

[Looking4Ward]

T. Rowe Price has preliminaries out, but you have to search their web site for "year end distros." Vanguard says their preliminaries will be up by Nov 10th.

If you go to Vanguard's website, search for a fund, and then click on the "Distributions" tab for that fund, there will be a section at the bottom left that shows the realized capital gains/losses for that fund throughout the year. It's typically updated at the end of every quarter. These are the capital gains/losses that the fund itself has incurred, not individual investor account activity.

For instance, for VWIAX it currently shows a 60 cent per share capital gain as of 9/30/17. Likewise, VWENX shows a realized capital gain of $2.42 per share as of 9/30/17.

I've found these to be very helpful throughout the year as I estimate what the capital distributions at year end will be for each of my funds.

 

[audreyh1]

T. Rowe Price has preliminaries out, but you have to search their web site for "year end distros." Vanguard says their preliminaries will be up by Nov 10th.

The link to T-Rowe Price distributions is in the web site above.

Last year the first Vanguard estimates came out around the 11th I think.

 

[Amethyst]

Thanks - I just looked up VTSAX and it shows a capital loss of ten cents a share. Will that loss be passed to investors, also?

If you go to Vanguard's website, search for a fund, and then click on the "Distributions" tab for that fund, there will be a section at the bottom left that shows the realized capital gains/losses for that fund throughout the year. It's typically updated at the end of every quarter. These are the capital gains/losses that the fund itself has incurred, not individual investor account activity.

For instance, for VWIAX it currently shows a 60 cent per share capital gain as of 9/30/17. Likewise, VWENX shows a realized capital gain of $2.42 per share as of 9/30/17.

I've found these to be very helpful throughout the year as I estimate what the capital distributions at year end will be for each of my funds.

 

[bingybear]

Thanks - I just looked up VTSAX and it shows a capital loss of ten cents a share. Will that loss be passed to investors, also?

No, losses are carried forward in the fund and can be used to offset gains. These losses are held in the fund.

 

[audreyh1]

Thanks - I just looked up VTSAX and it shows a capital loss of ten cents a share. Will that loss be passed to investors, also?

no. It will be offset against future gains.

 

[Scrapr]

Thanks - I just looked up VTSAX and it shows a capital loss of ten cents a share. Will that loss be passed to investors, also?

Look over on the right side of that chart showing (.10) realized appreciation. There is the unrealized appreciation. The fund is up over 18% this year. I believe a good portion of that gain will be passed on to investors

 

[audreyh1]

Look over on the right side of that chart showing (.10) realized appreciation. There is the unrealized appreciation. The fund is up over 18% this year. I believe a good portion of that gain will be passed on to investors

How much is passed onto investors depends on whether the appreciated stocks were sold thus realizing capital gains. A fund can gain a lot and pay out little to no distributions if there isn't any selling going on. Selling can be caused by other fund investors selling their shares as well as the fund managers deciding to take some profits.

 

[scrabbler1]

I wrote in another thread about how Fidelity had just posted its year-end distributions and how an extraordinarily large one threw me off the ACA premium subsidy cliff and cost me $700.

 

[audreyh1]

I wrote in another thread about how Fidelity had just posted its year-end distributions and how an extraordinarily large one threw me off the ACA premium subsidy cliff and cost me $700.

Yes, sorry for you.

But it made me go look for those estimated distributions

 

[GrayHare]

On average how are the distributions looking relative to 2016? Given how stocks have performed lately I'd guess up 10% to 20%.

 

[audreyh1]

On average how are the distributions looking relative to 2016? Given how stocks have performed lately I'd guess up 10% to 20%.

I'm seeing something like up 20% so far for me

 

[scrabbler1]

On average how are the distributions looking relative to 2016? Given how stocks have performed lately I'd guess up 10% to 20%.

For the stock fund I have been lamenting about, it was up 62% from last year on a per-share basis.

 

[gcgang]

I saw the Fidelity had published their preliminary estimates for end of year distributions from their mutual funds, and I discovered quite a few other fund companies had also published them according to this handy page from Mutual Fund Observer:
https://mutualfundobserver.com/discuss/discussion/35512/2017-capital-gains-estimates
There are more in the comments, so I recommend searching on your fund company name.

Most fund company estimates are published by Nov 15.

The Fidelity link is here:
https://www.fidelity.com/mutual-funds/information/year-end

Thanks, Audrey.

 

[dirt_dobber]

Here are some Vanguard expected dates ~
November 10, 2017 Preliminary capital gains estimates
December 8, 2017 Updated and expanded estimates
December 18, 2017 Updated estimated breakdown
Mark your calendar for year-end fund distributions
https://investornews.vanguard/mark-your-calendar-for-year-end-fund-distributions-2/

 

[bingybear]

I wrote in another thread about how Fidelity had just posted its year-end distributions and how an extraordinarily large one threw me off the ACA premium subsidy cliff and cost me $700.

I understand your pain, but wonder why you would hold MF in taxable accounts. They have to distribute realized gains. Especially after long run ups and either redemption or the MF shifting investments can generate large distributions. 2007/8 were especially bad for me. This is especially bad for for active funds. However, I do wonder how index MF will behave when/if distributions exceed new investments when large numbers of retirees are pulling $ to live on.

The thing that hit home in 07/8 for me was that you could be responsible for gains that you did not participate.

On the other side, after huge losses, MF have a tendency to not distribute at high levels (after the initial purge).

ETFs can avoid some of this with the use of Authorized Participants. I do not hold MF in taxable accounts to avoid this issue. I would suggest you do something similar if you want some control.

 

[scrabbler1]

I understand your pain, but wonder why you would hold MF in taxable accounts. They have to distribute realized gains. Especially after long run ups and either redemption or the MF shifting investments can generate large distributions. 2007/8 were especially bad for me. This is especially bad for for active funds. However, I do wonder how index MF will behave when/if distributions exceed new investments when large numbers of retirees are pulling $ to live on.

The thing that hit home in 07/8 for me was that you could be responsible for gains that you did not participate.

On the other side, after huge losses, MF have a tendency to not distribute at high levels (after the initial purge).

ETFs can avoid some of this with the use of Authorized Participants. I do not hold MF in taxable accounts to avoid this issue. I would suggest you do something similar if you want some control.

I retired at 45, 9 years ago, well before the ACA was passed. I use the income from my taxable mutual funds (bond and stock) to pay my bills. The stock fund is mainly an inflation guard although it supplies some quarterly dividend income. This stock fund is one I have owned since 1996, so I didn't choose it as part of my ER plan, unlike the big bond fund I own which I did chose for ER purposes. The cap gains from the stock fund is a by-product of keeping it as an inflation guard.

 

[audreyh1]

For some folks (like us), their tax deferred accounts are much much smaller than their taxable, so they can't really keep the least tax efficient investments tax-deferred only.

 

[Amethyst]

That is our situation - plus our pensions are taxed as ordinary income, so we're in a higher tax bracket no matter what we did or do.

For some folks (like us), their tax deferred accounts are much much smaller than their taxable, so they can't really keep the least tax efficient investments tax-deferred only.

 

[UnrealizedPotential]

It's nice not to have to worry about year end distributions and the tax consequences as much as I used to in previous years. It has to do with having ETF's , a Roth IRA, and a regular IRA. I used to like year end distributions. I have grown to not like them. So I have tried to structure my investments to where I have the least amount of year end distributions as possible.

Members of this forum told me as much a few years ago. I kept an open mind. They were right.

 

[audreyh1]

I'd pay way more in taxes if I restructured things now to minimize capital gains distributions. At the moment they more or less match what I need to sell in order to withdraw income and rebalance, so it's not so onerous.

Conveniently - the outperformers are the ones paying the larger distributions so they are kind of "self-rebalancing" in that respect. I take all distributions in cash and after taking my annual income I correct any additional strongly out of balance positions.

Obviously the most tax efficient thing is to own stocks and just live off qualified dividends and never take capital gains. But I'm not interested in owning stocks directly.

 

[bingybear]

My avoidance of MF in taxable accounts is due to experiences with large distributions. While it doesn't happen often, I've had distributions up to 25% in some odd years. This is part of the reason I've moved to ETFs. It took several years to make the move due to limiting some of the tax cost of the shift.

 

[Scuba]

I understand your pain, but wonder why you would hold MF in taxable accounts. They have to distribute realized gains. Especially after long run ups and either redemption or the MF shifting investments can generate large distributions. 2007/8 were especially bad for me. This is especially bad for for active funds. However, I do wonder how index MF will behave when/if distributions exceed new investments when large numbers of retirees are pulling $ to live on.



The thing that hit home in 07/8 for me was that you could be responsible for gains that you did not participate.



On the other side, after huge losses, MF have a tendency to not distribute at high levels (after the initial purge).



ETFs can avoid some of this with the use of Authorized Participants. I do not hold MF in taxable accounts to avoid this issue. I would suggest you do something similar if you want some control.

+1
I hold very few MF's in taxable accounts for tax control.

 

[Scuba]

For some folks (like us), their tax deferred accounts are much much smaller than their taxable, so they can't really keep the least tax efficient investments tax-deferred only.

This is also my situation, but I hold a combination of ETF's and individual shares in taxable portfolio to avoid tax issues I have less control over.