Americans spend hours and hours preparing their taxes. We shouldn’t have to.

[Alan]

Hear, hear!

That's what bugs me about our US tax system - I have to go through screen after screen after screen of "did you do this?", "did you partake in that?", " did you live in an area that had this or that occur?", and the IL seems to be even worse. But you don't want to miss a legitimate credit either.

All this stuff, like a rebate for a high efficiency furnace, etc, should be outside the tax system. You bought the furnace, the salesperson can inform you of the credit, and you apply for it. Don't bother the other 97% that didn't buy a new furnace that year, many of whom did not buy a high efficiency one, so it doesn't apply anyhow. And all that complicates the tax program, a needless complication that doesn't apply to a large majority.

If you did buy a qualifying furnace, the form could always ask for some info from your 1040 if they want to scale it somehow. Though bottom line, I'm against all these subsidy/credits anyhow, but at least keep it simple if you are going to do them (the "you" being Congress).

-ERD50

In the UK it is truly outside the income tax system as far the taxpayer is concerned. A couple of months ago I installed an EV charger that came with a £250 rebate, and that amount is listed and deducted on the invoice because it is the installer who claims the rebate. It is the same with the rebate on our EV, the dealer claims back the money from the government after deducting from our invoice.

For charities you fill in a form to register with the charity when giving a gift and it is the charity that claims an extra 25% back from the tax man. When we donated a washing machine the British Heart Foundation picked it up and a couple of weeks later I got a thank you letter and statement saying that it had sold for £59, and they will claim another 25% because I am a taxpayer and it was a “gift aid”

 

[Midpack]

I have mastered many technologies over the course of my life. Some of the them have been useful, but others seemed then and now to be nothing but solutions in search of a problem. There never has been, is not now, and likely never will be any reason for my refrigerator to communicate with my doorbell.

I like to think of myself as somewhat of an early adopter for my generation at least - but I've never gotten the need for connected appliances, lights, thermostats, etc., so I guess I'm officially a curmudgeon now...

 

[youbet]

I pretty much hate doing anything on a phone, I'm used to having a full sized keyboard, numeric keypad, function keys, 3-button mouse, dual monitors, a copy paste buffer, and eight 'virtual desktops' with dozens of windows open.

-ERD50

Do you pull that setup around on a cart, hire sherpa's or what? It just sounds big and heavy to hang on your belt........

 

[rk911]

I like to think of myself as somewhat of an early adopter for my generation at least - but I've never gotten the need for connected appliances, lights, thermostats, etc., so I guess I'm officially a curmudgeon now...

I embrace technology...some of it anyway. but I agree...why does our fridge, washer, dryer, microwave, etc. need to be 'internet enabled'? when we remodeled our kitchen and laundry we rejected any appliance that was so enabled. but I may be tilting at windmills...again.

 

[TheWizard]

I embrace technology...some of it anyway. but I agree...why does our fridge, washer, dryer, microwave, etc. need to be 'internet enabled'? when we remodeled our kitchen and laundry we rejected any appliance that was so enabled. but I may be tilting at windmills...again.

I have a robot floor vac and about a dozen on/off and dimmer switches controlled by a WiFi app (as well as manual override).
I have certain LED lights set up to turn on as night lights depending on sunset and sunrise. These change automatically as daylight lengthens/shortens, goes to Saving Time and back, and deals with power outages.

What I want next is for all of my clocks, whether on a stove/microwave display or hanging on a wall to update themselves automatically via WiFi as needed...

 

[CardsFan]

I have mastered many technologies over the course of my life. Some of the them have been useful, but others seemed then and now to be nothing but solutions in search of a problem. There never has been, is not now, and likely never will be any reason for my refrigerator to communicate with my doorbell.

I like to think of myself as somewhat of an early adopter for my generation at least - but I've never gotten the need for connected appliances, lights, thermostats, etc., so I guess I'm officially a curmudgeon now...

I am a bit of a curmudgeon myself, and agree with most of this. However, I have found a wifi enabled thermostat and garage door opener to quite useful

 

[ERD50]

In the UK it is truly outside the income tax system as far the taxpayer is concerned. A couple of months ago I installed an EV charger that came with a £250 rebate, and that amount is listed and deducted on the invoice because it is the installer who claims the rebate. It is the same with the rebate on our EV, the dealer claims back the money from the government after deducting from our invoice.

For charities you fill in a form to register with the charity when giving a gift and it is the charity that claims an extra 25% back from the tax man. When we donated a washing machine the British Heart Foundation picked it up and a couple of weeks later I got a thank you letter and statement saying that it had sold for £59, and they will claim another 25% because I am a taxpayer and it was a “gift aid”

While it's outside the area of this forum, I really have to wonder what led to your politicians creating what sounds like a reasonable way to deal with these credits, vs the US politicians and their overly complicated way.

I figure all of 'em are trying to gain power, so I'm just a bit surprised at the difference.

-ERD50

 

[ERD50]

I am talking about actual friends I interact with weekly here, trust me they openly admit they don't like change, especially tech...

Oh I don't doubt that, I was just pointing out that it isn't always the case.

Do you pull that setup around on a cart, hire sherpa's or what? It just sounds big and heavy to hang on your belt........

Hiring Sherpas sounds like a good entry for the BTD thread!

But yeah, I just don't like doing more than the basics on a small touch-screen. If I can, while I'm out, I'll ask someone - "Can you just email it to me, I'll deal with it when I get home and can use my 'real' computer?".

-ERD50

 

[Alan]

While it's outside the area of this forum, I really have to wonder what led to your politicians creating what sounds like a reasonable way to deal with these credits, vs the US politicians and their overly complicated way.

I figure all of 'em are trying to gain power, so I'm just a bit surprised at the difference.

-ERD50

How would UK politicians gain power by making the tax system so complex? There are very strict regulations on lobbying, campaign contributions etc. A candidate can only spend a tiny amount of money in campaigning ($20k?) and the central parties are NOT allowed to campaign on behalf of individual candidates plus no TV advertising is allowed so there is a level playing field for all parties. Yesterday was a big day with local elections going on in the UK and the media were not allowed to interview politicians or do anything that may influence the electoral process on voting day.

It has always been this way, I had never ever filed a return in the UK until after returning from the USA in 2016 and my wife and I each have to file each year now because we have foreign income but even so it is very easy to do online, no tax software required.

Folks working for employers and have regular UK savings and investments only ever have to check the returns done for them by HMRC since tax is taken via withholdings at source and HMRC receive the UK equivalent of W2s, and 1099s and all other deductions and credits are handled outside the personal income tax system. Self employed, landlords etc have to file self assessment returns.

 

[Gumby]

HMRC = Her Majesty's Revenue and Customs. The UK equivalent of the IRS.

 

[Badger]

I like to think of myself as somewhat of an early adopter for my generation at least - but I've never gotten the need for connected appliances, lights, thermostats, etc., so I guess I'm officially a curmudgeon now...

+1
I never was one to want things more complex. The more "whistles and bells" there are the more there is to go wrong. I don't need that aggravation. My wife on the other hand likes the electronic gismos and has a watch linked to her phone and a TV remote she can talk to for changing the channels.

Cheers!

 

[Midpack]

I am a bit of a curmudgeon myself, and agree with most of this. However, I have found a wifi enabled thermostat and garage door opener to quite useful

Not to argue or challenge but why? I have a programmable thermostat and find that very useful, but I don't need to alter the program very often so not sure what WiFi would add. And our cars have HomeLink, and there's an old fashioned button by the door to the garage. What would WiFi add for the garage. Honest, just asking?

 

[MichaelB]

A wifi enabled thermostat allows the user to access and control it from a remote location via cellphone. Not of interest to all but still a fairly useful feature.

 

[Alan]

A wifi enabled thermostat allows the user to access and control it from a remote location via cellphone. Not of interest to all but still a fairly useful feature.

+1

When we started doing extensive travel I bought a Wi-Fi camera pointed at a thermometer placed in front of the entrance hall as I was concerned that the A/C might fail while we were away. Once we had a smart thermostat not only could I view the temperature I also set a high temperature alarm that would alert me via text that there was a problem.

Now that we are in England we do a lot more short trips away and if I ever forget to change the schedule on the thermostat I can do that remotely. When we are about to return home from a trip it is nice to be able to set the heating to come on ahead of time.

 

[pb4uski]

Read half the thread.



For me preparing for taxes is a year long affair as I have Sched C income and I do Roth conversions. Tracking the Cash Flow of my business takes time (I have an excel sheet). For the actual tax form prep, I use an excel sheet available each year on Boglehead and then transcribe over to the pdf forms. I still file on paper - I've been dinged several times with regard to my personal information and the federal government not protecting it through the OPM breach and others such that I do not trust the electronic filing. Yes, I know the paper can be an issue, however, with electronic the mistakes propagate much more quickly.



11 hours is probably a bit low some years and about right others.



As for other countries' practices and having the IRS just send me a bill, I already get that with being a US fed employee for my overseas move and storage; they are woefully off on their estimates and I end up overpaying for those privileges every year. So, trust factor is low with regard to their calcs. Also, I will ensure my interests are taken care of and am not interested in them being my agent for those interests.



Now, if they were willing to go to a simpler tax code or flat tax, then I'd be wiling to be a bit more trusting. I don't see that happening. Even with the supposed 'simplification' that came with the last tax, act, I noticed I was sending in more forms and this year, it was worse; I don't see that as simplification.

You could still buy TurboTax download version to prepare for return and then print it and file by mail if you don't want to use electronic filing. It might save a lot of time for you.