Crazy Expat Plan

Many of the posters on this board are in technology or a field that if you take any significant time away it can be very difficult to return to the same field. Since you are in food service, my thoughts are this would not be the case with you.

You are 32 years old and from what I can tell, with no obligations (wife, kids, etc).

You have some significant resources that, while unlikely enough for a permanent retirement, can fund a carefully planned adventure for a number of years.

Possible negative: if where you are currently employed offers substantial upward mobility in the (near) future including wage increases, you may be sacrificing some serious income. Only you know the answer to this.

Another possible negative: If you are able to carefully swing this for an extended period of time, your social security later in life will be seriously compromised, and it is possible you will need to live your elder years on an Austerity budget, and/or work until you drop. My 32 year old self had a significantly different image of my 65 year old self than my 45 year old self does currently (hope that made sense). That being said, if at 45 you start to worry about these kinds of things, there is still time to return stateside and work for 20 or so years to build up the nest egg and social security for a more secure traditional retirement.

In your position, with your apparent desires, I would probably sell all of my stateside posessions and hop a plane. I really don't see much of a downside here, as long as all my points above are accurate. Don't leave anything here to add to expenses, no storage lockers or anything.

Just be prepared to come back stateside if things don't work out. If you are willing to live like the locals in low cost areas, and you can find some work, who knows how long you could swing this. Be careful about finding work though, make sure you know, understand, and follow the local laws.

Let us know if you go for it, and please stay in touch on the board if you do. I, and likely others, would like to learn from your adventures.

Also, There are others that have done what you want to do. The first ones that come to mind are who I consider some of the pioneers of early retirement, Paul and Vicki Terhorst. They wrote a book, "Cashing in on the American Dream" somewhere in the 80s. Also, Bill and Akaisha Kaderli. Both of these couples make some money off of writing articles and blogs, but you might check them out, as they've both been doing the expat thing for a long time.

Good luck!

-Pan

I've never planned on having SS. I've read Terhorst's book. I have no upward mobility at my job. I am at the top of my game when it comes to income in Vegas. It won't get much better.

I will probably work six months to build up some cash reserves and then pull the trigger. Great analysis BTW
 
look into Chiang Mai, Thailand


Many expats live there for $6,000 per year or less
Not even close to a realistic long term budget. How do I know? I used to live in Chiang Mai. In fact, I have spent a fair amount of time there with both Paul/Vicki and Billy/Akaisha and they certainly were not living like that.

Also, the OP would have to get a work visa or a language learning visa and attend school in order to legally live there long term. The retirement visa, besides requiring about $24,000 in a Thai bank account, requires that you be 50 years old or over. I was a 40-something millionaire living in Chiang Mai but I couldn't get a proper non-tourist visa, at least under conditions that I preferred. Doing visa runs on a tourist visa is not viable in Thailand for long-term living. Teaching English pay in Chiang Mai is awful, way below what one would get in Bangkok (which is also very low).

By the way, if any board members will be in Chiang Mai in the first half of February, I will be visiting there with my Filipina girlfriend, would love to meet up :)
 
Another possible negative: If you are able to carefully swing this for an extended period of time, your social security later in life will be seriously compromised

I was going to say that SS for most folks under 40 is seriously compromised. I don't include it in any retirement planning.

One other thing that OP may think about, but 300k or so is a LOT and you can certainly start a business over there for far less. It may require some hoops to jump through, but I know for instance a computer shop in the Philippines could be done for maybe 4-5k.
 
Sorry to put a damper on things, but the 4% safe withdrawal rate with inflation adjustments guideline is for a maximum duration of 30 years. It assumes there will be a draw down of principal. After 30 years, when you are 62, your nest egg would likely be depleted.
Don't worry you aren't putting much of a damper on things because what you're saying isn't true.

Your chance of running out of money is certainly higher pulling 4% for time frames longer than 30 years, but that isn't the same thing as "most likely depleted" at 30. Here is from firecalc for 30 years at 4% starting with $1,000,000:

krXLvy2.png


Given the red line is $0 (depleted) drawing 4% clearly doesn't usually deplete the portfolio after 30 years, and in fact firecalc shows a success rate of over 80% for a 40 year withdrawal phase at 4%.
 
I think you have underestimated the cost of living in SE Asia.

I would budget of US$4,000 per month.
Since everyone has different ideas of a minimally acceptable lifestyle it is hard to put a right or wrong answer on cost of living, but there are plenty of blogs from people who live fairly comfortable in Chiang Mai for far less than $4,4000 per month. I don't mean the $350/month studio slum rice every day types, I mean people with reasonably nice apartments who seem to have a decent thing going like:

$1,759/month = The Cost of Living Like a Boss in Chiang Mai

$1,433/month = Report: The Cost of Living in Chiang Mai, Thailand : Pause The Moment – Travel | Adventure | Location Independence

$1,180/month = Chiang Mai Budget Breakdown - Tieland to Thailand

$1,351/month = The Cost of Living in Chiang Mai, Thailand

Obviously his mileage may vary, but there sure are a lot of couples living on less than $2,000 per month, I'd wager a single person could probably manage on something far less than $4,000 without sacrificing too much if he's willing to move someowhere relatively cheap.
 
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I will be very surprised if OP indeed lives for the next 50 years or so on his $300K savings. There will be many opportunities in the next 50 years that may change OP's financial situations, e.g., meeting a royal Thai girl and problem being solved.

OP has probably been making money with an independent life for about 10 years. Who knows what will be out there for the next 50 years.
 
Thanks for all the budget links. I do have a slight beef with Thailand. When I was there it kind of felt like this, "Give us your money and get the f#%^ out." Hence the 90 day visa. I'm not opposed to living there but they sure make you jump through hoops.
 
I got this PM:


Your plan to move to Puerto Rico sounds great, do it while you are young, this board is old guys, requiring a lot of money and solid answers to move.
I have traveled a lot, always looking for an alternate place to live, winterwise, or if the world changes.
Read every international living magazine article you can, they push certain countries and real estate, but also cover $ and visa, work issues.
Live like a local, for sure.
My recommendations are...since you obviously speak spanish, ...move right now to PR, and explore that lifestyle and surrounding places. I would say you check out, viaques island, roatan, with its 21k us expats, and curacao with 3 women for each guy. These are place I consider to be doable, and have traveled to them. I am older also with some health issues, so fulltime wouldnt work, but I am considering buying a place overseas, once I quit traveling/exploring. By the way, last time I emailed with the Terhorts, they were back in Austin, tx. Which with social security and medicare, might be your old age retirement plan.
Terry


Sounds and smells like bullshi*t.
 
I got this PM:


Your plan to move to Puerto Rico sounds great, do it while you are young, this board is old guys, requiring a lot of money and solid answers to move.
I have traveled a lot, always looking for an alternate place to live, winterwise, or if the world changes.
Read every international living magazine article you can, they push certain countries and real estate, but also cover $ and visa, work issues.
Live like a local, for sure.
My recommendations are...since you obviously speak spanish, ...move right now to PR, and explore that lifestyle and surrounding places. I would say you check out, viaques island, roatan, with its 21k us expats, and curacao with 3 women for each guy. These are place I consider to be doable, and have traveled to them. I am older also with some health issues, so fulltime wouldnt work, but I am considering buying a place overseas, once I quit traveling/exploring. By the way, last time I emailed with the Terhorts, they were back in Austin, tx. Which with social security and medicare, might be your old age retirement plan.
Terry


Sounds and smells like bullshi*t.


Excellent advice, especially if you speak spanish. At least in PR you are still basically in the US with all the advantages (and disadvantages) that provides. This board does skew old, if you asked this same question on MMM (Mr Money Mustache) you would have gotten significantly different feedback, I would imagine. With that being said, you are also getting a viewpoint that older people do think alot more about security than a 32 year old does. I'm about 13 years older than you, so not that old, but not that young anymore either. This is what I meant when I said, "My 32 year old self had a significantly different image of my 65 year old self than my 45 year old self does currently" Most of us get naturally more conservative as we age. Also, like I also said before, there are a lot of tech types on this board, and we are naturally conservative anyway.

The only thing I can offer about PR is I know some natives who came from there. Job possibilities, from what I understand, are hard to come by. Good jumping off point tho!
 
So, if I understand retirementguy1's last post, he publicly posted in this thread a private Private Message (PM) sent to him, a PM with plenty of information and obviously sent in good faith. He also posted the board member's real first name which was included in the private message.

And then he said said it was bullsh*t.

Please tell me that my interpretation is wrong and that someone would not really stoop that low.
 
Gotta admit I was a few beers deep which sometimes make me a little paranoid. A couple spots just rubbed me wrong. My apologies.
 
Since everyone has different ideas of a minimally acceptable lifestyle it is hard to put a right or wrong answer on cost of living, but there are plenty of blogs from people who live fairly comfortable in Chiang Mai for far less than $4,4000 per month. I don't mean the $350/month studio slum rice every day types, I mean people with reasonably nice apartments who seem to have a decent thing going like:

$1,759/month = The Cost of Living Like a Boss in Chiang Mai

$1,433/month = Report: The Cost of Living in Chiang Mai, Thailand : Pause The Moment – Travel | Adventure | Location Independence

$1,180/month = Chiang Mai Budget Breakdown - Tieland to Thailand

$1,351/month = The Cost of Living in Chiang Mai, Thailand

Obviously his mileage may vary, but there sure are a lot of couples living on less than $2,000 per month, I'd wager a single person could probably manage on something far less than $4,000 without sacrificing too much if he's willing to move someowhere relatively cheap.

These seem to be pretty reasonable numbers for Cambodia as well, around $1200-$1800 per month gives a pretty decent lifestyle here. Some live on less, but these are usually short timers. One thing I would caution is that there are big changes happening all over Asia, SE Asia included. Western shopping malls are cropping up, modern condos, prices increasing, lifestyles changing. I would not expect to see the same low cost 3rd world lifestyle 10 to 20 years from now as you see today. The changes I have seen in only the last 10 years have been astounding. As for visa, now in Cambodia just get a business visa (they never ask what your business is) and renew it annually for about $240 a year. But always remember times are changing, and low income expats here are complaining how much harder things are getting, work permits, etc. As these countries develop they will become less and less welcoming to poor foreigners with nothing to contribute, just coming in to live cheaply.
 
If you have never lived abroad before I would retire first in the US for a year or so; taking on two very stressful things simultaneously isn't a good idea. Once you have transitioned into retirement and are psychologically and financially adjusted, then you can consider moving overseas.

You must understand all the US and local tax and financial implications of the move as well as the basics of things like healthcare. Also remember than moving abroad when you are 50 or 60 is different than if you are a young student just out for some adventure.
 
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Also remember than moving abroad when you are 50 or 60 is different than if you are a young student just out for some adventure.

Although the thought of 3 women for every guy could appeal to a man of any age. :)
 

These are not realistic amounts for long term living, just boasts to show "how little I can live on" for very short terms. Where is the expense for replacing your stolen moto, or parts missing, for doctor bills, for unexpected emergencies or unexpected opportunities. The bar girl at the lady bar might look tempting but it will cost you $800 a month for 6 months to get rid of that Hep C before it destroys your liver and kills you. (not that you would do that of course) But you will have medical and other expenses, hey its a 3rd world country.

These kinds of nonsense posts don't do anyone any good, except I guess to sell books or advertising on their blogs. In any retirement you have to consider replacement costs, replacing a car or a moto, or replacing a hip, or buying your girlfriend tickets to that new movie theater, new clothes, dinners.

Unexpected expenses or only unexpected as to the type, not that they are unlikely, they are a certainty. Unless you are a short-term backpacker type, these blogs are nonsense.
 

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