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Old 06-16-2020, 10:26 PM   #41
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My deceased friend's son texted me today to tell me he had spoken with his contact at the funeral home. The gentleman has worked at this funeral home for years.

Funeral home guy says he has encountered multiple people who have had issues with burial reserve CD's getting 'lost' at Wells Fargo.

Well, isn't that interesting!
I'm shocked

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Old 06-17-2020, 01:07 AM   #42
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This would make a great “Sixty Minutes” story about how Wells Fargo cheats little old ladies! Your story is a warning that we should keep good records as our own failsafe.
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Old 06-17-2020, 08:37 AM   #43
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Doo not like to deal with Wells Fargo
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Old 06-17-2020, 01:54 PM   #44
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I should have thought of checking with the funeral home to see whether others have had the same issues. That was a big miss. I'm really glad her son had this conversation. Looking forward to providing more info to the OCC once the case is opened. Only a summary of the issue and no documentation is submitted with the claim initially.

The evidence supporting my friend's claim:
1. The original certificates in hand.
2. 1099-INT's up to Wells Fargo takeover.
3. Handwritten note referencing the value of the CD's in 2010.
4. A letter acknowledging my friend asked about the value in 2015.
5. Other customers of the funeral home having the same problem with Wells Fargo.
6. Wells Fargo's pathetic reputation.

The evidence supporting Wells Fargo's position:
1. "We have no record of the CD's."
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Old 06-17-2020, 06:08 PM   #45
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.... The evidence supporting Wells Fargo's position:
1. "We have no record of the CD's."
My position would be that I have evidence of the CD... unless you (Wells Fargo) have evidence that the CD has been paid then it it still in-force and you need to pay it.
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Old 06-17-2020, 06:33 PM   #46
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Yup. The lack of 1099's is by far the most damning evidence as it's law.
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Old 06-17-2020, 06:55 PM   #47
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My DW has had great success, when having a problem with a company, sending an email to the CEO. Give some thought to having your friend's son send such an email stating 3 things:
numbers of the 2 CD's
Lack of cooperation from prior dealing with Wells Fargo employees
That complaint has already been filed with Comptroller of Currency
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Old 06-17-2020, 10:10 PM   #48
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My position would be that I have evidence of the CD... unless you (Wells Fargo) have evidence that the CD has been paid then it it still in-force and you need to pay it.
I agree with you. We just have to find someone to force Wells Fargo to accept responsibility and pay up. We're hoping that's the OCC. If it's not the them, I will pursue small claims court as another poster suggested.
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Old 06-17-2020, 10:13 PM   #49
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My DW has had great success, when having a problem with a company, sending an email to the CEO. Give some thought to having your friend's son send such an email stating 3 things:
numbers of the 2 CD's
Lack of cooperation from prior dealing with Wells Fargo employees
That complaint has already been filed with Comptroller of Currency
I'm sure the rot at Wells Fargo flows from the top. The CEO and the OCC can hash it out.
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Old 06-17-2020, 10:15 PM   #50
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Yup. The lack of 1099's is by far the most damning evidence as it's law.
And if Wells Fargo lost track of her (which would be very hard to do), the money should be sitting in FL unclaimed funds.
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Old 06-17-2020, 11:32 PM   #51
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What I don't understand is why WF can get away with claiming "we can't find it/ we know nothing". Since you have the certificate # they should be required to provide proof to credentialed family member of the disposition of certificate #XYZ4.
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Old 06-18-2020, 03:48 AM   #52
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What I don't understand is why WF can get away with claiming "we can't find it/ we know nothing". Since you have the certificate # they should be required to provide proof to credentialed family member of the disposition of certificate #XYZ4.
+1 if they can't provide the documentation when it was redeemed... a withdrawal request signed by the deceased... and where the proceeds were sent or a cancelled check for the proceeds then they can't refute the other evidence that the CD still exists.

But still a great lesson for us all to keep good track of all things financial that are significant.
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Old 06-18-2020, 09:10 AM   #53
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I'm sure the rot at Wells Fargo flows from the top. The CEO and the OCC can hash it out.
The OCC does not do much more than pass the complaint along. I filed a complaint last year on Synchrony bank lying to me and taking more than three weeks to transfer IRA funds to another institution. Customer service insisted the finds were transferred the day after my request and must be lost but they would not reissue the check for a full month. When the other institution finally got the funds, I requested a copy of the envelope and sure the postmark date was three weeks after my request. After my complaint Synchrony called me once and left a voice mail. I called back within a few minutes and three times after that with no return phone call. They sent me a small check for my loss of interest along with a letter that they had attempted to contact me multiple times which was a lie and reported to OCC that case was resolved. OCC then closed my complaint without communicating with me to see if I was satisfied.
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Old 06-18-2020, 10:13 AM   #54
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+1 if they can't provide the documentation when it was redeemed... a withdrawal request signed by the deceased... and where the proceeds were sent or a cancelled check for the proceeds then they can't refute the other evidence that the CD still exists.

But still a great lesson for us all to keep good track of all things financial that are significant.
How long would you expect a bank to be able to provide such documentation? I really hope that OP is able to get satisfaction, but I'm afraid the Comptroller is going to say something like "sorry, but it's been 10 years during which the owner made no effort to inquire about the missing funds or report the lack of a 1099, and banks are only required to retain docs for 7 years, so you're out of luck". What if it had been 20 or 30 years instead of 10? There's got to be some limit. I don't know what it is, and I'm just guessing at 7 since that's how long statements are available online.
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Old 06-18-2020, 10:34 AM   #55
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How long would you expect a bank to be able to provide such documentation? I really hope that OP is able to get satisfaction, but I'm afraid the Comptroller is going to say something like "sorry, but it's been 10 years during which the owner made no effort to inquire about the missing funds or report the lack of a 1099, and banks are only required to retain docs for 7 years, so you're out of luck". What if it had been 20 or 30 years instead of 10? There's got to be some limit. I don't know what it is, and I'm just guessing at 7 since that's how long statements are available online.
I would expect a bank to be able to provide such documentation indefinitely. The original issuer sold what was essentially a term life certificate. Another institution (WFC) took on that obligation. They shouldn't be able to say "it's too hard to figure it out".


I don't recall if this was addressed.....is there FDIC coverage for this certificate?
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Old 06-18-2020, 12:25 PM   #56
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What I don't understand is why WF can get away with claiming "we can't find it/ we know nothing". Since you have the certificate # they should be required to provide proof to credentialed family member of the disposition of certificate #XYZ4.
They get away with it because they can, I guess. I agree with you that, given the son has the original certificates, the onus is on Wells Fargo to show him when the payout was made. But right now their response is, "Too bad, so sad!" We just need to find the bigger bully to get them to do the right thing. Hopefully, that is the OCC.
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Old 06-18-2020, 01:16 PM   #57
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CFPB might also help. Not sure.
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Old 06-18-2020, 01:59 PM   #58
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Another suggestion: Your local Congressman
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Old 06-18-2020, 03:45 PM   #59
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+1 if they can't provide the documentation when it was redeemed... a withdrawal request signed by the deceased... and where the proceeds were sent or a cancelled check for the proceeds then they can't refute the other evidence that the CD still exists.

But still a great lesson for us all to keep good track of all things financial that are significant.
and the 1099 b showing the sale proceeds --
tell them the onus is on them to prove that it was cashed out -- you have already proved it existed. They need to prove it was redeemed there is a 1099 that was issued at that time, as well a the interest statements thru the year of redeemedtion. They need to provide you that information. Or pay up

Congressman have an office for dealing with these types of issues. They do marvelous work. I had them help me with VA b benefits for my mother. and it worked.
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Old 06-18-2020, 03:52 PM   #60
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irs would have tax transcripts also -- you could get those and look thru all of them to see what was reported
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