Florida Condo...buy or rent?

[Bestwifeever]

I see Michael Caine is selling a condo in Miami for $8 million plus: https://miami.curbed.com/2017/6/7/15753938/michael-caine-miami-condo

It had been renting for $29k a month.

 

[ShokWaveRider]

Just wait a couple years...or make sure you buy a couple miles inland. Places like miami/ft lauderdale, st Augustine...they're going to be underwater within the next decade. Kind of a bummer cause I like the st augustine area.

This of course is utter rubbish and pure speculation. Maybe 5 decades. I will be long gone by then. St. Augustine is one of the best places to live in the country. We are 10ft above sea level.

 

[ShokWaveRider]

No one has really talked about condo fees. Here in St. Auggie, they can get up there, $500pm is not unusual.

 

[Souschef]

In my experience with condos, especially in Florida, I would rent. If you look at the makeup of the owners, the majority are snowbirds who could care less about running the condo-"I pay my rent" is the attitude. The leaves the operation to a small cadre of full time residents who may have their own agenda, and may know nothing about running a condo and the governing laws.
When i used to visit my Mom in Florida in May, the parking lot was almost deserted.

 

[Dash man]

Dash Man--
If you don't mind my asking.....where approx is that in FLA ?? is it Atlantic side or Gulf side ??

Hillsboro Beach, easy access to Ft Lauderdale airport and Port Everglades. Just south of Boca Raton.

 

[Dash man]

Why would the HOA get involved in who lives in the condo Unless it is a 'senior citizen' condo I do not see how they can prevent it...

Our condo association has to approve new owners and renters, including a Skype interview. They want to make sure you understand the HOA finances and the rules.

 

[bearkeley]

Certainly a lot to consider. Didn't know about the bed tax, for example! That would surely make it harder to make the numbers work, especially if it's an area we would want to live someday (maybe not Michael Cain's unless you guys want to donate to our Florida condo fund?)

We definitely love the water and live on the Chesapeake Bay, so we need to be near the water, but doesn't have to be the coast. We love boating, and currently cruising, enjoying the changing waterfront views....and it's all free when you anchor out...so maybe inland but near the water might be worth considering too.

Although it's so tempting to buy a condo, I guess logically, if we put 300k in a REIT, we could get 15k a year to rent a very nice place for 3-5 months until we find something we really want, in a location we really want (also just saw a listing for an awesome condo in Puerto Rico.....another topic, perhaps?) [emoji12]

 

[Texas Proud]

Our condo association has to approve new owners and renters, including a Skype interview. They want to make sure you understand the HOA finances and the rules.

You made it sound like they would not approve because she was young... that is against the law... and as far as I know they have to go with the law.... also, if she is not the owner who cares if she does not know about the finances... that is the owners job...

Now, if she said I do not care about your rules and I plan to have a party every day... then I can see them declining...

 

[Texas Proud]

I know someone else mentioned the monthly condo fees... that is important... but as Dash Man pointed out the finances of the condo is also important....

If you remember, there is a building in San Francisco that is leaning... at some time they might have to take expensive measures to correct the problem... and guess who gets to pay if they do not win the lawsuit


Also, high rise condos are usually much higher than low rise... sometimes by 2X to 3X... that can be a big difference in annual costs...

 

[Dash man]

Our quarterly condo fees are close to $1600, but include water, trash, fiber optic Internet and basic cable TV and 24 hr security. However, because the owners refuse to vote to maintain a reserve, there is an average of an additional $200/month of assessments paid annually for each owner. The 46 year old building is in pretty good shape though and they try to manage the assessments so there aren't two large ones two years in a row. But the older residents complain, yet they continue to vote against reserves. Politics in a large condo can be brutal.

 

[Out of Steam]

Yes, there is a reason inland property is cheaper than coastal property. Some find more value in the lower prices and other attributes of inland living, while others prefer to live on or very close to the beach. Coastal property tends to appreciate more and hold value better during downturns than inland property does. There are only so many homes on the coast.

In most places in the Northeast/mid-Atlantic and West Coast, governments limit new construction keeping up demand for existing houses. Most places in the Southern U.S., including Florida, they can (and do) always bulldoze and fill another 1000 acres to build subdivisions. Unless you have a waterfront or ocean/gulf view property, there no possibility of scarcity.

Your used house will always be competing with a large supply of new houses if you want to sell. The value proposition is more like buying a Buick than buying real estate. Nothing wrong with that if you can stay long enough for leave your executor to deal with it, but most people will eventually need to sell.

 

[Just_Steve]

Our quarterly condo fees are close to $1600, but include water, trash, fiber optic Internet and basic cable TV and 24 hr security. However, because the owners refuse to vote to maintain a reserve, there is an average of an additional $200/month of assessments paid annually for each owner. The 46 year old building is in pretty good shape though and they try to manage the assessments so there aren't two large ones two years in a row. But the older residents complain, yet they continue to vote against reserves. Politics in a large condo can be brutal.

$9,000 a year in HOA fees, yuck.

 

[Elbata]

Just wait a couple years...or make sure you buy a couple miles inland. Places like miami/ft lauderdale, st Augustine...they're going to be underwater within the next decade. Kind of a bummer cause I like the st augustine area.

I saw "Day After Tomorrow" too. Very educational.

 

[Dash man]

$9,000 a year in HOA fees, yuck.

Yes, but it included good high speed Internet, cable, water and 24/7 security guards. The building is in good condition and we have a beautiful view from our condo, it's beachfront and also has a nice pool with a huge deck. We're happy and can afford it. Our Pennsylvania home we pay $500/ yr and the only the we get are the public areas mowed and trash pickup. If you add the cost of cable, water, landscape maintenance, security system with cameras, a new roof this year, new windows last year, a storage shed, a backup generator the year before, higher insurance....you get the idea. The $7,000-$9,000 in condo fees aren't so bad. And we just write a check and everything else is taken care of except the property taxes and remodeling if desired.

 

[Dash man]

I saw "Day After Tomorrow" too. Very educational.

Entertainment, not so much educational.

 

[pb4uski]

Our condo association has to approve new owners and renters, including a Skype interview. They want to make sure you understand the HOA finances and the rules.

+1 not sure what their vetting procedures are and it is unclear if the rejected someone and were legally challenged whether they would prevail but they do require some general information and a few references. I think it is mainly to collect the $100 application fee... they may do a background check but I'm not sure on that.

 

[simple girl]

The only problem with that is they are very far from the water and the traffic on the roads from east to west is brutal.

+1

And, it is hotter east of 75.

Agreed, though, that prices are much cheaper. Just good to know what you are trading for that.

 

[kcowan]

Does anyone like the southern keys? Key West et al, Key Largo.

 

[Koolau]

Does anyone like the southern keys? Key West et al, Key Largo.

As part of our due diligence before moving to Paradise, we looked at the keys. Interesting architecture, life-style and people. Still, I was unimpressed with the gulf (vs the Ocean side - say around St. Augustine). The air was heavy, hot and still. Not what we were looking for. Still, you can drive there, so there's that...

 

[Dash man]

+1 not sure what their vetting procedures are and it is unclear if the rejected someone and were legally challenged whether they would prevail but they do require some general information and a few references. I think it is mainly to collect the $100 application fee... they may do a background check but I'm not sure on that.

They do a credit check and criminal background check. The interview is to go over the somewhat strict condo rules and to answer any questions we had.

 

[bearkeley]

Does anyone like the southern keys? Key West et al, Key Largo.

We were looking into the keys as well...from an investment perspective (cost to buy vs rent), the 'numbers' didn't see to work out as the other areas we have researched but sure looked like a fun place to rent for a few months..

 

[garycouture]

Been wintering in FL 2 years. Renting. Learned a lot. Renting almost always cheaper. Nice ocean view condo = 11000 hoa, 5000 property tax, 1000 insurance, special assessments?,... then mortgage 30000. Maintenance. Rent a year = 35000. Done.

 

[pb4uski]

Been wintering in FL 2 years. Renting. Learned a lot. Renting almost always cheaper. Nice ocean view condo = 11000 hoa, 5000 property tax, 1000 insurance, special assessments?,... then mortgage 30000. Maintenance. Rent a year = 35000. Done.

For more than 4 months a year, buying wins in my experience... even with a mortgage. If we had a mortgage, the mortgage and annual carrying costs for our 3-bedroom would be about $1,250/month or $15,000 a year... we have friends who rent a 2-bedroom in the building next door for Jan-Apr for $11,000. Our six-month stay costs us about $2,100/month as I figure it.