Gentleman Of Leisure In The Making

[Scuba]

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Originally Posted by haha Obviously because while this is not always true, neither is is it always false. Since it is a risk that can be avoided at no cost by el hombre continuing to toil until la doña also wants to retire, many choose to avoid the risk. Many men would prefer to go on working at the office to tackling the lady's list of things to do. At least they can leave this boss at the office, unless they have very demanding and usually important jobs. Ha

[emoji23] How true!

[Scuba]

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Originally Posted by ExFlyBoy5 Just my .02 as to a DW that continues to work after the DH retires...that is my case. We are going on year 3 of this arrangement and there isn't any resentment, just the occasional "ribbing" that would occur, anyway. For me, as long as I keep busy and don't let the household chores/management fall to her, then there aren't any issues. The DW doesn't have to work and she knows this, but it's just not in her blood to retire SO early (she's not even 40 yet). However, I would hypothesize that if you became an "extreme man of leisure" (sleeping until noon and expecting your wife to fold your underwear and cook dinner for you) then you just might run into some issues.

Yes, that would certainly raise issues!

[traineeinvestor]

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Originally Posted by Gumby I would never retire before the young wife. Too much possibility for marital discord.

That was one of my concerns (DW is 7 years younger than me) and I spent some time persuading myself that she was okay with me FIREing. She was totally on board - her only material concern was that I wouldn't have enough to keep myself occupied.

[MrLoco]

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Originally Posted by Gumby I would never retire before the young wife. Too much possibility for marital discord.

WOW! I am very surprised by this and some of the similar comments. It' s 2017.......right My wife and I are both partners in the marriage. She is younger than me and works. I am retired. I do almost all (90%) of the food shopping, cooking, cleaning, bill paying, and laundry. She hates to do those things. I do not mind. It certainly works for us and allows me to go the gym far more than I could when I was working. Thank God she "allowed" me to retire before her .

[Gumby]

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Originally Posted by MrLoco WOW! I am very surprised by this and some of the similar comments. It' s 2017.......right My wife and I are both partners in the marriage. She is younger than me and works. I am retired. I do almost all (90%) of the food shopping, cooking, cleaning, bill paying, and laundry. She hates to do those things. I do not mind. It certainly works for us and allows me to go the gym far more than I could when I was working. Thank God she "allowed" me to retire before her .

You know your wife. I know mine.

[Vincenzo Corleone]

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Originally Posted by Gumby You know your wife. I know mine.

And I know mine. Now that we have that all out of the way, does anyone have any opinion about my estimate for health insurance? Too conservative? Not conservative enough? Am I silly to worry about some yield curve predicting a recession? Is there some other tool besides Turbo Tax that I can use to estimate taxes in retirement?

RE: inheritance, I don't consider it because, as one or two others have already mentioned, I think it's way too easy for one to write out another due to hurt feelings, misunderstandings, shifting loyalties, etc.

[MichaelB]

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Originally Posted by Vincenzo Corleone And I know mine. Now that we have that all out of the way, does anyone have any opinion about my estimate for health insurance? Too conservative? Not conservative enough?

It is very difficult to project health care costs, as you can tell by the many discussions on that here. Your number of $20k per year is probably a workable estimate of the average total cost. Keep in mind that your cost will be heavily back end loaded, and the combination of inflation and age based pricing can make it very costly as you approach Medicare age.

[Gumby]

The way I model taxes in retirement is an iterative process. I start with pension income. Then, I look to withdraw enough from the portfolio to get to my estimated spending. I then calculate the taxes on that total income using my expected exemptions and deductions. I assume that all portfolio withdrawals are taxable just to be conservative. Finally, I go back to my portfolio withdrawal number and gross it up to pay the taxes, adding an addtional amount at the appropriate marginal rate.

If I wanted to be more precise, I could apply the ratio of taxable to non taxable prior to calculating the tax, but I'm not cutting it close, so I don't bother. My approach also allows me to draw from any one of my accounts as seems best from an investment point of view without allowing tax considerations to distort that choice.

I'm sure there are better and more accurate methods, but that's how I do it.

[Fedup]

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Originally Posted by Gumby You know your wife. I know mine.

I wouldn't have a problem with my husband retiring early but I know my SIL would if my brother retires early.
In our case, we both retired together within one month.

[Vincenzo Corleone]

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Originally Posted by Gumby The way I model taxes in retirement is an iterative process. I start with pension income. Then, I look to withdraw enough from the portfolio to get to my estimated spending. I then calculate the taxes on that total income using my expected exemptions and deductions. I assume that all portfolio withdrawals are taxable just to be conservative. Finally, I go back to my portfolio withdrawal number and gross it up to pay the taxes, adding an addtional amount at the appropriate marginal rate. If I wanted to be more precise, I could apply the ratio of taxable to non taxable prior to calculating the tax, but I'm not cutting it close, so I don't bother. My approach also allows me to draw from any one of my accounts as seems best from an investment point of view without allowing tax considerations to distort that choice. I'm sure there are better and more accurate methods, but that's how I do it.

Thanks. Sorry, silly question, I know - but when you say "marginal rate", what would that be based on the fact that you're collecting a pension and also harvesting your investments? I would think that the pension might be taxed at a higher rate than the investments, no? Investments and qualified dividends would be taxed at the federal level at 15%, but the pension, depending on your entire gross income might be taxed at, say, 20%, right? Sorry, I know it's a basic question (the answer to which I should already know) but I'm a bit clueless when it comes to the U.S. tax code. Thanks again for your patience.

[Gumby]

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Originally Posted by Vincenzo Corleone Thanks. Sorry, silly question, I know - but when you say "marginal rate", what would that be based on the fact that you're collecting a pension and also harvesting your investments? I would think that the pension might be taxed at a higher rate than the investments, no? Investments and qualified dividends would be taxed at the federal level at 15%, but the pension, depending on your entire gross income might be taxed at, say, 20%, right? Sorry, I know it's a basic question (the answer to which I should already know) but I'm a bit clueless when it comes to the U.S. tax code. Thanks again for your patience.

Withdrawals from tax sheltered accounts (401k 403b 457) are treated as ordinary income for tax purposes, regardless of the fact that they may have accrued as capital gains in the account. Accordingly, I need to add an extra 25 % (my marginal bracket) to the amount I take, so I can pay the taxes.

[Blue Collar Guy]

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Originally Posted by Gumby You know your wife. I know mine.

+1, I discussed packing it in with her. She agreed, However in my mind she allowed me, maybe its semantics, maybe its just how my world is. My old partner retired, his wife was not ok with it. He was home for a few months, she found him a new job with her cousin, he slaved away at that 5 more years .

[Zorba]

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Originally Posted by Vincenzo Corleone She's staying until 2022 to get the pension and healthcare (as crappy as it is). She wants RE too, she's just not desperate like I am.

That was our situation but flipping the third person pronouns (he/she). She RE'ed first.

If I had to be 100% honest, I would say that quietly resented it at first. We had both worked hard to get to this point but I was still working full time. It didn't matter that this was a choice that we had made jointly. The green-eyed monster was sitting there in the background. Very quickly though, with her not working, our home life became so much better. Your DW may come to see the many positives of having a spouse at home.

[Vincenzo Corleone]

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Originally Posted by Gumby Withdrawals from tax sheltered accounts (401k 403b 457) are treated as ordinary income for tax purposes, regardless of the fact that they may have accrued as capital gains in the account. Accordingly, I need to add an extra 25 % (my marginal bracket) to the amount I take, so I can pay the taxes.

Oh, right! SMH. I was just focusing on the "early" part of RE and thinking of only my taxable accounts.

[Vincenzo Corleone]

As a follow-up to http://www.early-retirement.org/foru...ml#post1893180 (which is too old for me to reply to):

It's getting very, very temping. As things stand now with our NW and expenses, I'm looking at a withdrawal rate of 2.97% - but that's assuming DW blows her take-home pay and our usual expenses are covered entirely by our NW (which will never happen).

Forecasting out to 2022 when DW may retire with a pension, assuming a 3% real return on our investments and a big bump in expenses by $45,000 to cover health insurance, we're looking at a withdrawal rate of around 3.13% when taking the pension into account. I would think that would be sustainable.

It seems too good to be true. I keep thinking there's got to be a mistake somewhere. I continue to look for holes in my thinking.

[Gumby]

You can still reply to old threads, so long as you check the box indicating that you realize it is old. I can simply add this thread to the earlier one if you wish.

[Vincenzo Corleone]

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Originally Posted by Gumby You can still reply to old threads, so long as you check the box indicating that you realize it is old. I can simply add this thread to the earlier one if you wish.

Sure! Thanks.