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View Poll Results: High Income Poll
less than $10K 49 31.21%
$10K to $12.5K 28 17.83%
$12.5K to $15K 19 12.10%
$15K to $17.5K 15 9.55%
$17.5K to $20K 6 3.82%
$20K to $25K 10 6.37%
$25K to $30K 4 2.55%
$30K + 26 16.56%
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Old 03-31-2017, 02:12 PM   #61
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Old 03-31-2017, 02:16 PM   #62
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Let's see $30K/mo = $360K/year. I wonder how many people thought the ranges were on a /yr basis. There is quite a spike of >$360K/yr people. At 4% withdrawal that is $9M.
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Old 03-31-2017, 03:12 PM   #63
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At 4% withdrawal that is $9M.
But you have to have a separate poll and ask folks if they are using a 4% withdrawal rate from a portfolio. I would guess that such a thing is not really happening. One can have income from many other sources besides a portfolio.
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Old 03-31-2017, 03:40 PM   #64
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Yes, I know and agree. It's just that frugality is sometimes viewed as a end in itself rather than a rational response to circumstances.
Yes I think Buffet is solidly in that category. Warren, what is your screen name? e.g. refused to pay for private jet so bought the company.
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Old 03-31-2017, 04:02 PM   #65
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I have always been slightly curious to the point of fascination by those who have "made it" financially.

Over the years I have always inquired how people managed to become successful. During my late teens and early twenties I voraciously read books and studied how to earn more in the hopes of someday having a young stranger ask me "what I did to make it?". Now I go out of my way to hide my wealth from others and keep a low profile. Mostly because I've found most people aren't interested in bettering themselves like I was, but rather what they can get out of me.

Plus I've found that contractors charge by the zip code.
I agree with you. People with real money like to lay low. I doubt that they will openly brag about that. Nothing to gain. Only headache.
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Old 03-31-2017, 05:03 PM   #66
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Yes I think Buffet is solidly in that category. Warren, what is your screen name? e.g. refused to pay for private jet so bought the company.
Buffett does not own a private jet while other people with lesser net worth own several. I recall that John Travolta likes to be at the control wheel or stick, and owns a fleet. Paul Allen, cofounder of Microsoft, owned a 767, not a bitty Lear or Gulfstream. Every billionaire owns one.

Yet, Buffett just has some fractional jet ownership like NetJets. Warren is a true LBYM. He even said that not flying commercial airlines was the only indulgence he allowed himself. See him eating at a diner with Gates in an above photo.
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Old 03-31-2017, 05:10 PM   #67
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Buffett does not own a private jet while other people with lesser net worth own several. I recall that John Travolta likes to be at the control wheel or stick, and owns a fleet. Paul Allen, cofounder of Microsoft, owned a 767, not a bitty Lear or Gulfstream. Every billionaire owns one.

Yet, Buffett just has some fractional jet ownership like NetJet. Warren is a true LBYM. He even said that not flying commercial airlines was the only indulgence he allowed himself. See his photo eating at a diner with Gates in an above photo.
I think Warren Buffet is in the hoarder category. That is a separate category, IMO. He never plans to use his money for himself nor his kids and grandkids except for college tuition. I don't know why we want to use Warren Buffet as an example.
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Old 03-31-2017, 05:18 PM   #68
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I was saying Buffett is a LBYM. I did not say I would be like him, if I were so rich.
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Old 03-31-2017, 05:20 PM   #69
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I was saying Buffett is a LBYM. I did not say I would be like him, if I were so rich.
He is an oddball to say the least. Maybe not reusing toilet paper type but LBYM means different. Let's not insult those LBYM people by saying Warren Buffet is LBYM.
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Old 03-31-2017, 05:21 PM   #70
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A little off-topic, but....

Finally... one thing I have shared with (M)(B)illionaires. Riding in a Gulfstream. Back in the travelling days my company's G5 was sometimes used for my travel to different parts of the US where we had corporate centers. Pilot, "Fidel" Castro, would go off route to refuel in Boise Idaho where they offered ten pounds of filet mignon as a perk.

edit... on reflection, it was a GIII ...same plane... a little older.

Nice memories of kidskin upholstery, incredible food... your choice, and only three or four of us as passengers. The part I remember most, was flying over the Painted Desert at 500 feet, with the plane window that extended down to under my seat.

A taste of honey!
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Old 03-31-2017, 05:22 PM   #71
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Buffett does not own a private jet while other people with lesser net worth own several. I recall that John Travolta likes to be at the control wheel or stick, and owns a fleet. Paul Allen, cofounder of Microsoft, owned a 767, not a bitty Lear or Gulfstream. Every billionaire owns one.

Yet, Buffett just has some fractional jet ownership like NetJets. Warren is a true LBYM. He even said that not flying commercial airlines was the only indulgence he allowed himself. See him eating at a diner with Gates in an above photo.
Didn't he own one before he bought NetJets? I don't have your memory skills but I seem to remember at one time or another reading about his jet named "The Indefensible" because he couldn't defend such an extravagance being a mere two or three time deca billionaire at the time...
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Old 03-31-2017, 05:27 PM   #72
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He is an oddball to say the least. Maybe not reusing toilet paper type but LBYM means different. Let's not insult those LBYM people by saying Warren Buffet is LBYM.
Just because he has simple tastes and is proud of it does not make him a bad person.

And about him leaving only a few millions to his descendants, he wanted them to make their own living. I have been a lot more generous to my children within my ability, but I do not have billions to leave them, so do not have to ponder the same question. Have we all heard about how descendants of past billionaires end up broke and becoming drug addicts?

A while ago, a local homeless person died in a back alley, and the police found out that he/she was a direct descendant of a past industrialist billionaire. That may be quite common. Vast riches can become a curse.
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Old 03-31-2017, 05:33 PM   #73
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Just because he has simple tastes and is proud of it does not make him a bad person.

And about him leaving only a few millions to his descendants, he wanted them to make their own living. I have been a lot more generous to my children, but I do not have billions to leave them, so do not have to ponder the same question. Have we all heard about how descendants of past billionaires end up broke and becoming drug addicts?

A while ago, I read that a local homeless person died in a back alley, and the police found out that he/she was a direct descendant of a past industrialist billionaire.
I don't think he is a bad person. He is odd. His first wife might not have left him for an independent life in California had he stopped making money years ago. She was the love of his life. She thought he would slow down but he never did.
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Old 03-31-2017, 05:34 PM   #74
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I do not follow Buffett to know much about his personal life and habits. His lifestyle does seem odd, compared to that of other billionaires, that's for sure.
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Old 03-31-2017, 05:49 PM   #75
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...I learn a bit about things (generally not financial), enjoy some of the ideas presented, try to give useful advice (although my point of view probably not that useful for most). Still resent a bit that this community generally discourages "tall poppies" but that is life.
Why, just today I came across the term, "tall poppies" for the first time. I googled it and now I can hardly wait to impress my friends and neighbors and fellow bus passengers with my new-found term. This is a good place to learn about all sorts of things.
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Old 03-31-2017, 05:50 PM   #76
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A little off-topic, but....

Finally... one thing I have shared with (M)(B)illionaires. Riding in a Gulfstream. Back in the travelling days my company's G5 was sometimes used for my travel to different parts of the US where we had corporate centers.

A taste of honey!
Green with envy. Business class and first class haven't touched my keister since our honeymoon, and I recall it as being a wonderful thing. I can only imagine the true travel luxury of private G5. The closest I ever came to that was selling cables to a window blind company that did custom interiors.

I did have two private plane flights albeit way downscale from a G5, and it was super cool on its on.
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Old 03-31-2017, 06:21 PM   #77
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I got to fly on a corporate jet only once. It was only because there were 5 or 6 of us to visit a subcontractor. The jet was available that day, and bean counters figured out that it was cheaper than paying for our commercial flight.

I do not even remember what jet it was, other than the interior was nothing luxurious. The only thing nice about it was we did not have to wait in a terminal to board. We hopped on, and the pilots taxied out right away. The same on the flight back. That no-waiting in a crowded terminal, even if you fly 1st-class, is something that is really nice about a private jet, even a small one.

Back on LBYM, I was practicing it when we were working. Our income, hence our means, was clearly defined then. Now, I don't know what my means is. Stock returns vary all over the place.

If I had more so that I could live on the meager dividend of the S&P of 1.9%, then I would be able to say that I were LBYM when I lived on, say 1.5%. But my WR is higher than that, so I am not LBYM now at all.
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Old 03-31-2017, 06:23 PM   #78
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I think you can sign for membership to fly jet around here. I forgot the amount but it was not excessive, not for the $30k a month income crowd.
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Old 03-31-2017, 06:27 PM   #79
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I looked it up recently. If I recall correctly, the smallest membership is $100K/year, which eats up almost 1/3 of the $30K/month already.

PS. OK, here it is.

For 2012, a single-year, 25-hour card for a Hawker 400XP jet starts at $119,900, plus taxes and some additional fees for fuel surcharges and insurance.

So, 25-hour total flight time for that much money? Is it even long enough to get me a round trip to Italy?
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Old 03-31-2017, 06:32 PM   #80
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I looked it up recently. If I recall correctly, the smallest membership is $100K/year, which eats up almost 1/3 of the $30K/month already.

PS. OK, here it is.

For 2012, a single-year, 25-hour card for a Hawker 400XP jet starts at $119,900, plus taxes and some additional fees for fuel surcharges and insurance.

So, 25-hour total flight time for that much money? Is it even long enough to get me a round trip to Italy?
I found this link. $10,000 for membership.JetSuiteX launches $29 private jet fares - TODAY.com
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