Ho Hum S&P down 6.12% to 806.58

Well down another 400 plus points again today. At the rate were going we will be down to zero just before Christmas. A little faster than I thought, but might as well get it over with. Glad I had enough sense to put half my money in cd's.
img_750556_0_63a18a1c7f3248ff7f22ad65f253b77c.gif
 
C'mon guys, do you really think that the market won't have recovered in 15-25 years, which is when you will be using much of the money that's in your stock funds right now?

I am itching to rebalance and get in on these low prices.
 
TromboneAl said:
C'mon guys, do you really think that the market won't have recovered in 15-25 years, which is when you will be using much of the money that's in your stock funds right now?

I am itching to rebalance and get in on these low prices.
Click to expand...

You go first--I'm waiting til 2010.... or late 2009....
 
TromboneAl said:
C'mon guys, do you really think that the market won't have recovered in 15-25 years, which is when you will be using much of the money that's in your stock funds right now?

I am itching to rebalance and get in on these low prices.
Click to expand...

Geeze, 15 to 25 more years? Unless you think everyone is 20 or younger I wouldn't consider that retiring early. Just retiring.
 
TromboneAl said:
C'mon guys, do you really think that the market won't have recovered in 15-25 years, which is when you will be using much of the money that's in your stock funds right now?

I am itching to rebalance and get in on these low prices.
Click to expand...


I'm 59. In 15 years I'll be 74. Besides that I'm already using my retirement fund for living expenses. It can't recover very well while I'm taking out at least 5.5% which is what I need to maintain my current living expenses.
So, for those of us who have had our retirements scr*wed by this market, I think that a bit of unhappiness and pessimism is in order.

On the other hand, this opportunity may allow me to find a new love for the working life, stupid bosses, and mind numbing boredom. Yahoo. Hope some company wants to hire a 59 yr old secretary with a master's degree and no experience.

But maybe I could sell my townhome, re-home my dog and go live in Chapala, Mexico, or some other cheap place where I don't know anyone, have no friends or family, and thereby, making it difficult to ever see my children and my first grandchild.

So many many wonderful, interesting lifestyle choices are opening up!

Have fun rebalancing, Trombone!
 
Oldbabe said:
I'm 59. In 15 years I'll be 74. Besides that I'm already using my retirement fund for living expenses. It can't recover very well while I'm taking out at least 5.5% which is what I need to maintain my current living expenses.
So, for those of us who have had our retirements scr*wed by this market, I think that a bit of unhappiness and pessimism is in order.

On the other hand, this opportunity may allow me to find a new love for the working life, stupid bosses, and mind numbing boredom. Yahoo. Hope some company wants to hire a 59 yr old secretary with a master's degree and no experience.

But maybe I could sell my townhome, re-home my dog and go live in Chapala, Mexico, or some other cheap place where I don't know anyone, have no friends or family, and thereby, making it difficult to ever see my children and my first grandchild.

So many many wonderful, interesting lifestyle choices are opening up!

Have fun rebalancing, Trombone!
Click to expand...
Ouch. Sorry for how hard this mess is affecting you, Old Babe.
 
Old Babe , I feel your pain . I also feel scr---- by this market . I may be in the casita next to you unless this economy brightens.
 
that's a hard post on a tough position oldbabe. best of luck to you.

my parents kept a motto engraved on their office wall "attitudes are more important than facts". granted, my facts might allow an easier time to adapt a better attitude. i'm 51 (still, though that's fading fast), in 20 years i might have alzheimer's though i don't notice any signs yet (& i've sadly the training to know them when i see them) so maybe i've been spared. i have no children to visit nor to comfort me in my old age.

but i've lost so many people where i live already. i've lots of friends but they are scattered everywhere. my brother is here but his family will likely relocate when their last kid enters college in 7 years. i've a cousin my age & i enjoy her very much but she'll be moving to mexico when she (hopefully) retires at 65. i've buried too many people here. then last year two local "good friend" dumped me. so there's not a whole hell of a lot left here for me anyway.

i know i can make new friends here or anywhere. and i know the good ones among them become my family. my brother's wife was his friend and is now his family. the state might not recognize my family, but i will know them when i see them no matter where i am.

i've started looking for employment in case i decide to stay here and get to know my recently found father before he dies. when i think about work, i don't get gloomy. i'm actually a little excited to get back, having already had a 2.5 year vacation. but even if i don't find a job i'd enjoy, or one that would take me, maybe i will join the peace corp for a few years (didn't you look into this?) and let my portfolio grow out of that endeavor. or i can still just sell-out and vagabond and live cheaply enough to be in excellent financial shape again into my 60s.

all hope is not lost. when i view this downturn i feel terrible. not so much for me. i am still in so much better shape then most of the rest of the world. people are going to die. some by starvation of their stomachs, some by starvation of their souls. i will not be picking my meals off corpses but nor will i close my eyes to the carnage.

these are not the best of times, and i do not mean to be patronizing, but this truly is the best time to count your blessings. life is not easy. if it was, anyone could do it. you are only 59. you don't have to work if you don't want to, even if you had to make a few changes. you can work with the security of knowing you don't have to worry about being fired. you can travel to exotic parts of the world. you can open yourself up to new adventures. you could join the peace corp and help people for five or ten years. and when you come back you have children and grandchildren to greet you. what a fortunate life is yours.
 
Oldbabe said:
I'm 59. In 15 years I'll be 74. Besides that I'm already using my retirement fund for living expenses. It can't recover very well while I'm taking out at least 5.5% which is what I need to maintain my current living expenses.
So, for those of us who have had our retirements scr*wed by this market, I think that a bit of unhappiness and pessimism is in order.

On the other hand, this opportunity may allow me to find a new love for the working life, stupid bosses, and mind numbing boredom. Yahoo. Hope some company wants to hire a 59 yr old secretary with a master's degree and no experience.
But maybe I could sell my townhome, re-home my dog and go live in Chapala, Mexico, or some other cheap place where I don't know anyone, have no friends or family, and thereby, making it difficult to ever see my children and my first grandchild.
So many many wonderful, interesting lifestyle choices are opening up!
Have fun rebalancing, Trombone!
Click to expand...
i am sorry you are feeling the pinch so hard. we all are, trust me.

i will share a well known writing that is on an small cast iron plaque that my mom had for years and years. i saw and heard this often, since my early childhood. my mom used to read it out loud when times were very tough for her.
it is now mine to read out loud when things are tough for me. it is one of my most cherished treasures of hers.
you will recognize it, i know.

May God grant me the Serenity to accept things I cannot change
The Courage to change the things I can
And the Wisdom to know the difference.

Hang in there. ^-^
 
Oldbabe said:
I'm 59. In 15 years I'll be 74. Besides that I'm already using my retirement fund for living expenses. It can't recover very well while I'm taking out at least 5.5% which is what I need to maintain my current living expenses.
So, for those of us who have had our retirements scr*wed by this market, I think that a bit of unhappiness and pessimism is in order.

On the other hand, this opportunity may allow me to find a new love for the working life, stupid bosses, and mind numbing boredom. Yahoo. Hope some company wants to hire a 59 yr old secretary with a master's degree and no experience.

But maybe I could sell my townhome, re-home my dog and go live in Chapala, Mexico, or some other cheap place where I don't know anyone, have no friends or family, and thereby, making it difficult to ever see my children and my first grandchild.

So many many wonderful, interesting lifestyle choices are opening up!

Have fun rebalancing, Trombone!
Click to expand...

If it helps, I'm pretty sure you can take your dog with you to Mexico. :)
 
Thanks to all for the kind words. I know I need an attitude adjustment and it will come eventually. Today was a particularly trying one for all of us. I am just so p*ssed that this has meltdown has happened when it didn't have to if not for the irresponsible people at fault.

So, I know that I will not be destitute like some no matter if the DOW goes to 6000 or worse. At least I will not end up homeless and pushing a grocery cart full of my belongings.

But I have to say that such a sudden change of fortune is a hard pill to swallow, especially when I have had to swallow a few other bitter pills in the past four years. It is very difficult to face giving up even more of what I value in order to secure my financial future.

Everyone's life, plans, values, are different. This economic downturn will cause very painful choices. Some of us, as Lazy points out, will be able to weather these new choices. Many others will not. When they are angry and depressed, let's all remember that we don't know the circumstances of their lives or the hard choices they have to make now.
 
Yes, it is hard and more so for some than for others.

But it's hard to imagine things just continuing until the whole world just stops working and producing. Things will return toward normal, maybe partially, over time or maybe faster than we imagine. And social security will kick in, expenses and expectations will re-adjust, and life will go on. So, buck up and enjoy all those things that money just can't buy.
 
Rich_in_Tampa said:
Yes, it is hard and more so for some than for others.

But it's hard to imagine things just continuing until the whole world just stops working and producing. Things will return toward normal, maybe partially, over time or maybe faster than we imagine. And social security will kick in, expenses and expectations will re-adjust, and life will go on. So, buck up and enjoy all those things that money just can't buy.
Click to expand...

Couldn't agree more. I've been moping about the market's collapse just 15 months before RE date. But I had an attitude adjustment at the weekend talking with my sister in England. Her daughter, 20, married with a 1 year old, has been having a lot of migraine-like headaches and in an examination by the doctor, shadows were observed at the back of her eyes, so she has been referred to a specialist (on Dec 4th). Her father has a brain tumor that has ruined his life to date and could end it at any time, so everyone's thoughts are immediately moving in that direction. Terrifying.

Made me feel ashamed of feeling sorry for myself over money and wishing my life away to get to that RE date.
 
What chaps me is you can't turn on a tv without someone saying were headed for a Depression. Who knows, maybe it will happen but it just compounds the fear that is already out there. Which in turn promotes further selling. I'm not expecting someone to get on tv and say things will be fine in a few months when they don't believe it, but 'Depression' scares the crap out of everyone. This is a time when a little more responsible reporting is needed.
 
Market probably will be up 10% tomorrow....I wonder if Bush should just let the new team in early with this economic crisis....
 
Dawg54 said:
What chaps me is you can't turn on a tv without someone saying were headed for a Depression. Who knows, maybe it will happen but it just compounds the fear that is already out there. Which in turn promotes further selling. I'm not expecting someone to get on tv and say things will be fine in a few months when they don't believe it, but 'Depression' scares the crap out of everyone. This is a time when a little more responsible reporting is needed.
Click to expand...

FWIW I saw an interview with a Nobel prize winning economist who had lived through the Great Depression himself. He was a very thoughtful guy.

He said that any references to the Great Depression were complete nonesense. Between 25 and 30% of the population was unemployed and people were literally on the verge of starvation. I think it is an insult to those who experienced that very difficult period of time to make such comparisons.
 
Oldbabe said:
I'm 59. In 15 years I'll be 74. Besides that I'm already using my retirement fund for living expenses. It can't recover very well while I'm taking out at least 5.5% which is what I need to maintain my current living expenses.
So, for those of us who have had our retirements scr*wed by this market, I think that a bit of unhappiness and pessimism is in order.

On the other hand, this opportunity may allow me to find a new love for the working life, stupid bosses, and mind numbing boredom. Yahoo. Hope some company wants to hire a 59 yr old secretary with a master's degree and no experience.

But maybe I could sell my townhome, re-home my dog and go live in Chapala, Mexico, or some other cheap place where I don't know anyone, have no friends or family, and thereby, making it difficult to ever see my children and my first grandchild.

So many many wonderful, interesting lifestyle choices are opening up!

Have fun rebalancing, Trombone!
Click to expand...

MY WR just hit 5% and we also have a long way to go, so I share the concern. I try to keep in mind that a current 5% WR is much more sustainable and less risky today than 3.5% was a year ago.

The bad news may not be all behind us yet, but one thing is absolutely certain - portfolio returns for the next 10-20 years will be much higher, more likely than not high enough to let us maintain our current quality of life.

Michael
 
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