How many are Real Estate investors/landlords?

Real Estate as an investment other than your home?

  • REITS baby! instant ability to liquidate, no toilet clogs.

    Votes: 49 28.0%
  • Vacation home that appreciates.

    Votes: 34 19.4%
  • DST or Opportunity Zone investor.

    Votes: 7 4.0%
  • Commercial/NNN investor.

    Votes: 14 8.0%
  • Bed and Breakfast/airbnb/VRBO owner.

    Votes: 10 5.7%
  • Live on the same lot as my rental.

    Votes: 4 2.3%
  • Own and rent out single family home(s).

    Votes: 57 32.6%
  • Own and rent out apartments.

    Votes: 28 16.0%
  • Own property as appreciating land or farmland.

    Votes: 13 7.4%
  • [url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCOzqP9Dt9E[/url]

    Votes: 6 3.4%
  • No "investment" RE - just my home

    Votes: 37 21.1%

  • Total voters
    175
Really have no idea what percentage of the early retirement crowd are invested in real estate other than their home - so here's an attempt at a poll. Feel free to check as many of the options as apply and if you gotta then fill us in on why your choices are the best in the whole wide world - for you. This is a chance for us real estate junkies who don't know where to put our investment in Firecalc to see that there are a few property mavens out there.

Your poll offers no option for "no RE other than my home" so you won't get an idea of the percent of the crowd as a whole. You are only going to get a picture of the sub-categories within the Real Estate crowd. If you want to add an option, just ask any mod.
 
Your poll offers no option for "no RE other than my home" so you won't get an idea of the percent of the crowd as a whole. You are only going to get a picture of the sub-categories within the Real Estate crowd. If you want to add an option, just ask any mod.

Yes, I searched for this. I recently dumped my REITs so I'm officially in "no RE other than my home"
 
WE have a 4 unit apartment building, a duplex, and a SFH, all are up to date on rent except 1. They owe $100, because their car needed some work, will get that on Thursday.
 
Your poll offers no option for "no RE other than my home" so you won't get an idea of the percent of the crowd as a whole. You are only going to get a picture of the sub-categories within the Real Estate crowd. ...

Yes, from the OP: "Really have no idea what percentage of the early retirement crowd are invested in real estate other than their home - so here's an attempt at a poll."


And at this time 46 entries and this wasn't asked beforehand? OP, you need a denominator for a %, you only have the numerator. And of course, only of those who chose to answer, so there's really no way to tell if it is representative or not.

But I got a chuckle out of the Woody Allen clip!

-ERD50
 
And at this time 46 entries and this wasn't asked beforehand? OP, you need a denominator for a %, you only have the numerator. And of course, only of those who chose to answer, so there's really no way to tell if it is representative or not.
I saw it yesterday, but didn't want to complain. Didn't want to sound too much like an engineer. You know what I mean, ERD50. I figured we could keep our engineer talk over on the generator thread. :)

So I waited for someone more level headed like Aerides kindly ask.
 
If you are a landlord, are all your tenants continuing to pay in full or have any of them stopped paying and essentially squatting on your dime at this time? Are you experiencing any cash flow issues as a result of tenants not paying and inability to evict them due to moratoriums in place?

Answers to this will vary widely by locality. Some localities have in effect declared a "rent holiday" with long lasting eviction and late fee moratoriums.
Sadly, other than the undocumented immigrants, most everyone gets around 50K annualized per working adult right now. So the ability to pay is hardly a factor for most (at present).

I am an investor in an apartment building near sacramento. Decent place with 2-3 bedroom apartments renting for 1800-2300/mo. Over 10% of the tenants are taking advantage of the california rent holiday. These tenants have decided that the minimal impact on their credit of a skip rent during a pandemic is worth it to basically save about 25K in a years rent which is how long they expect it to take to get them out.

It hasn't started yet, but the commercial (not freddie / fannie) mortgage securities market is going to be in shambles by the end of the year. Hotels, retail, office and some apartments (not nearly all) will all be seriously delinquent.
 
I saw it yesterday, but didn't want to complain. Didn't want to sound too much like an engineer. You know what I mean, ERD50. I figured we could keep our engineer talk over on the generator thread. :)

So I waited for someone more level headed like Aerides kindly ask.

:LOL:

And of course it isn't "complaining" ;). Like my T-Shirt says "I'm not arguing, I'm explaining why I'm right!".

-ERD50
 
Your poll offers no option for "no RE other than my home" so you won't get an idea of the percent of the crowd as a whole. You are only going to get a picture of the sub-categories within the Real Estate crowd. If you want to add an option, just ask any mod.

Yes please, I would like to add another option at this point so that people who don't have any real estate other than their homes can vote. If you can make it so I'd appreciate it, or point me in an appropriate direction to do so.
 
Own RE

Own a SFH, Vacation lake rental, and separate boat slip rental.

All paid up with no issues other than the SFH asking for a 1 month 30% rent reduction in April due to a layoff...I value good paying long term tenants, so I accepted their request with no issues.

Appreciation is still also good during COVID with all 3 rentals paper valuation increasing.
 
We own a vacation property that we also rent for short term stays.....so I checked two boxes:

"Vacation property that appreciates"
&
"B&B, AirBnB, VRBO owner"

Had it 10 years and the value is up 50% and the vacation rentals cover operating expenses and improvements......fingers remain crossed.....the appreciation only matters at the closing table but it's also been fun to use it and have other people pay/subsidize our vacations.
 
berkeley - what types of properties are you invested in and what types of returns are you getting? I'm thinking about going this route in the near future.



We really wanted to invest partially in student housing...boy are we glad we listened to the advice of our agent! We have some invested in a hospital (Kansas City University System as our tenants), a warehouse distribution (Pepsi as our tenant) and a multi-family55+ .

Key things we like about DST is the ability to diversify a SFH rental investment and still do a 1031. It’s not for everyone because you won’t have control but if you select good investments, it works well!
 
. Like my T-Shirt says "I'm not arguing, I'm explaining why I'm right!".
So true. :D

OK, I voted "None" now that the survey has the choice.

I had REITs, but I don't like where the commercial mall market is going.

I had vacant land as an investment (gifted from parents), but ended up selling it at a LOSS from the original 1983 price. Yes, there is such a thing as Florida swamp land.

I am very handy and considered getting fixer upper and renting it, but both my neighbor and a buddy do this and all they do is bitch about it, go to court, etc.

So, right now, I'm out.
 
Answers to this will vary widely by locality. Some localities have in effect declared a "rent holiday" with long lasting eviction and late fee moratoriums.
Sadly, other than the undocumented immigrants, most everyone gets around 50K annualized per working adult right now. So the ability to pay is hardly a factor for most (at present).

I am an investor in an apartment building near sacramento. Decent place with 2-3 bedroom apartments renting for 1800-2300/mo. Over 10% of the tenants are taking advantage of the california rent holiday. These tenants have decided that the minimal impact on their credit of a skip rent during a pandemic is worth it to basically save about 25K in a years rent which is how long they expect it to take to get them out.

It hasn't started yet, but the commercial (not freddie / fannie) mortgage securities market is going to be in shambles by the end of the year. Hotels, retail, office and some apartments (not nearly all) will all be seriously delinquent.

That's sad. My rentals are not in California and thus far have had no problems. I am sorry you are having a 10% problem. That's higher than any other investors I have talked to. I do wish California tried to balance things a little bit between landlord and tenants. Good luck!
 
I checked several of the boxes, though none of them are what got me to FIRE.

Good ol' index mutual funds and ETFs did that.

Scratch the ETF's. Now some ETF"s hobby wise -aka 'a few good stocks.' Grin. In my 27 year trip thru ER - duplex, rental mobile home, REIT's, land and now a farm.

Pretty much down to Farm (CRP), 20 acres of timberland and a few vacant lots that didn't sell with the last house.

Heh heh heh - yes index funds are far and away the big dog on the porch.
:dance: ;) :cool:
 
70% of HHNW is in various forms of real estate (both acquired and inherited):

1. A large number of farms and ranches leased to tenants with good appreciation potential.
2. A small "ranchette" which I've been trying to unload for years.
3. Several industrial/commercial properties.
4. A building site with great ocean view.
5. A condo/second home.

Long-term goal is to liquidate 2, 3, 4 and 5 to make our estate/life simpler to manage (and to pass down to heirs).

Also looking to purchase a nice vacation/retirement home at some point in Hawaii, something beachfront or with full-on ocean view, but DW and I cannot come to an agreement on whether to rent it out. DW wants to maximize ROI by renting it out, but I hate the thought of renting out a home to strangers for income that we don't need.

Lucky Dude
 
I hold two promissory notes on residential real estate. Does that count?
 
Late 2 the party. Was born into it. DF has 'rentals' spent many hours flipping after tenants lease ends, service calls etc. Closed on 6 plex in 2006 during downturn. Learned lots since then. I now feel like my $ is better in Stocks, only because rest of family is heavy into RE. My returns have been better short-term, but the long term if you outlive your note by like 70 years, that's 840 mortgage payments someone else makes. Scale that by a few properties and it's a great way to cement stability into a family generational wealth transfer. Provided the next generation understands RE.

It's not easy, it takes experience, but it can be done. Now I help with millions of RE portfolio, all self-managed by the 'family office'.
 
Soon to be early retired

I"m getting there - it could happen between now and 12 months.

I've had (2) condos for rental purposes and utilize a property manager. I'm not handy, I have little knowledge about how to fix things....and property manager does EVERYTHING. If I do early -retire it's because I'm sick and tired of employees, customers, the whole nine yard and I want minimal interaction with people - professionally so real estate appeals to me. For 7 years with (2) units - I've had ZERO troubles. My rule to property manager is "TAKE CARE OF IT ASAP" if there's a tenant complaint. Dn't chintz, don't wait, just do it and I'm happy to take a little lower return in exchange for easy living.

As I retire, I forsee 60% of my nest-egg being in stocks.

Close to 40% in real estate.

Prices are high - so I think my residential real estate TRUE returns would be around 3.5-3.75% per year and I could consider this the "bond" section of my 60-40. I also like that it's a non-paper asset - and hallmark of diversification.

I like the depreciation too in that YES, it'll be recaptured and taxed but for now I can ZERO my income on the real estate side. That makes my dividend income taxed at 0% because I won't make the income threshold and also --- qualifies me for an ACA subsidy. Also, I *suspect* in 4-6 years, there will be some sort of goodies for "low income" people like me vis a vis kid's college expenses.

Metro DC, Metro Raleigh, Metro Austin, Metro Atlanta. With proper homework - these are the areas I'm interested in. Nothing is risk-free but ALL forecasts show population growth coming - -- AND much of it educated professionals. Young educated people with noodles of debt sure love stainless steel appliances and backsplashes - lol and my 2 units in Metro DC are rented FAST. Also....where the professionals are - there is also a lower economic echelon living there to service the professionals be it landscapers, nannies, house cleaners, etc Again - more demand for $200k-$250k units for rental and even purchase.

I continue to be interested in NET-LEASED properties. To entities like Popeye's, Wendy's, etc. Seems like easy mailbox money but this pandemic has shown me that even chains that have been around "forever" can have problems. I'm still looking at these - but not as hard as before. I'd rather have 40% of my nest-egg spread between 8 residences.... versus 1 commercial property.

Exceptions are. McDonalds and Chick Fil A. I classy those STILL as easy mailbox money but they also. only pay 3.8-4.4%. Also - those are ground leases hence no depreciation.

If I had my druthers..... the RE portion of my portfolio will be let's say around $1.7 million. My dream breakdown:

$1mm - commercial net leased @4.75% cap rate, and ability to depreciate.

3 condos @200-250k a piece that earn 3.5% and ability to depreciate.

My percentages are realistic. Trouble is that the mainstream net-leased businesses seem to be going for $1.5mm+++.

But - they are out there. Goal will be to learn the neighborhood, spend quality time wherever that maybe, watch and learn the business model for a potential net-lease deal when the time comes.
 
As someone that used to spend a lot of time looking at those net leased properties, particularly chain retail, drug, and restaurant properties, I have to laugh. When companies like K-Mart and Circuit City first showed signs of weakness, suddenly their store properties showed up as high quality absolute net investments on LoopNet. Can't remember specifically who did this, but raising capital through sale leasebacks was a common strategy. You could kind of predict the failure 12 to 18 months later... The name brand drug stores were similar, although it was usually a property owner selling. The property would sell, and the location would close within a year or two. All of a sudden, you had an empty building with the retailer paying the minimum base rent instead of a percentage of gross sales. Nothing like a vacant building you don't control that may or may not get subleased to a less than desirable tenant.

I will take the management hassle of dealing with smaller tenants, particularly NOT retail tenants, over those breathtakingly low cap rates for so-called credit tenants and their mailbox money.
 
Last edited:
As someone that used to spend a lot of time looking at those net leased properties, particularly chain retail, drug, and restaurant properties, I have to laugh. When companies like K-Mart and Circuit City first showed signs of weakness, suddenly their store properties showed up as high quality absolute net investments on LoopNet. Can't remember specifically who did this, but raising capital through sale leasebacks was a common strategy. You could kind of predict the failure 12 to 18 months later... The name brand drug stores were similar, although it was usually a property owner selling. The property would sell, and the location would close within a year or two. All of a sudden, you had an empty building with the retailer paying the minimum base rent instead of a percentage of gross sales. Nothing like a vacant building you don't control that may or may not get subleased to a less than desirable tenant.

I will take the management hassle of dealing with smaller tenants, particularly NOT retail tenants, over those breathtakingly low cap rates for so-called credit tenants and their mailbox money.
+1

I think there is huge risk w/ single tenant NNN properties.

I am also not a fan of taking 4.75% CAP rate for something this illiquid. A return to the historical CAP rates would KILL this type of investment.

I am a DC metro person, but I live in the city center. Once accounting for vacancy, maintenance, and property management none have had CAP rates over the Cost of Capital in recent years.

The only times I was able to find true cash flow positive in DC Urban was 2008-2011/2012 and in the 1990s - about 2000 / 2001

Right now a 1BR condo that rents for 2300 downtown would cost 400K. w/ 20% down thats 1400 / month + 300 condo fee + 300 prop taxes. Plus insurance, property management etc. Just doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. After allowing for vacancy, unit turns etc.

I think other metro's have much more attractive CAP rates than DC.
 
After reading Rich Dad Poor Dad I started investing in real estate. Some have been a grand slam-vacation home at the beach, two industrial bldgs I rent to my company and a couple flipped houses. I've also struck out on a few. Today RE is 20% of my NW. When I retire I plan on selling the vacation home and one of the industrial bldgs and rolling them into an ocean front home via 1031 exchange. If I "rent" for 2 years it will save me $200k in cap gains tax, plus depreciation, plus the rental income. When I say "rent" I'm only looking to do 5 weeks each summer at a rate of $15k per week. After 2 years we would make it our main residence.
 
After reading Rich Dad Poor Dad I started investing in real estate. Some have been a grand slam-vacation home at the beach, two industrial bldgs I rent to my company and a couple flipped houses. I've also struck out on a few. Today RE is 20% of my NW. When I retire I plan on selling the vacation home and one of the industrial bldgs and rolling them into an ocean front home via 1031 exchange. If I "rent" for 2 years it will save me $200k in cap gains tax, plus depreciation, plus the rental income. When I say "rent" I'm only looking to do 5 weeks each summer at a rate of $15k per week. After 2 years we would make it our main residence.

You can do this plan, but keep in mind you won't get the full 250/500K owner occupied exemption when you sell the new OF Manse. It will be prorated by years of ownership and use. Since you are 1031'ing it will start the time from when you originally acquired the 1st property. If you had 10 years total, 7 as rental and 3 as personal your gain is broken out and only 30% of it is applied to the capital gains exemption.

You won't have to pay Cap gains when you sell the rentals to buy the last property, but you will still in essence owe the tax on the gain when you sell the final property even if you have lived in it for several years.
 
Hi BorC. Our current vacation home was purchased in '96 and never rented nor depreciated. We use it every weekend. The industrial property was purchased in '90 and rented/depr since then. I was told that if we rented for at least 2 years and then made it our primary residence the cap gains tax due would go away. What is OF Manse?
 
Five SFH, all rented with zero C19 related issues. Use a rental agency even though all in the same area.

Make up about 20% of net worth, and about a third of annual income.
 
Back
Top Bottom