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Old 11-16-2019, 06:39 PM   #81
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Originally Posted by bolt View Post
Do not kid yourself, you're probably paying more in fees.
I'd bet* that 1.3% is an AUM fee on top of the funds expense ratios, plusother fees!

This.


An older relative was utilizing the services of a Raymond James FA only because she felt guilty about not using the services of an old “friend.” She hedged by putting half her money in index funds and letting him manage the other half. Not only was he putting her money in high-fee funds, he was churning her account as well. All in all, a debacle. Unfortunately she passed in her mid-70s due to a sudden illness, which is when all of this came to light.


We manage our own accounts. With a little self-education, it is not at all difficult. And before a person trusts anyone else with their money, they should do that self-education anyway.


“[T]hat tiny 1% will crush your portfolio over time” — https://www.forbes.com/sites/robertb.../#431533cb6f96
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Old 11-17-2019, 02:08 AM   #82
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Self managed.

You'll save a lot of dough if you're inclined to DIY and follow the good advice here and at Bogleheads.
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Old 11-17-2019, 05:59 AM   #83
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I do. Never had a FA.
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Old 11-17-2019, 07:17 AM   #84
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I had managed our retirement accounts for many years, as they were just in IRA/TSP's. About 5 years ago, i decided to see a FA to open an IRA. My brother suggested Edward Jones, as they had a office near me. I used his services for 1 year. After he told me he never heard of the "rule of 55", and even after he checked in to it, he said i could not use that. I did my own research and found out he was totally wrong. And during that research i discovered the Bogleheads. I totally lost trust in the FA. When i transferred the ton of individual stocks and mutual funds he had me in, he called me to ask why i was leaving. I told him i was going to Vanguard to DIY invest. He said he never heard of Vanguard. He either lied, or was stupid.

So, in a way, it was a great learning experience, which really did not cost me much at all. Now i take care of our investments, and DW takes care of day to day bills and cash flow. Works out great.
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Old 11-17-2019, 07:19 AM   #85
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Old 11-17-2019, 07:23 AM   #86
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If 1% would crush your portfolio, imagine paying 6% a year!
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Old 11-17-2019, 07:26 AM   #87
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Give me a forum ...
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If 1% would crush your portfolio, imagine paying 6% a year!
Who pays that? Did I miss something?
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Old 11-17-2019, 08:03 AM   #88
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Using index funds makes self-management possible - all you'll really need to do, after determining which funds and your allocation to them, is to re-balance periodically.

I manage all our finances myself, but, importantly, I've also identified a FA my wife could work with after my death, should I die before her. This is a person I trust and who is familiar with my approach.
+1. With enough time, learning and interest most anybody can do this on their own.
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Old 11-17-2019, 08:05 AM   #89
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I wasn't particularly adventurous so I have always had someone to hold my hand if I needed it when I needed it. Even when I thought I was ready I had backup.

When I first started investing you had to use a broker to place trades. Eventually I had internet brokers and I got brave enough to place online stock trades. I still remember my distrust of the internet when I started an account with a pioneering bank whose officers I had met at the Las Vegas money show.

Eventually I got brave enough to do options trades online, but I did have a person help me enter the data the first time to make sure I did it right. I was still finding the terms confusing.

I also had a person look over my shoulders the first time I did futures trading as well.

Similar progress on bond and cd purchases. I still do annuities through a broker although I expect those to be a direct online purchase option soon.

I still do managed products but I view them similar to individual stocks and am willing to buy or sell based on performance.

I still like to get an email from time to time when market is troubling my psyche telling me to hold the rudder still and keep on sailing. My inner trader wants to cut and run.

So maybe the real question is how many of us doubt we are better than average drivers? lol or investors...

I'm still loyal to one long term broker and find even though he is a full priced broker his firm finds me better fixed income and annuity deals than the low cost guys do. And yes he makes a little off of some of the things but I've negotiated a discount I can live with and he's younger so spreading it around some.
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Old 11-17-2019, 08:13 AM   #90
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We do. Seems like most here do.
^^This
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Old 11-17-2019, 09:45 AM   #91
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We do. Seems like most here do.
Yes. Coming here with this question is like walking into a pack of hyenas and asking whether they'd prefer impala steaks or some nice roasted vegetables.
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Old 11-17-2019, 10:04 AM   #92
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I manage our portfolio of stocks and ETFs. It's much easier with low or no broker fees. I would start looking to move the IRA now and learn as much as possible from the people on this forum.
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I am curious ... how many folks totally manage their finances themselves ... no FA or service?

We currently have a FA (Raymond James) managing just my IRA. (~$440K).
I also have a 401k and pension that I will be getting plus my wife has a 403B and pension. His fee is 1.3%. I am not excited about that and am thinking of moving everything into Vanguard index funds when I retire next year ... no FA. I would like to be a hands-off investor.
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Old 11-17-2019, 10:07 AM   #93
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+1 ETFs are managed also.
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Even index funds have managers.
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Old 11-17-2019, 10:11 AM   #94
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A way less than perfect example ....and, a bit off the point, but relates to simply buying and holding a passive fund vs a managed fund.

About a two years ago I bought ITOT (balanced index equity fund with a 0.3% fee) - a bit less than I already had in KAUFX (an aggressive managed equity fund with a 2% fee).

I have had the Kaufman fund for a long time and it performs pretty well in fair to good markets.

Currently they are ITOT 458 vs KAUFX 380 ... using normalized, clumsy numbers, but you get the point.

I have not tracked them both much and, as you can see, have not developed good metrics ... but, KAUFX shows better returns than ITOT .... except the totals always show ITOT ahead ...

Yeah, would have sold KAUFX a long time ago in a tax advantaged account, but it isn’t. So, my plan is simply to pull money from high fee funds first - and KAUFX will be first of the first.
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Old 11-17-2019, 10:17 AM   #95
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I do it and I enjoy it!
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Old 11-17-2019, 10:20 AM   #96
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I do ours, my folks, and my sister's. I give free advice to anyone who will listen. I do a very basic low cost Vanguard approach.
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Old 11-17-2019, 11:38 AM   #97
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A way less than perfect example ....and, a bit off the point, but relates to simply buying and holding a passive fund vs a managed fund.

About a two years ago I bought ITOT (balanced index equity fund with a 0.3% fee) - a bit less than I already had in KAUFX (an aggressive managed equity fund with a 2% fee).

I have had the Kaufman fund for a long time and it performs pretty well in fair to good markets.

Currently they are ITOT 458 vs KAUFX 380 ... using normalized, clumsy numbers, but you get the point.

I have not tracked them both much and, as you can see, have not developed good metrics ... but, KAUFX shows better returns than ITOT .... except the totals always show ITOT ahead ...

Yeah, would have sold KAUFX a long time ago in a tax advantaged account, but it isn’t. So, my plan is simply to pull money from high fee funds first - and KAUFX will be first of the first.
When I was just getting started in equity mutual funds, the Kaufmann Fund always had full-page ads in all the popular money porn magazines with the two fund advisers standing with arms folded like George Reeves. You could almost see their capes billowing in the breeze.

I found an article that lists the tall, Teutonic fund manager Hans Utsch as the owner of property at Mount Desert Island, among neighbors like Susan Sarandon and George Mitchell. So it appears he's investing his money wisely. https://bangordailynews.com/2009/10/...desert-island/
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Old 11-17-2019, 11:44 AM   #98
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Yeah, ha .... I researched Kaufmann’s numbers and opened an account a long time ago.

Good performance. Just let it ride ...

I do offset the volatility with other holdings.
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Old 11-17-2019, 01:43 PM   #99
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1% is actually 25% !!!!!!shocking and here's why.

If your income averages 4% above inflation and you pay someone just 1%...equals 25% of your yearly cash....nuts
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Old 11-17-2019, 01:46 PM   #100
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Been investing for almost 40 years now. Made a lot of mistakes along the way, but always did it on my own.
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