Medallion signature guarantee..

[Texas Proud]

Do you have a Fidelity branch near you? They can do it.

But they probably will not unless you have an account... and probably a big account...

 

[Texas Proud]

OHHHHH,


Also, before you get this done thinking that your job is done... check to see what KIND of medallion guarantee they need....



Before I tell you about my experience.... I used to do medallion guarantees when I was a corp trust officer... there are strict rules because the guarantor is on the hook if there is fraud... my limit was a whopping $200 million as I dealt with corporations... so I knew a bit about the subject..


SOOO, I go into my local bank and get the medallion guarantee and send in all the paperwork... it was an estate like mentioned above... had to move into an estate account... a couple of weeks later get a letter stating that I had the WRONG type of medallion guarantee and needed one that met the rules of blah, blah blah... WTF! You have to be kidding... the largest bank in America's medallion guarantee is not good enough!!!


It seems there is a newer special one for brokerages that has 2 colors instead of 1... that is when I went to FIDO to get one but had problems with them... but some pleading and opening up a small account for me and my daughter got it done...

 

[COcheesehead]

But they probably will not unless you have an account... and probably a big account...

I have both, but the nearest office is 4 hours away.

 

[JoeWras]

It seems there is a newer special one for brokerages that has 2 colors instead of 1... that is when I went to FIDO to get one but had problems with them... but some pleading and opening up a small account for me and my daughter got it done...

And the third type requires the secret handshake.

 

[jazz4cash]

So, if I had a 401K and an IRA and wanted to roll them over to another financial institution I would be legal if the roll over transfer went directly to the new financial company?

Going directly to the new financial institution is the preferred way to do it if you can. Usually it’s best to initiate the request at the new financial institution. They should be more anxious to get the funds than the sending finco is to give them up! I recall Vanguard a few years back refused to transfer IRA funds directly to my credit union for some reason so I had them make the check payable to the new financial institution but they mailed it to me. This is a bit off topic unless you are moving large sums that might require the MDS.

 

[COcheesehead]

Going directly to the new financial institution is the preferred way to do it if you can. Usually it’s best to initiate the request at the new financial institution. They should be more anxious to get the funds than the sending finco is to give them up! I recall Vanguard a few years back refused to transfer IRA funds directly to my credit union for some reason so I had them make the check payable to the new financial institution but they mailed it to me. This is a bit off topic unless you are moving large sums that might require the MDS.

You’d think this is the case, but I talked to Fidelity and they said I have to initiate it at American Funds.

 

[jazz4cash]

You’d think this is the case, but I talked to Fidelity and they said I have to initiate it at American Funds.

Is it a 401k or IRA at American? I routinely have funds transferred from my Fido 401k and IRA by having them issue a check made payable to my credit union with the FBO designation. That seems to work better than any other procedure since I know which party if any is holding things up. The credit union whines but they always accept the check and tag it as a transfer and not a rollover.

 

[COcheesehead]

Is it a 401k or IRA at American? I routinely have funds transferred from my Fido 401k and IRA by having them issue a check made payable to my credit union with the FBO designation. That seems to work better than any other procedure since I know which party if any is holding things up. The credit union whines but they always accept the check and tag it as a transfer and not a rollover.

The FBO designation satisfies the trustee to trustee part, but American, based on the size of the rollover, $500,000+, is requiring the medallion guarantee and my local sources cap out at $250,000.

 

[ERD50]

You’d think this is the case, but I talked to Fidelity and they said I have to initiate it at American Funds.

That doesn't sound right. However, if you are converting the designation at the same time, that might be the rub. For example, I haven't been able to do a conversion from Trad at one institution, to Roth at another, they must be in-kind. So if I have a Trad-IRA at place A, I need a Trad-IRA at place B. I can ask Place B to pull $X from Place A (never had a problem with that), and once transacted, I do the conversion from that Trad_IRA at place B, to a Roth at place B.

Fidelity B&M was very helpful when I needed to transfer my FIL's stock certificates (some in paper, some held at a transfer agent) from his SSN to EIN after his passing. They were able to handle the medallion signing w/o much problem as we were there in person.

-ERD50

 

[street]

Going directly to the new financial institution is the preferred way to do it if you can. Usually it’s best to initiate the request at the new financial institution. They should be more anxious to get the funds than the sending finco is to give them up! I recall Vanguard a few years back refused to transfer IRA funds directly to my credit union for some reason so I had them make the check payable to the new financial institution but they mailed it to me. This is a bit off topic unless you are moving large sums that might require the MDS.

^ thank you for that information. I have an IRA and a 401K in different Financial Company's now and want to get both rolled over to one place. I was just about to get it done in February when things started to get ugly. I halted all transfers/rollover immediately. Both were going to make the checks out to the new company and send them to there main office then I had orders where it would be invested once they got the check. One of those needed a medallion sig. At some pint I will start all over and get that all in one new spot.
If both were done in the same year and both went to the new company, not to me, I should be fine going both in one year. Any way that is how I read that IRS guide lines.

 

[COcheesehead]

That doesn't sound right. However, if you are converting the designation at the same time, that might be the rub. For example, I haven't been able to do a conversion from Trad at one institution, to Roth at another, they must be in-kind. So if I have a Trad-IRA at place A, I need a Trad-IRA at place B. I can ask Place B to pull $X from Place A (never had a problem with that), and once transacted, I do the conversion from that Trad_IRA at place B, to a Roth at place B.

Fidelity B&M was very helpful when I needed to transfer my FIL's stock certificates (some in paper, some held at a transfer agent) from his SSN to EIN after his passing. They were able to handle the medallion signing w/o much problem as we were there in person.

-ERD50

It’s correct. I need to contact American first. What you describe is way more complicated then what I am trying to do. I want to move a Simple 401k to my traditional IRA. All designated the same.
Instructions from right off the Fido site. Step 1. Open account. Step 2 contact 401k provider.

 

[socca]

Last year when I was surveying local banks for the MSG(s) I required I checked Bank of America. Two surprises unique to BOA:
(1) local BOA bank officers can't issue a MSG. Instead, the paperwork is sent off to a central office for stamping, and then is mailed back to the client.
(2) BOA demands to see the assets in the destination account.
These two "surprises" were a deal-killer for me. I scratched BOA off my list!

 

[scrabbler1]

Last year when I was surveying local banks for the MSG(s) I required I checked Bank of America. Two surprises unique to BOA:
(1) local BOA bank officers can't issue a MSG. Instead, the paperwork is sent off to a central office for stamping, and then is mailed back to the client.
(2) BOA demands to see the assets in the destination account.
These two "surprises" were a deal-killer for me. I scratched BOA off my list!

This is when BOA is the sender of the funds, not the recipient? While my experience with them, as I described in a much earlier post, was somewhat annoying, the local bank manager handled it on site quickly and easily when BOA was the recipient. The form they put the MSG stamp on was one page among the 9 I sent to my 401k plan administrator telling them how to handle the different subsets of all the money which was in there.

 

[ERD50]

It’s correct. I need to contact American first. What you describe is way more complicated then what I am trying to do. I want to move a Simple 401k to my traditional IRA. All designated the same.
Instructions from right off the Fido site. Step 1. Open account. Step 2 contact 401k provider.

But I think the move from 401k to my traditional IRA is the change issue. I do think a rollover has to start at the 401K firm. I did this a loooong time ago (401k to a new broker as a Rollover-IRA - and it is still labelled as such, even though I don't think there is any difference from a basic Trad-IRA?). I don't recall the details, but I did not need a medallion signature. Originating firm for my 401K screwed it up about three times, sending the check to the wrong address. I did get them to give me interest for the lost 4 weeks or so.

-ERD50

 

[socca]

This is when BOA is the sender of the funds, not the recipient?

Neither, in my case. A MSG is just an authentication service provided by a bank, and can be used for any asset transfer between two institutions. AFAIK, you need to be a well-established client of a bank before they'll issue a MSG for an asset transfer you'd like to perform.

 

[braumeister]

Neither, in my case. A MSG is just an authentication service provided by a bank, and can be used for any asset transfer between two institutions. AFAIK, you need to be a well-established client of a bank before they'll issue a MSG for an asset transfer you'd like to perform.

But not necessarily a big money client. I had just a tiny checking account at a local credit union and they were happy to give me a Medallion for a transfer between two other institutions.

 

[unclemick]

That's a pretty universal response upon hearing you need one. Welcome to the club.

+1

Been a while,plus pre Covid.

Heh heh heh - still a pain.

 

[audreyh1]

Last year when I was surveying local banks for the MSG(s) I required I checked Bank of America. Two surprises unique to BOA:
(1) local BOA bank officers can't issue a MSG. Instead, the paperwork is sent off to a central office for stamping, and then is mailed back to the client.
(2) BOA demands to see the assets in the destination account.
These two "surprises" were a deal-killer for me. I scratched BOA off my list!

Yeah, number 2 was an issue for me trying to use a local Chase account. Fortunately, I was able to work things out over the phone with Fidelity.

 

[audreyh1]

When I did the 401K rollover years ago, they mailed me a check made out to the next trustee.

 

[COcheesehead]

Here’s another kicker. I talked to Fidelity today because I was thinking of making the 4 hour drive...their branches are closed. The rep said there is no talk of reopening soon either.

 

[NateW]

My first and only experience with Medallion Signature Guarantees was when my mother passed a couple of years ago and we were settling her estate via probate. We being my son, aunt and me acting as estate co-administrators. The attorney I hired suggested the co-administrators route because my mother's state of residency allows a sworn statement by Estate co-administrators that all bills have been paid and assets distributed to the beneficiaries instead of the riggerous final estate accounting, if all beneficiaries named in the will are co-administrators. This also meant assets could be distributed to the beneficiaries right away. To start the process, during the probate hearing I had to refuse to act as executor of her estate.

Little did I know at the time that the eight fund companies where my mother had her assets at each required a Medallion Signature Guarantee from each of us three co-administrators in order to move my mother's funds to an estate account and/or to our accounts from the estate account. To complicate matters and to add to my anxiety, my aunt lived out of state and lived on SS and had very little credit history. But after a rough start we all three managed to get the Gold Medallion Signature Guarantees without too much trouble. We did have to split some of the transactions due to the dollar amounts involved. My son and I got the Medallion Signature Guarantees from the bank where we set up the estate account.

 

[jazz4cash]

Here’s another kicker. I talked to Fidelity today because I was thinking of making the 4 hour drive...their branches are closed. The rep said there is no talk of reopening soon either.

Oh yeah, forgot about that. I got a welcome to our new branch email announcement offering assistance via phone since they’re not meeting in person. I would’ve thought an MDS transaction would be an exception. My credit union lobby is open with precautions.

 

[dcoy]

I believe HSBC will do it as well.

 

[COcheesehead]

Most places do it...but they have limits and that’s the rub.