pb4uski
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
In our recent house search we looked at over a dozen houses... in all cases with our agent... the seller's agent was not at a single showing. This is typical in my experience.
New Rules for Realtors
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USGrant1962
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Same here. I don't recall the seller's agent ever showing up when my agent was showing us a house. I'm not sure where this idea of the selling agent always being present came from - if true they wouldn't have lock boxes, your seller's agent would just hold your key.
Amethyst
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I'm curious - can an owner put updated house photos on Zillow without the house being offered for sale?
The old sale photos of my house are still on all the RE sites and they are awful - I've done a huge amount to the house inside and out since then.
The old sale photos of my house are still on all the RE sites and they are awful - I've done a huge amount to the house inside and out since then.
Ours too!!! I can't believe it. And the estimated value is way up based on the old floorplan. Our house is completely different. We knocked out walls, drilled through brick to make a sunroom accessible to the kitchen, new flooring throughout, etc. It is a different house than when we bought it.
Teacher Terry
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I am sure many people like me received a email stating that we might be eligible to join the settlement. I read the conditions and was eligible so filled out the paperwork and submitted proof that I sold my house during this time period and met the other criteria.
aja8888
Moderator Emeritus
I just bought a house last summer. I had little to no help from my "agent" (buyer side) when looking at homes, new or used. With the MLS, I searched out all the candidates. I used my agent to get me a look, but could have easily done the same with the seller's agents. I hired the inspection done and the title company did the rest after my offer was accepted.
lemming
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Until becomes completely separate from the cost of the home it will still be too much of a cost/value equation. Just saying the buyer pays a fee for buyer broker won't lower costs in total or to the seller (it will be negotiated as a concession from the seller) .
Maybe Instacart and Uber should get into the RE business and the agents can rely on tips to earn their living.
Maybe Instacart and Uber should get into the RE business and the agents can rely on tips to earn their living.
cbbennet
Dryer sheet aficionado
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I have that paperwork on my table to read. I believe I qualify and will not be spending the money until it's in the bank.
EvrClrx311
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Finally the US is catching up to the rest of the world, where it only costs between 1.5-3% on average to sell property or a home. I think the 6% rate has had it benefits, but it makes way more sense to have the buyer work on payment for an agent. May remove a lot of the undecided buyers who pull out last minute, or take their realtor to 100 homes before putting their first offer down. Buyer agents should just start charging by the hour for their time. No more of this working 40 hours with a client who bail on you... and then getting a cash infusion from the friend of a friend who is buying new construction and asks you to tag along. That would be an incredibly stressful way to make a living, all those ups and downs.
Very, very true and on top of that the requirements to get a RE license are very minimal, like can be done in about 3 weeks.
I have always considered it insane to pay agents 50,60,70 80 100,000 and more for sales in hcol areas.
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I don't know about photos, but I was able to claim to be the owner of the house and improve the accuracy of the listing (square footage, features). It took a few weeks, but their estimated value popped up a good bit.
RetireBy90
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
One pundit suggested that buyers will have to hire an agent but norm will be for buyer to ask seller to cover the cost like asking to cover closing costs or some portion of them.
I can't see a buyer foregoing an agent when buying biggest purchase of life. Penny wise pound foolish ?? I found our current home in 2007 by watching and searching foreclosure auctions. It was bought by bank at auction and then offered for sale.
I think several different standard practices will emerge and one or two will survive to a standard way to buy or sell but it will take some time to settle down.
On another note, those that claim Europeans don't have a system like ours, I would report that when living in Europe they have rental agents, you don't just go rent by yourself, at least most don't. So they have agents just like here, just operate a bit differently.
dawdmorgan
Dryer sheet wannabe
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In addition to making commissions/fees easier to negotiate for both buyer and seller, another BIG changes is that MLS can no longer list the offered commission on it's website. It was shown during the trial that while MLS claims that commissions have "always been negotiable", the unwritten rule amongst brokers was that you didn't waste your time showing a home with less than 5-6% commission. The evidence proved that buyers were "steered" away from those homes by their agent, thus creating a conflict of interest for selling agents to maintain the 5-6% standard fee.
You've got me curious. What would a buyer's agent get you in this case? Seems like you did most of the work. And did exactly what I would do if I were buying.
I'd look at all the on-line sources, from Zillow to FB marketplace. Then I'd approach the seller (owner or agent, I wouldn't care which) to see if we could strike a deal. I'd probably hire an attorney for the closing, maybe an appraiser and/or inspector. None of this sounds like too much effort, especially for such a large purchase. I'd want to be deeply involved in all these decisions even if I did have a buyer's agent for some reason.
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The typical listing agreement gives the agent exclusive access to the commission, and that doesn't seem like it will change. And the listing agent can put as much as they can get away with. But, as mentioned, it might go more to a fee for service model, rather than a percentage. So you want staging, that's $X, you want a walkthrough simulation, that's $Y, etc. You might owe those whether the property sells or not (unlike commissions).
All that seems to work, but I'm not sure how the buyer's agent thing will work.
Say I come to town and have someone drive me around and show me places. What if I fall in love with a seller who writes $1 in the buyer's agent commission field? When is this fact disclosed? If it's after I fall in love with the place, that's a problem.
In the past, I've used several agents to drive me around... using the one who specialized in various neighborhoods. I never was on the hook to compensate them, as they knew every place they showed me had 2.5 or 3% commission.
What I see in the future is buyer's agent having you sign an agreement with compensation specified for the buyer's agent to come from "somewhere". They'll sell it as "we'll get the seller to pay."
So now, as a seller, you might have two offers for "the same amount", but one buyer's agent awarded themselves a 3% commission, and the other a lesser amount, or a fixed amount based on the actual work performed.
So if you are a buyer, and you just sign whatever they put in front of you (a high commission), you're going to be at a disadvantage with any offers you make. IOW, as a buyer, you're going to have to negotiate up-front, or resign to pay the commission out of your own funds.
It should be interesting to see this play out.
Whenever entrenched processes get upset, it's gonna get messy.
All that seems to work, but I'm not sure how the buyer's agent thing will work.
Say I come to town and have someone drive me around and show me places. What if I fall in love with a seller who writes $1 in the buyer's agent commission field? When is this fact disclosed? If it's after I fall in love with the place, that's a problem.
In the past, I've used several agents to drive me around... using the one who specialized in various neighborhoods. I never was on the hook to compensate them, as they knew every place they showed me had 2.5 or 3% commission.
What I see in the future is buyer's agent having you sign an agreement with compensation specified for the buyer's agent to come from "somewhere". They'll sell it as "we'll get the seller to pay."
So now, as a seller, you might have two offers for "the same amount", but one buyer's agent awarded themselves a 3% commission, and the other a lesser amount, or a fixed amount based on the actual work performed.
So if you are a buyer, and you just sign whatever they put in front of you (a high commission), you're going to be at a disadvantage with any offers you make. IOW, as a buyer, you're going to have to negotiate up-front, or resign to pay the commission out of your own funds.
It should be interesting to see this play out.
Whenever entrenched processes get upset, it's gonna get messy.
OldShooter
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Yes. The historic model is based on the Realtors illegally colluding via the hidden MLS information. It's not based on personal expertise, though there is some of that out there.
Probably not for a first house, but after seeing how little the Realtor contributed vs the commission he collected, I think most people would be comfortable with fee-for-services support like attorneys, CPAs, house inspectors and appraisers for a subsequent house at a total cost much less than a RE commission.
So no buyer's RE agent there, right?
I agree. There is nothing about the transaction that justifies an agent getting a share of the price. If I ever sell another house, I will negotiate for the services I want on a flat fee basis.
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The last house we sold was 2010. We utilized a FSBO realtor. They had a sliding fee base scale for different service levels which included the multi-listing. If memory serves, it cost $500 or so for the listing and some advice. The listing price was a flat fee, not based on sale price.
We had buyers using an agent. We took a risk having their agent represent both parties during the closing. We felt, rightly or wrongly, that we had enough experience to take this approach. He was helpful to everyone and we paid him a fee but I can’t remember the amount. I do remember I was ver happy with the final expense for the sales process. I do not know if the buyers paid him anything.
This model does require the seller to take responsibility for the sale. It would not surprise me if a sliding fee will be established for a sale oriented realtor position. This position would provide services for sellers not comfortable representing themselves for a flat fee.
We had buyers using an agent. We took a risk having their agent represent both parties during the closing. We felt, rightly or wrongly, that we had enough experience to take this approach. He was helpful to everyone and we paid him a fee but I can’t remember the amount. I do remember I was ver happy with the final expense for the sales process. I do not know if the buyers paid him anything.
This model does require the seller to take responsibility for the sale. It would not surprise me if a sliding fee will be established for a sale oriented realtor position. This position would provide services for sellers not comfortable representing themselves for a flat fee.
RetireBy90
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
So I did use an agent with a reduced commission to act as go between, present the offer, get me to closing table. I'd done a lot of work as you mentioned. I got a kickback at closing of 2% so he got 1%.
In my limited experience I've run into several unreasonable agents and people on the other side of the table. With $500K on the table I didn't want to get emotional with an unreasonable counter party so I was able to put my offer on the table and let the agent deal with negotiations. Like buying a car from dealer, the worst part is sitting for couple hours with paperwork and attempts to up sell. In 2007 the bank had so many properties on book selling one more didn't seem to make much difference. My agent took time to pester them to get the sale approved.
RetireBy90
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
So my first house I bought without a realtor. It was a VA assumption and in the offer I gave agent $1K, gave the owner $1K and assumed the loan. That was $48K house I think. Forward to 2006 and we made an offer on a home but had to back out as the lender had gone out of business about 10 years earlier and a clear title couldn't be delivered. I ended up loosing my deposit
Current home I did use an agent but got a refund of 2% since I did the work. See previous reply FWIW
Was there a time there was no such thing as technically a "buyers" agent? It seemed the standard was a real estate agent was always really working for the seller, not the buyer and the seller was supposed to pay the commission, except in the case of new construction where the buyer pays the commission for the builder's realtor? I'm confused.
Anyway- our first home we bought directly from the owner with no real estate agent. NY had to have an atty anyway.
For our second home we had one agent for both selling our home and buying our new construction home which i saw advertised in the newspaper (she was the builder's agent). But she was awful, especially in selling our home so we ended up at the final hour hiring another agent from another company for that. Again, in NY so we had an atty.
Came time to sell that home I hired a husband/wife team, and for buying our current home (which I saw advertised on line) just used the builders agent who was mostly great to work with in terms of building the house every step of the way. I have to say she earned her commission. Atty's not required in NH but we hired an atty anyway.
These realtors were never flexible on their commissions, though. I think we paid 5 or 6 percent.
Anyway- our first home we bought directly from the owner with no real estate agent. NY had to have an atty anyway.
For our second home we had one agent for both selling our home and buying our new construction home which i saw advertised in the newspaper (she was the builder's agent). But she was awful, especially in selling our home so we ended up at the final hour hiring another agent from another company for that. Again, in NY so we had an atty.
Came time to sell that home I hired a husband/wife team, and for buying our current home (which I saw advertised on line) just used the builders agent who was mostly great to work with in terms of building the house every step of the way. I have to say she earned her commission. Atty's not required in NH but we hired an atty anyway.
These realtors were never flexible on their commissions, though. I think we paid 5 or 6 percent.
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To file a claim, go here: https://www.realestatecommissionlitigation.com/
We sold a home in 2023 in CA. To the best of my knowledge, our seller's agent is not affilliated with any of the agencies that are participating in the settlement, and we didn't get a notice in the mail. I don't know if we'll get anything, but I went ahead and submitted a claim anyway.
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From what I remember, you've got it right. My experience is from North Carolina, but a long, long time ago. I went through the community college course and I was "official" but never did the crowning step of associating myself with an established broker, which is required to practice. Anyway, at that time (mid 80's), the typical agents who were showing houses to buyers technically had no obligation to look out for the buyer's interest. They were paid by, and technically were required to look out for, the seller's best interests. It was, and I suppose still is, possible to hire a true "buyer's agent" who is compensated by the buyer, but that was something that almost never happened back then.
aja8888
Moderator Emeritus
I sold my home in 2023 and qualify (RE/MAX - Houston). My claim is going in next week.
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The Last 4 Years
I clicked into the link and looked at the form.
Although there are some geographies that go back as far as 2014, the majority of claimants are probably in the group defined by "Any MLS in the United States other than the MLSs listed above: February 1, 2020 through February 1, 2024".
I thought it was just with the companies in the suit, but it says "You do not need to have sold a home using an Anywhere, RE/MAX, or Keller Williams agent to make a claim."
I clicked into the link and looked at the form.
Although there are some geographies that go back as far as 2014, the majority of claimants are probably in the group defined by "Any MLS in the United States other than the MLSs listed above: February 1, 2020 through February 1, 2024".
I thought it was just with the companies in the suit, but it says "You do not need to have sold a home using an Anywhere, RE/MAX, or Keller Williams agent to make a claim."
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