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08-21-2015, 08:25 AM
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#21
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 3,054
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kevink
Vanguard ETFs, uniquely among ETFs to the best of my knowledge, are actually a share class of the corresponding mutual funds. Same management - and same dim view of active trading of index funds. Personally I see it as an advantage, in that you're far less likely to see your Vanguard ETFs trading at a steep discount during times of market panic. Active traders have the entire rest of the ETF world open to them (which is of course one of the main reasons Vanguard founder John Bogle has such a negative view of ETFs).
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Anything that restricts my ability to change a position is never an advantage. Also your point that Vanguard's restriction will result in less of a discount in down turns simply doesn't hold water. What percentage of the brokerage world does Vanguard hold? Minimal. Therefore the restriction will have no impact on premium/discounts. ETFs are great because they are liquid, Vanguard doesn't see this as a virtue, weird.
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08-21-2015, 10:12 PM
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#22
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Twin Cities
Posts: 3,927
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When I moved my money from Schwab to Vanguard, I was surprised that Vanguard required two accounts for each IRA. All of those dual accounts were clunky. I received the same letter the OP received, gave Vanguard approval to combine the series of dual accounts to one, and it was a non-event. I'm glad for any pain-free opportunities to keep finances simple.
Sent from my iPad using Early Retirement Forum
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08-22-2015, 09:12 AM
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#23
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 9,343
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Markola
When I moved my money from Schwab to Vanguard, I was surprised that Vanguard required two accounts for each IRA. All of those dual accounts were clunky. I received the same letter the OP received, gave Vanguard approval to combine the series of dual accounts to one, and it was a non-event. I'm glad for any pain-free opportunities to keep finances simple.
Sent from my iPad using Early Retirement Forum
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+1.... I do not like change and do not particularly like to lift a finger in effort to assist in change. But even I did this. Easy to do, and like you said...simpler.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
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09-24-2016, 11:57 AM
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#24
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Sarasota, FL & Vermont
Posts: 36,264
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I logged onto Vanguard today and noticed for the first time an "Upgrade" option on each mutual fund account where I could upgrade from a mutual fund account to a brokerage fund account online.
Curious about the experience of people who have converted and any benefits or detriments.
__________________
If something cannot endure laughter.... it cannot endure.
Patience is the art of concealing your impatience.
Slow and steady wins the race.
Retired Jan 2012 at age 56
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09-24-2016, 12:47 PM
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#25
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Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Flyover country
Posts: 25,199
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Many of us did that in the last year. Simplicity is a good thing.
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09-24-2016, 12:55 PM
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#26
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 10,252
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It has been reported and I have found true that the "upgrade" will mess up one's instructions on what to do with automatically reinvesting distributions.
I think the upgrade resets things to the "account default" whatever that was for you. If you had different funds to do different things from the "account default", then you may be in a for a surprise.
So double check after you upgrade what the settings are for each and every one of your investments in the new account structure. I certainly had to reset mine back to what I wanted and had previously.
For me, I had brokerage accounts at Vanguard for ETFs, but my default was not to reinvest any ETF distributions back into the ETFs. When my mutual funds got "upgraded" and placed in the existing brokerage accounts, they lost my choice to have distributions automatically reinvested, so I had to reset those. Perhaps this would not be a problem for folks with no previously existing brokerage account.
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09-24-2016, 04:14 PM
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#27
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Recycles dryer sheets
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 67
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A few of the differences that I have noticed. First, the settlement account (MMF) does not allow paper checks. Second, the settlement account is a sweep account. It can be a bit more difficult to figure out where the sweep came from. For example if you have dividends go into the sweep account they get aggregated quickly and it is difficult to figure out where it came from . And finally, transfers between old style and upgraded accounts if not allowed. I had opened up a new ROTH to do a rollover and found that I could not roll over until the Traditional IRA was upgraded first.
__________________
Don't sweat the petty stuff.
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09-24-2016, 04:38 PM
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#28
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Sarasota, FL & Vermont
Posts: 36,264
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All good intelligence... thank you !
__________________
If something cannot endure laughter.... it cannot endure.
Patience is the art of concealing your impatience.
Slow and steady wins the race.
Retired Jan 2012 at age 56
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09-24-2016, 08:07 PM
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#29
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Full time employment: Posting here.
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 717
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Quote:
Originally Posted by braumeister
Many of us did that in the last year. Simplicity is a good thing.
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Does anyone know how/if it affects Quicken downloads/links ?
__________________
“The problem with the world is that the intelligent people are full of doubt, while the stupid people are full of confidence.”
(—Charles Bukowski)
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09-25-2016, 06:48 AM
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#30
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: On a hill in the Pine Barrens
Posts: 9,686
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I feel left out. Have no upgrade button. I remember seeing something in the past, but did not proceed. Our accounts are very simple , buy and hold variety. Now, if they offered a toaster...
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09-25-2016, 07:13 AM
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#31
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Recycles dryer sheets
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 164
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One thing I experienced when I upgraded last year is it resulted in an additional 1099 tax statement that I was not anticipating. In the spring, I went through my usual checklist of documents and when I had everything (I thought), I filed the return.
Didn't know there would be separate 1099's for before & after the upgrade. A new one was released a week or two later and I had to file amended federal and state returns. That was annoying and I wished, if they had to be separate statements, that they were released together so this could have been avoided.
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09-25-2016, 07:16 AM
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#32
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Colorado Mountains
Posts: 3,165
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Quote:
Originally Posted by target2019
I feel left out. Have no upgrade button. I remember seeing something in the past, but did not proceed. Our accounts are very simple , buy and hold variety. Now, if they offered a toaster...
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Didn't banks stop doing that in the middle of the last century?
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09-25-2016, 07:26 AM
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#33
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Recycles dryer sheets
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 217
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Quote:
Originally Posted by target2019
I feel left out. Have no upgrade button. I remember seeing something in the past, but did not proceed. Our accounts are very simple , buy and hold variety. Now, if they offered a toaster...
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Same here, I just logged into Vanguard now and don't see any "upgrade button" anywhere, anyplace for any of my funds in either of my T-IRA account or Regular. Account. All my funds are at admiral level and most are index funds with Vanguard ETF equivalents (e.g. VFIAX and VOO).
I'm so very confused.
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09-25-2016, 07:31 AM
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#34
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 3,594
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Since you can't go back, I would instead consider opening a new brokerage account separate from the mutual fund account. I would try to title the new account so that it is not identical to the MF account to avoid an involuntary "upgrade" in the process.
This way, if you really like the brokerage account you can keep it and move the old assets to it and close the MF account.
If on the other hand, the brokerage account is not all that it was cracked up to be, you haven't forever lost your MF account.
I have a VG brokerage account from about a decade ago but it has been inactive and empty for some time.
BTW - I just noticed that I have been presented the Upgrade link too on vanguard.com. Thanks for the heads up on this!
-gauss
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09-25-2016, 07:33 AM
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#35
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Twin Cities
Posts: 3,927
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Quote:
Originally Posted by prototype
Same here, I just logged into Vanguard now and don't see any "upgrade button" anywhere, anyplace for any of my funds in either of my T-IRA account or Regular. Account. All my funds are at admiral level and most are index funds with Vanguard ETF equivalents (e.g. VFIAX and VOO).
I'm so very confused.
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For your T-IRA, do you have one account or two, i.e. a brokerage account and a second one? If one, then you are already upgraded, as Another Reader above said would happen automatically soon.
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09-25-2016, 07:35 AM
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#36
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: On a hill in the Pine Barrens
Posts: 9,686
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermit
Didn't banks stop doing that in the middle of the last century?
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Wouldn't know what to with toaster, now that you mention it.
Maybe a pair of suspenders?
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09-25-2016, 07:53 AM
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#37
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: On a hill in the Pine Barrens
Posts: 9,686
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Quote:
Originally Posted by prototype
Same here, I just logged into Vanguard now and don't see any "upgrade button" anywhere, anyplace for any of my funds in either of my T-IRA account or Regular. Account. All my funds are at admiral level and most are index funds with Vanguard ETF equivalents (e.g. VFIAX and VOO).
I'm so very confused.
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This Vanguard page explains things, and it may lead to the option for you to upgrade.
https://investor.vanguard.com/info/account-upgrade
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09-25-2016, 08:11 AM
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#38
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Recycles dryer sheets
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 217
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Quote:
Originally Posted by target2019
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Thank you for the link, I just went there and saw the START button. Got some reading to do before I select it (if I decide to select it). It looks like they are looking for "my permission" before they start messing around with things.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Markola
For your T-IRA, do you have one account or two, i.e. a brokerage account and a second one? If one, then you are already upgraded, as Another Reader above said would happen automatically soon.
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Just the same old Investor Side Account (and acct#) I've had for a bunch of years before they even started the "two sides of the house".
I don't understand how they can start moving people's money around without permission.
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09-25-2016, 08:50 AM
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#39
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: On a hill in the Pine Barrens
Posts: 9,686
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Quote:
Originally Posted by prototype
I don't understand how they can start moving people's money around without permission.
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They can't move things without your permission.
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09-25-2016, 08:51 AM
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#40
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Spending the Kids Inheritance and living in Chicago
Posts: 17,010
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We did it last year.
I like having everything in 1 place, it does break out the different accounts by the type for me.
Regular Account, 401k Roth, 401K IRA, etc. but now I just log in 1 place and see it all.
It adds the amounts from each together to show 1 final Total.
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