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Old 10-04-2017, 08:27 AM   #21
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There's nothing wrong with not spending money, unless you are needlessly depriving yourself. Some people save all their lives and are never able to transition to enjoying the fruits of their labour.
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Old 10-04-2017, 08:42 AM   #22
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I think things have value due to scarcity. When I am flush then wild swings in spending don't do much for happiness IMO. I remember being on a cruise a couple of years ago enjoying great seafood each day as we were in port. After a while I got my fill and the enjoyment wore off. I did enjoy the balcony cabin and will continue to upgrade to them when we cruise. I am working on increasing my spending marginally. Baseball Playoff Tickets, healthier food, nicer hotel rooms, etc. Of course I can't seem to replace a 13 yr old car as I just don't see the value at this point. Go figure.
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Old 10-04-2017, 09:03 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by marko View Post
Because life is too short not to have a good the best time.
Because life is too hard not to find buy ways to make it easier.
Because I've seen firsthand the hazards of leaving a ton of money to heirs.

But it is indeed, your money to spend--or not--as you wish.
+1

I suspect that the widespread, irrational reluctance to spend down principal often leads to a) retirees living much more frugally than they need to, and b) heirs receiving much larger estates than they are savvy enough to know how to manage, spend, and/or invest.
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Old 10-04-2017, 09:36 AM   #24
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$2319 + $799 net a month after income taxes / health ins so $3118, save $1375 .... I dont need to accumulate any more 'stuff' & I live in California so food is cheap. I'm still trying to learn to spend. Will get slammed with taxes when full SSA + RMD
While I totally agree a person does not NEED to spend their savings, sometimes a person holds off on spending some when it won't really make any difference and thereby deny themselves something they might enjoy.

Example: Perhaps you would enjoy a river cruise, yes you might have to pay the "extra" single supplement, so a 2 week cruise might be $7,000 instead of $5,000/pp , as you won't be sharing a room.

So will spending the extra $2,000 mean you eat cat food later, or will it mean you simply pay a little less in taxes later (RMD time) and leave less to folks who may end up wasting more than the inherited $2,000 on something.
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Old 10-04-2017, 09:52 AM   #25
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Spending has not been an issue for us in retirement. We don't deprive ourselves from anything we want and we feel that maintaining our current standard of living is extremely important to us. On average our WR has been over 5% in retirement and this year will exceed 6% as we took advantage of a couple of travel opportunities and purchased season tickets to one of our pro sports teams.

Some people are content with their lifestyle without excessive spending and that's good for them but for us the experiences and lifestyle require a high rate of spending and since we can afford it we will continue to enjoy these experiences for as long as we're physically and mentally able to.
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Old 10-04-2017, 09:53 AM   #26
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Or he could be like me. After being frugal for so long, we have the funds to spend. I just booked a trip where I thought we would be camping. Hub said no to that and wanted me to book higher end lodging. I just booked a few places at $275-$350 a night. I then had to go lay down with a pillow over my head. Spending gives me anxiety attacks. I am a money hoarder....
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Old 10-04-2017, 09:57 AM   #27
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Yes, Sunset, going from a saver to a spender is hard. Baby steps (Ukraine next spring, Japan next week, only saving $1000 this month -- getting better )

My decision to NOT go on a river cruise came from them trying to convince me that all shore excursions are covered and all 180+ do it all together (limited options). Of course I could view it like just lodging but then I'd have a hard time justifying the $12k vs $2k, says this money hoarder

OTOH: if OP just discussing how people are unaware of what SWR actually is then he has a point.
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Old 10-04-2017, 10:39 AM   #28
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On our European trip, we have been consciously spending more, like ordering the most expensive wine by the glass and staying more upscale (like The Imperial Palace in Annecy).

I must admit that it is not natural but we are liking the results so far. OTOH we decided that the cost of laundry in the hotel was more than we could handle. And we have enough clothes to get to our apartment in Nice.
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Old 10-04-2017, 10:44 AM   #29
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Or he could be like me. After being frugal for so long, we have the funds to spend. I just booked a trip where I thought we would be camping. Hub said no to that and wanted me to book higher end lodging. I just booked a few places at $275-$350 a night. I then had to go lay down with a pillow over my head. Spending gives me anxiety attacks. I am a money hoarder....
Wow, what a jump from camping... When faced with hotel costs that were not even this high, I checked out Airbnb and found you can easily find renting an entire apt/house for $100/night.
Just like looking at a hotel, one has to read all the reviews, and pick the best place (lots of 4.8 stars or higher, and lots of reviews (~ 60+).

So I guess I'm a money hoarder as well
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Old 10-04-2017, 10:57 AM   #30
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If you really feel your friend does not understand he could withdraw 3% and still have a ton of $ no problem explaining it but then I would drop the subject. We are spending more in retirement on eating out, entertainment, travel etc because now we have the time and energy. Also with losing 3 friends from 59-67 we are going to do what we want while we can. Time is finite and we want to have fun.
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Old 10-04-2017, 12:25 PM   #31
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A day or so ago we were over at DW's daughter's......an electrical sensor/component on their stove packed it in.....replacement cost for the part $500 Cdn.

I doubt that our basic, bought on sale a couple years ago, stove cost $500, and yet it does everything we require it to do and is far less likely to break down.

Spend more? Why?
I think stoves have become the biggest "hanger queens" in many modern homes. Electronic gadget filled oven to reheat pizza! Yet all the young-uns seem to demand them. Maybe to impress their peers?
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Old 10-04-2017, 12:44 PM   #32
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I think stoves have become the biggest "hanger queens" in many modern homes. Electronic gadget filled oven to reheat pizza! Yet all the young-uns seem to demand them. Maybe to impress their peers?
For many people, the kitchen is the central focus of the house, and all the other rooms are merely ancillary additions.

Think about it: whenever you go to a casual party at someone's home, where does everyone tend to congregate?
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Old 10-04-2017, 01:30 PM   #33
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Exactly... I usually have to prompt people to " let's go sit on the deck" or "let's go sit in the living area" to get them out of standing around the kithen island.
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Old 10-04-2017, 02:31 PM   #34
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All his spending money is with his pensions and SS.

I think that he feels his nest egg is there for security, and it's best for it to remain untouched. But by him knowing SWR, he could easily take out 3% of that egg and it would still last him most likely infinitum and still grow.
Could your hang up be that he isn't spending as much as you are, or does he appear cheap for his assets?

Many in my family have a hard time spending, and live on less than their pensions and social security. It is funny to watch these relatives who have plenty of money wear tattered clothes, when they have brand new ones un-opened in the drawer, they are saving.

It must be genetic because my own retirement budget forecast, that takes me from present day to 2032, I have a net positive number which is growing as new cash flows come on line, and obligations go off line.
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Old 10-04-2017, 03:06 PM   #35
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Our planned WR is .5%, once SS kicks in combined with pensions and a little hobby income, less if we downsize. We can live pretty well on that so why spend more. I find it kind of fun to try to figure out how to live high on the hog without spending a lot of money.
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Old 10-04-2017, 03:24 PM   #36
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....Many in my family have a hard time spending, and live on less than their pensions and social security. It is funny to watch these relatives who have plenty of money wear tattered clothes, when they have brand new ones un-opened in the drawer, they are saving....
Is that you cousin Joe?

My grandmother was like that a very small pension and SS and still saved.... when she went into a nursing home and we took down her apartment we found all sorts of very nice new clothes that had never been used... ended up giving them away. Her daughter (my aunt) is not far behind... despite a multi-million portfolio... lives in jeans and t-shirts (which by concidence is what I am wearing as I type this but I am just hanging around the house... will change into nicer clothes to go out to dinner tonight).
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Old 10-04-2017, 04:38 PM   #37
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Could your hang up be that he isn't spending as much as you are, or does he appear cheap for his assets?

Many in my family have a hard time spending, and live on less than their pensions and social security. It is funny to watch these relatives who have plenty of money wear tattered clothes, when they have brand new ones un-opened in the drawer, they are saving.

It must be genetic because my own retirement budget forecast, that takes me from present day to 2032, I have a net positive number which is growing as new cash flows come on line, and obligations go off line.
What is the first reinforcements in 1/20 in your tag line?
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Old 10-04-2017, 04:48 PM   #38
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First Reinforcement

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Originally Posted by JDARNELL View Post
What is the first reinforcements in 1/20 in your tag line?
Short Story:
I have an annuity that starts paying out a fixed monthly amount for 5 years.

Long Story:
I had a company steal commissions from me over a 10 year period and this is the settlement payment.
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Old 10-04-2017, 04:54 PM   #39
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Is that you cousin Joe?

.
missing the reference

This guy?
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Old 10-04-2017, 05:38 PM   #40
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I don't know this but I would guess that he worked hard in order to accumulate $3MM. Sounds to me like he has earned the right to spend it or not, as HE wishes. Not as YOU wish.

Is it some sort of sin or crime to spend less than the absolute maximum possible one can spend without running out of money? Is that what our consumerist culture has decreed? Yikes.

OP here: Honestly, and I mean this sincerely and want to make perfectly clear: I don't consider my friend a sinner for not delving into his nest egg. And, heaven forbid, I don't think this makes him a criminal.

I'm very sorry if this is what I implied to you via my post.

It could be simple like Occam's razor, in that nothing is being implied, and as Gayl sums it up:

OTOH: if OP just discussing how people are unaware of what SWR actually is then he has a point.
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