Perceived social obligation to spend retiree assets

[I was misinformed]

Top Japanese political leaders including vice Prime Minister Aso have recently expressed some rather extreme views suggesting old folks have no business living so long and hanging onto their money:

In fresh shot at elderly, Aso asks: 'How much longer do you intend to keep living?' | The Japan Times

The implications of such thinking could be enormous. No doubt these views resonate with elements of US political leadership (I recall 25 years ago John Silber, a prominent candidate for Massachusetts governor, made similar comments). As it becomes clearer (perhaps) that our basic economic problem is lack of demand, I wonder if there could be some real policy proposals (beyond say confiscation of retirement assets) that could encourage spending of retirement assets? Does any of this make macroeconomic sense?

 

[Mulligan]

He just needs to be a bit more patient. If they are like people I know, that next generation will "get the Yen circulating" once it is bequeathed to them. My 86 year old neighbor would be offended by that, though. He just nailed another hole in one today. That will keep up his desire to stay above ground a few more years.


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[Sunset]

I suppose he has found the fountain of youth, or is even stupider than most folks realize, as he too will age.

 

[yakers]

He needs to be careful what he says . In just about all democracies the older folks vote more than younger


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[Amethyst]

Most old folks will spend large amounts in the final years of life. It just won't be on consumer goods. So maybe the politicians need to support the building of more old-folks' homes, services for elderly, etc.

Top Japanese political leaders including vice Prime Minister Aso have recently expressed some rather extreme views suggesting old folks have no business living so long and hanging onto their money:

 

[Tadpole]

Amazon is the only one in my life doing a good job of getting me to spend the money. I think it's because their style is a bit flirtatious.

 

[dunkelblau]

September 19 would be the perfect occasion for this sound bite. No silver sakazuki for you!

 

[RobbieB]

I hope to avoid any such scrutiny by spending lavishly.

 

[SJ1_]

... My 86 year old neighbor would be offended by that, though. He just nailed another hole in one today. ...


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that's great! my neighbor shot his age at 84 - he turned 89 this month

 

[Big_Hitter]

I think they are having some serious economic problems relating to lack of immigration and zero population growth combined with an aging population. We will be there soon.

Still, that's no reason to beat up on the elderly.

 

[razztazz]

Most old folks will spend large amounts in the final years of life. It just won't be on consumer goods. So maybe the politicians need to support the building of more old-folks' homes, services for elderly, etc.

I don't know how they do it in Japan but when they give me guaranteed money, and guaranteed health care, and guaranteed assisted living, and guaranteed nursing home care, all of high quality, and guarantee that I won't go broke, then I'll start spending for more "kicks" in the here-and-now. Until they do I'll have to save my money for such contingencies. Life, as the saying goes, is about choices

 

[LARS]

Well maybe if the Finance Minister et al (past and present) hadn't so screwed up Japan's economy/market, and retirees felt confident, and could earn a positive return on safe investments instead of negative yields, then they'd feel safer spending instead of saving for an insecure future.




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[Koolau]

Anyone recall the discussions of "Death Panels" in OB care? The "name" was accurately denied. But close reading of the fine print all but verified the concept IIRC. So, those of us wanting a kidney transplant after 75 might do well to set $175K aside for such an eventuality. Non-covered medical expenses may help you spend down your assets very quickly and "solve" this "problem."

What's really funny is that the same folks now criticizing the "old" people for living so long will very soon be old themselves (it happens faster than any 30 year old can conceive.)

 

[REWahoo]

Simple solution with a one-word revision to the IRS laws: Change RMD (Required Minimum Distribution) to RMS (Required Minimum Spending).

 

[HadEnuff]

I feel more of a social obligation to not run out of money before I die.

 

[papadad111]

Let's not forget the Japanese savings rate is far higher than that of the USA savings rate. Also Much of the wealth in Japan's silver generation is locked up in the form of real estate too.

 

[Greencheese]

I read on CNN sometime ago that Japan does have problems with the older generations voting detrimental policies that cause a lot of harm to younger citizens. Not sure how true that is but it could be the case of voters going short term gain today and I'll be dead before any pain tomorrow. Usually takes quite awhile before things ever get bad anywhere...

 

[papadad111]

I read on CNN sometime ago that Japan does have problems with the older generations voting detrimental policies that cause a lot of harm to younger citizens. Not sure how true that is but it could be the case of voters going short term gain today and I'll be dead before any pain tomorrow. Usually takes quite awhile before things ever get bad anywhere...

Webster's See: Venezuela.

 

[MichaelB]

Webster's See: Venezuela.

If you're suggesting that anything happening in Venezuela has any significance at all with anything that might happen in Japan, I disagree.

 

[papadad111]

If you're suggesting that anything happening in Venezuela has any significance at all with anything that might happen in Japan, I disagree.

Bzzz. Nope. Not suggesting that at all.

See last sentence. "could be the case of voters going short term gain today and I'll be dead before any pain tomorrow. Usually takes quite awhile before things ever get bad anywhere..."

Didn't take very long in Venezuela for things to go to **** with the short term focus.

 

[Greencheese]

Bzzz. Nope. Not suggesting that at all.

See last sentence. "could be the case of voters going short term gain today and I'll be dead before any pain tomorrow. Usually takes quite awhile before things ever get bad anywhere..."

Didn't take very long in Venezuela for things to go to **** with the short term focus.

Depends on your definition of long. For a politician 5-10 good years with high oil prices is plenty of time to get in, get rich, and get out. For someone investing for the future or looking at 30-40 years working... not so much.

 

[MichaelB]

Bzzz. Nope. Not suggesting that at all.

See last sentence. "could be the case of voters going short term gain today and I'll be dead before any pain tomorrow. Usually takes quite awhile before things ever get bad anywhere..."

Didn't take very long in Venezuela for things to go to **** with the short term focus.

Not suggesting that a second time? What has happened in Venezuela has no bearing on Japan, so it's not clear why you bring it up again. One thing for sure, however, it certainly did take a very long time to evolve. There is lots of rich history in that story, which is still evolving.

If you want to discuss Venezuela and early retirement I would suggest a separate thread on that topic, so we can keep this one on Japan, it's elderly population and the Finance Minister.

 

[Sunset]

Being a natural born saver, I do not blame the Japanese. I love getting something on a deal, and with negative interest rates and deflation, delaying spending means stuff will be cheaper next month.

If we get deflation here, I'm sure you will see it happen too.

Of course an older person can only play that game so long...

 

[Amethyst]

The grim fact is that you can throw all the money you want, but the supply of transplant organs is only as big as the supply of donorcycle accidents and such. So if you are over 75, the organ, not the operation, is what will be rationed - and most likely not in your favor.

My dear SIL died of liver disease in her late 60's, despite Medicare and TRICARE coverage, because there never seemed to be a liver when she needed one. And then she became too sick for the surgery.

A So, those of us wanting a kidney transplant after 75 might do well to set $175K aside for such an eventuality. Non-covered medical expenses may help you spend down your assets very quickly and "solve" this "problem."

What's really funny is that the same folks now criticizing the "old" people for living so long will very soon be old themselves (it happens faster than any 30 year old can conceive.)

 

[Big_Hitter]

The grim fact is that you can throw all the money you want, but the supply of transplant organs is only as big as the supply of donorcycle accidents and such. So if you are over 75, the organ, not the operation, is what will be rationed - and most likely not in your favor.

My dear SIL died of liver disease in her late 60's, despite Medicare and TRICARE coverage, because there never seemed to be a liver when she needed one. And then she became too sick for the surgery.

I don't think we are very far away from being able to clone organs. Well everything except the brain.....

Once we can transplant cloned organs we all may live to 100+