Join Early Retirement Today
View Poll Results: what percentage of investable assets is your subsidy
less than 0.1% 2 4.55%
greater than 0.1% and < 0.2% 2 4.55%
greater than 0.2% and < 0.3% 2 4.55%
greater than 0.3% and < 0.4% 1 2.27%
greater than 0.4% and < 0.5% 1 2.27%
greater than 0.5% and < 0.6% 1 2.27%
greater than 0.6% and < 0.7% 0 0%
greater than 0.7% and < 0.8% 0 0%
greater than 0.8% and < 0.9% 1 2.27%
greater than 0.9% and < 1.0% 1 2.27%
greater than 1.0% and < 1.25% 2 4.55%
greater than 1.25% and < 1.5% 1 2.27%
greater than 1.5% and < 1.75% 0 0%
greater than 1.75% and < 2.0% 1 2.27%
greater than 2.0% and < 2.5% 0 0%
greater than 2.5% and < 3.0% 0 0%
greater than 3.0% and < 4.0% 1 2.27%
greater than 4%% 1 2.27%
have aca insurance but no subsidy 11 25.00%
don't have aca insurance 16 36.36%
Voters: 44. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
POLL: ACA subsidy as a % of investable assets
Old 11-03-2019, 04:44 PM   #1
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 2,420
POLL: ACA subsidy as a % of investable assets

As we get near year's end the number of threads on ACA and subsidies are increasing. Early in ER I wasted a couple years doing small roth conversions and not getting subsidies that I could easily qualified for. The last two years I have bypassed subsidies, but I've done roth conversions to the top of the 24% bracket.

Just comparing investable assets to subsidy is likely not enough info as the positioning of assets may cause some to have too much income. It is worth a try to see what we can learn
__________________

bingybear is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 11-03-2019, 05:19 PM   #2
Moderator
rodi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: San Diego
Posts: 10,343
As a family of 4, the subsidy is worth doing smaller Roth conversion. I Roth convert up to near the edge of the ACA subsidy cliff.
__________________

__________________
Retired June 2014. No longer an enginerd - now I'm just a nerd.
micro pensions 7%, rental income 18%
rodi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2019, 05:37 PM   #3
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
RunningBum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 9,098
I'm not sure what the purpose of the poll is, other than another chance for someone to tell me I shouldn't be getting a big subsidy.

Besides, a small % could indicate a small subsidy, or a large net worth.

I do agree with the notion I think I see in the first post, that for at least some of us you should either take the subsidy, or blow past it with Roth conversions or 0% cap gains.
RunningBum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2019, 05:37 PM   #4
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Tampa
Posts: 5,117
Oops, I voted 4% by error. Should be about 1%.
__________________
TGIM
Dtail is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2019, 05:42 PM   #5
Administrator
MichaelB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: lumpen slums of cyberspace
Posts: 30,724
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dtail View Post
Oops, I voted 4% by error. Should be about 1%.
That can be changed if you wish.
MichaelB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2019, 05:52 PM   #6
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Tampa
Posts: 5,117
Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelB View Post
That can be changed if you wish.
Yes can you change it please, or am I able to change it?
__________________
TGIM
Dtail is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2019, 05:53 PM   #7
Administrator
MichaelB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: lumpen slums of cyberspace
Posts: 30,724
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dtail View Post
Yes can you change it please, or am I able to change it?
Iíll do it. From what to what?
MichaelB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2019, 05:57 PM   #8
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Tampa
Posts: 5,117
Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelB View Post
Iíll do it. From what to what?
From 4% to 1%.
Thanks.
__________________
TGIM
Dtail is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2019, 05:59 PM   #9
Administrator
MichaelB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: lumpen slums of cyberspace
Posts: 30,724
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dtail View Post
From 4% to 1%.
Thanks.
Done. Cheers ..
MichaelB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2019, 06:30 PM   #10
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 2,420
Quote:
Originally Posted by RunningBum View Post
I'm not sure what the purpose of the poll is, other than another chance for someone to tell me I shouldn't be getting a big subsidy.

Besides, a small % could indicate a small subsidy, or a large net worth.

I do agree with the notion I think I see in the first post, that for at least some of us you should either take the subsidy, or blow past it with Roth conversions or 0% cap gains.
It is not my intent to criticize people for taking a subsidy.. and yes I did the top post you referred to. My first two years of ER I roth converted up to the top of the 15% bracket. I should have done roth conversions just below the cliff. Last year and this year I'm roth converting up to the top of the 24% bracket... thus no subsidy. This has nothing to do with the ACA or subsidies.

And you are right that there are many variables that make it somewhat difficult to ascertain exact info. Family size varies, locations of funds vary (tax diversification), subsidy amounts vary...

When I'm done with the large roth conversions ... I may then look at subsidies.
bingybear is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2019, 06:54 PM   #11
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
RunningBum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 9,098
Quote:
Originally Posted by bingybear View Post
It is not my intent to criticize people for taking a subsidy.. and yes I did the top post you referred to. My first two years of ER I roth converted up to the top of the 15% bracket. I should have done roth conversions just below the cliff. Last year and this year I'm roth converting up to the top of the 24% bracket... thus no subsidy. This has nothing to do with the ACA or subsidies.

And you are right that there are many variables that make it somewhat difficult to ascertain exact info. Family size varies, locations of funds vary (tax diversification), subsidy amounts vary...

When I'm done with the large roth conversions ... I may then look at subsidies.
I didn't mean you would criticize, but I heard this once elsewhere, and wouldn't be surprised if it comes up here too.

I'm going the opposite way from you, taking the subsidy when I can, then doing larger Roth conversions in years I can't, and then between 65-70, after I start Medicare and before RMDs+SS.
RunningBum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2019, 07:16 PM   #12
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: May 2019
Posts: 264
Quote:
Originally Posted by RunningBum View Post
I'm not sure what the purpose of the poll is...

That's what I was thinking - pretty much pointless.

I don't have ACA insurance.
GenXguy is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2019, 09:21 PM   #13
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 2,420
Quote:
Originally Posted by RunningBum View Post
I didn't mean you would criticize, but I heard this once elsewhere, and wouldn't be surprised if it comes up here too.

I'm going the opposite way from you, taking the subsidy when I can, then doing larger Roth conversions in years I can't, and then between 65-70, after I start Medicare and before RMDs+SS.
We are each doing what we see as best for our situations. From past conversations I think we have different things we are working on. Thus doing different things.
bingybear is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2019, 06:43 AM   #14
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Historic Florida
Posts: 3,953
Quote:
Originally Posted by GenXguy View Post
That's what I was thinking - pretty much pointless.
I don't have ACA insurance.
Then the poll is of no interest or value to you. Why even Comment. The Poll is directed to those with ACA based Healthcare Coverage.

For us (Both Fully ER'd) and using the ACA (Now only for DW) we keep a taxable account with enough in it so that the amount of dividends earned meet just over the minimum needed to achieve the maximum subsidy, before requiring to go on Medicaid. As these funds are primarily invested in Fixed income it is relatively easy to manage.

We are usually a little bit over the minimums, but nothing really significant. We use whatever the minimums are (Plus ~$300) every year , then simply pay the difference, if any, at the end of the year in our tax return. We have done this since ACA inception. We do not touch our qualified funds, and do not need to as we simply withdraw from taxable when we need to "Blow that Dough".

If there comes a time that we need to generate some MAGI income to keep from falling into Medicaid territory, we will either Take SS or take a little from our IRAs. Although based on current calculations that will never happen till DW is eligible for Medicare, "Four More Years!".
__________________
"Never Argue With a Fool, Onlookers May Not Be Able To Tell the Difference." - Mark Twain
ShokWaveRider is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2019, 07:27 AM   #15
Moderator
Aerides's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 4,256
Not sure I totally understand the poll. Assuming you mean "subsidy" as the annual total you receive, not monthly? And then compare it to invest-able assets...ie, basically everything but your house?

So a "typical" ER might be something like $6k subsidy as a percentage of $2M - so that's .03% and therefore statistically teeny - is that the number you are looking for? The number aren't quite apples+apples, as one is a discount and perhaps might be viewed as income, whereas the other is more fixed. But anyway, once we know the numbers - what does that demonstrate?
Aerides is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2019, 07:55 AM   #16
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 5,334
I answered the poll assuming I will get the subsidy in next year's tax return after I do a little TLH to slightly reduce my MAGI enough to offset the recently announced year-end cap gain distributions. I did not qualify for any APTC. As a % of my entire portfolio (taxable+IRA), it will be between 0.1% and 0.2%.
__________________
Retired in late 2008 at age 45. Cashed in company stock, bought a lot of shares in a big bond fund and am living nicely off its dividends. IRA, SS, and a pension await me at age 60 and later. No kids, no debts.

"I want my money working for me instead of me working for my money!"
scrabbler1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2019, 08:02 AM   #17
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Historic Florida
Posts: 3,953
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aerides View Post
So a "typical" ER might be something like $6k subsidy as a percentage of $2M - so that's .03% and therefore statistically teeny - is that the number you are looking for? The number aren't quite apples+apples, as one is a discount and perhaps might be viewed as income, whereas the other is more fixed. But anyway, once we know the numbers - what does that demonstrate?
Yes to me it makes perfect sense. If one has Investable assets of say $2m. and one gets $10k per year in subsidy. The result is 0.5%. NOW, everybody's subsidy and investable asset number will be different, so the result will be different. In other words, I am agreeing with your understanding above.
__________________
"Never Argue With a Fool, Onlookers May Not Be Able To Tell the Difference." - Mark Twain
ShokWaveRider is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2019, 09:01 AM   #18
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
RunningBum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 9,098
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aerides View Post

So a "typical" ER might be something like $6k subsidy as a percentage of $2M - so that's .03% and therefore statistically teeny - is that the number you are looking for? The number aren't quite apples+apples, as one is a discount and perhaps might be viewed as income, whereas the other is more fixed. But anyway, once we know the numbers - what does that demonstrate?
Yeah, that's what I wonder too.

Note that another ER might only get a $3K subsidy just because of different medical costs and 2nd lower silver plan in their area or whatever determines the subsidy, and they may have just $1M, so their number would be the same .03%. Did we learn anything from that, or any other number?
RunningBum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2019, 08:07 AM   #19
Full time employment: Posting here.
Taxman59's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 593
In 2019, it is 1.8%. for 2020, it will be 0.6%. This poll is interesting on the surface, but when you run the #s, it is apparent that there is little if anything to be gained by it.
__________________

Taxman59 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
aca, ptc, subsidy


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
For those that have retired with =>$5M in investable assets serie1926 FIRE and Money 143 02-08-2016 05:30 PM
33y/o married, $900K investable assets, free house, can I retire? Nerdjenni Hi, I am... 26 01-01-2016 12:02 PM
Stock Options as a percentage of investable assets - what's too high? Toocold FIRE and Money 27 12-26-2014 03:18 PM

» Quick Links

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:44 PM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
×