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Old 10-25-2016, 07:54 AM   #61
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Uh, why don't we keep the discussion on the original topic, 2017 ACA plans?
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Old 10-25-2016, 07:55 AM   #62
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All this complaining is expected, but largely unwarranted IMHO. Healthcare is expensive--because it insures against a very expensive potential liability. It seems the system is working quite well for me (albeit because I am relatively healthy--not so well for others with ongoing medical problems, I'm sure.)

In any case, in California the premium increases are relatively small for my Bronze HMO plan. These are my monthly actual premiums (unsubsidized) for the past three years and for 2017 (at age 56). Not so bad, I think:

2014 $497
2015 $466
2016 $497
2017 $550

Once FIRED and eligible for the subsidy, I can make these monthly expenses ZERO!
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Old 10-25-2016, 08:31 AM   #63
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There are a lot of numbers thrown around on the messages here, but it doesn't really tell me a lot without an idea of MAGI. In my area, a Silver Plan covering me and DW, with $40k of MAGI, can be as low as $278 after subsidy, to as high as $449 after subsidy (subsidy of 1248/month). Large variation of Deductibles and OOP's, too many to list.
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Old 10-25-2016, 08:50 AM   #64
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ACA not applicable to me so just curious: who pays the subsidy that is frequently mentioned?
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Old 10-25-2016, 08:52 AM   #65
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Originally Posted by misanman View Post
ACA not applicable to me so just curious: who pays the subsidy that is frequently mentioned?
There is this little thing call Federal Taxes whereby you make money and the Government takes some of it!
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Old 10-25-2016, 08:53 AM   #66
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ACA not applicable to me so just curious: who pays the subsidy that is frequently mentioned?
The subsidy is paid by the Federal Government. I consider it similar to the tax 'subsidy' that is provided to employees when an employer gets to deduct healthcare expenses.

Yes, that tax code is full of benefits and punishments...
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Old 10-25-2016, 08:53 AM   #67
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Where I live, we are down to one insurer. Just checked rates and the silver plan for me and DW is $20,220/yr. When I first started planning to RE I reviewed healthcare plans and estimated $5-6K/yr is what we would spend on insurance. What has happened to health insurance since then is nothing short of mind blowing.

It's good to remain flexible. My strategy now is to live off funds that do not add to MAGI. We can do that until Medicare becomes available but I am concerned about the working folks that don't get a subsidy. I am also concerned about the one insurer dropping out. The increase in rates with higher deductibles and fewer insurance companies in the "marketplace" can't continue. Stay flexible my friends. Semper Gumby.
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Old 10-25-2016, 08:55 AM   #68
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So apparently I am paying it (in part)
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Old 10-25-2016, 08:56 AM   #69
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ACA not applicable to me so just curious: who pays the subsidy that is frequently mentioned?
Methinks this was asked rhetorically - which could lead to the P word.

Can we keep this thread on topic? I find it very informative.
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Old 10-25-2016, 09:00 AM   #70
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Insurers dropping out is an issue, they claim it is because they are losing money. This does not seem to be reflected in their total annual profits.

I looked off ACA and the prices were similar to the ACA for the same plans, but without the subsidies... Go Figure. It is well known the Insurance companies do not like the ACA because of the mandatory coverages imposed. (Pre-Existing conditions, wellness tests, Women's Health etc.) all good things IMHO. They appear to be in the "No Soup for you" column.
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Old 10-25-2016, 09:02 AM   #71
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So apparently I am paying it (in part)
That IS the idea of Insurance by the way..... last time I checked anyway. Load is spread across multiple demographics. I pay that also in my taxes. Just instead of getting it back to help me pay for a mortgage that I do not have, want or need, (Also a Government subsidy) I get it to keep me alive. I know what I would prefer.
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Old 10-25-2016, 09:10 AM   #72
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All this complaining is expected, but largely unwarranted IMHO. Healthcare is expensive--because it insures against a very expensive potential liability. It seems the system is working quite well for me (albeit because I am relatively healthy--not so well for others with ongoing medical problems, I'm sure.)

In any case, in California the premium increases are relatively small for my Bronze HMO plan. These are my monthly actual premiums (unsubsidized) for the past three years and for 2017 (at age 56). Not so bad, I think:

2014 $497
2015 $466
2016 $497
2017 $550

Once FIRED and eligible for the subsidy, I can make these monthly expenses ZERO!
California premiums are age based. At age 63, your premiums will be significantly higher. The cheapest Bronze non-Kaiser HMO in my area is $835.89. The cheapest Bronze Kaiser HMO is $690.45.

If I did not have pre-Medicare retiree insurance that covers everything except small co-pays, I would not buy these overpriced, shoddy products. I would manage my MAGI so that the second least expensive Silver plan was more that 8.13 percent of MAGI, and tell these people to go jump in the lake.
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Old 10-25-2016, 09:23 AM   #73
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Originally Posted by ShokWaveRider View Post
Insurers dropping out is an issue, they claim it is because they are losing money. This does not seem to be reflected in their total annual profits.

I looked off ACA and the prices were similar to the ACA for the same plans, but without the subsidies... Go Figure. It is well known the Insurance companies do not like the ACA because of the mandatory coverages imposed. (Pre-Existing conditions, wellness tests, Women's Health etc.) all good things IMHO. They appear to be in the "No Soup for you" column.
Off exchange only means they are not on the federal or any state exchange and won't be subsidy eligible. For the most part certain items and types of policy are still subject to the federal mandates,,ie ACA compliant.
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Old 10-25-2016, 09:39 AM   #74
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Off exchange only means they are not on the federal or any state exchange and won't be subsidy eligible. For the most part certain items and types of policy are still subject to the federal mandates,,ie ACA compliant.
That is my point. If they are the same as they appear to be, why are insurance companies pulling off the exchange? They get the same amount of Money, subsidy + customer payment = Total.

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Old 10-25-2016, 11:52 AM   #75
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PLEASE, why don't we keep the discussion on the original topic, 2017 ACA plans and stay away from partisan politics.

Thanks in advance for your understanding.
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Old 10-25-2016, 12:04 PM   #76
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I've noticed most or maybe all of the plans available to me are not HSA compliant, even though they have high deductibles. Why would this be?
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Old 10-25-2016, 12:13 PM   #77
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The HSA limit for 2017 is $6550 for an individual. So if the plans deductible is over that it's not HSA compatible. In that case, the high deductible is too high! I think the federal limit is not keeping up with the reality of the deductibles in these plans.

Makes no sense to me either
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Old 10-25-2016, 12:15 PM   #78
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I've noticed most or maybe all of the plans available to me are not HSA compliant, even though they have high deductibles. Why would this be?
I believe it might have to do with a co-pay component in the plan.
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Old 10-25-2016, 12:39 PM   #79
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Originally Posted by ShokWaveRider View Post
Insurers dropping out is an issue, they claim it is because they are losing money. This does not seem to be reflected in their total annual profits.

I looked off ACA and the prices were similar to the ACA for the same plans, but without the subsidies....
As I looked at the 2017 plans available to me and what they cost, I couldn't help but think how in the world is it not profitable to the insurers? I mean, no matter which way I go I'll be paying $15K a year in combination of premiums and deductibles before the insurer starts making any substantial contribution.
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Old 10-25-2016, 12:52 PM   #80
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Everyone is so fixated on increases.

Note, ACA subsidies have gone up about 30% to offset the Insurance increases too.... no one seems to talk about that though.... Shhhhhh.


ACA was designed for those who could ill afford healthcare or had pre-existing conditions. If it is expensive but not more than 9% of your income it is doing it's job. That is about what the countries with single payer charge in taxes. It had got to be paid for somehow.

Uhhhh, where do you get that the subsidy is going up 30%? Mine looks to be the same....
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