Question about umbrella insurance

[SunnyOne]

How did you arrive at the amount of coverage you believed you need?

What considerations should be taken into account

Thank you!

 

[COcheesehead]

I don’t know if there really is a right number. This topic has been covered before. I chose to cover my net worth at the time which also happened to be the max my provider would give without further underwriting steps.

 

[erkevin]

I also chose our net worth as the number.

 

[COcheesehead]

I will also throw in the old rule of thumb. The more you have, the more the insurance company has to lose, the more they will defend you.

 

[ExFlyBoy5]

I will also throw in the old rule of thumb. The more you have, the more the insurance company has to lose, the more they will defend you.

Pretty much was how we came to the number and nd overall net worth. The additional $1MM didn't cost too much, either.

 

[SunnyOne]

I was trying to think of the situations where I might need it - all I can think of is an act that results from my driving/use of my vehicle.

I don't own any property or businesses.

What other circumstances might give rise to needing it (assume the primary is vehicle accidents)?

 

[COcheesehead]

It covers you above and beyond the liability limits of your insurance policies. So auto, renters or home. In general, injury or property damage to others including defamation.

The only person I know who had to use their umbrella policy struck a pedestrian with their car.

 

[Aerides]

How did you arrive at the amount of coverage you believed you need?

What considerations should be taken into account

Thank you!

This is a frequent topic. Search "umbrella" and you'll find a dozen threads and many opinions:

https://www.early-retirement.org/forums/f28/dropping-umbrella-coverage-109224.html

The short answer is: Get as much coverage as you think is enough for the insurance company to prefer to use their good lawyer vs. paying.

We have a $1M policy.

 

[Dtail]

Some folks believe 1 or 2m is the minimum to have in order for the lawyers to fight for you.
We have a 2m policy and moved from Liberty Mutual to Travelers and saved some monies.

 

[Dash man]

We went for the $5M umbrella policy on top of our $1M auto/home coverages. It’s cheap insurance for that split second mistake that might lead to a bad accident.

 

[RobbieB]

I had a mill for decades. When I tried to increase to 3 mill, they only upped it to two.

I dunno, wait and see period? And the second mill cost twice as much as the first.

 

[lakerunner]

It covers you above and beyond the liability limits of your insurance policies. So auto, renters or home. In general, injury or property damage to others including defamation.

The only person I know who had to use their umbrella policy struck a pedestrian with their car.

We had to use ours when my son, who was in high school at the time, hit someone who ran a red light. The other driver sued us. With a high limit policy, I let the insurance company hire the lawyer to defend my son. (He was driving my car and completely in the right.)

 

[mrfeh]

We started at $1M, then bumped it up to $2M when our net worth reached that number.

Not planning on increasing it again, even though our net worth is well past that now. IMO, there is a point of diminishing returns when it comes to umbrella policies.

 

[COcheesehead]

I did 5m which was the top end without triggering an additional underwriting process involving asset verification which to us sounded like brain damage.

 

[bobandsherry]

Might be interesting to know who has ever had to use their umbrella and how much was awarded and what was left uncovered.


Personally, I don't understand the basis based on net worth. If you have $1mil net worth and have $1 mil coverage and you are responsible for an award of $2 mil you are screwed. Reasonable answer is what you think the worse case could be, then you have a max, then adjust downward based on gut plus feel. Knowing answer to my original question above might help to get that answer.

For me, daughter was involved in accident. I had $1mil umbrella. Attorney said that having umbrella attracts more frivolous lawsuits, and the more coverage you have the bigger the feast looks for sucker to get what they can from you. Insurance fought hard as it was their dime that would be spent, their attorney and no cost at all to us. The attorney found lots of "dirt" on the other party. The other party in the end just got their medical expenses covered, as they would have right from the start. They ended up losing as they weren't awarded their legal costs.

 

[Buckeye]

I was trying to think of the situations where I might need it - all I can think of is an act that results from my driving/use of my vehicle.

I don't own any property or businesses.

What other circumstances might give rise to needing it (assume the primary is vehicle accidents)?

Someone in insurance told me once that 85%+ of claims were automobile related.

 

[COcheesehead]

Might be interesting to know who has ever had to use their umbrella and how much was awarded and what was left uncovered.


Personally, I don't understand the basis based on net worth. If you have $1mil net worth and have $1 mil coverage and you are responsible for an award of $2 mil you are screwed. Reasonable answer is what you think the worse case could be, then you have a max, then adjust downward based on gut plus feel. Knowing answer to my original question above might help to get that answer.

For me, daughter was involved in accident. I had $1mil umbrella. Attorney said that having umbrella attracts more frivolous lawsuits, and the more coverage you have the bigger the feast looks for sucker to get what they can from you. Insurance fought hard as it was their dime that would be spent, their attorney and no cost at all to us. The attorney found lots of "dirt" on the other party. The other party in the end just got their medical expenses covered, as they would have right from the start. They ended up losing as they weren't awarded their legal costs.

The difference between million dollar increments is a hundred or two. It’s not worth screwing around for that amount of money.

 

[swaneesr]

I think lifestyle plays a big role in this and only you can assess your risk factors. DW and I have higher than normal risks.

We own a cabin. This brings into play visitors to the property and usage of boats and ATVs etc.

Fortunately for us, as we get older our children can own the toys and we will provide the boring pontoon and tiny 14’ fishing boat.


Swanee

 

[RE2Boys]

I think lifestyle plays a big role in this and only you can assess your risk factors. DW and I have higher than normal risks.

We own a cabin. This brings into play visitors to the property and usage of boats and ATVs etc.

Fortunately for us, as we get older our children can own the toys and we will provide the boring pontoon and tiny 14’ fishing boat.


Swanee

+100

I started the referenced thread (see post #8) last spring as a previous discussion of continue to carry umbrella liability coverage. Lots of posts back then that were worthy of a good insurance salesman!!

What was not mentioned enough, and I had even forgot the primary reason I purchased umbrella coverage some 15 years ago was the risk exposure at the time. With two young boys, I was heavily involved in supporting their activities such as volunteer coach, scout leader, treasurer, and driver. It was not unusual for me to have 3 or 4 of their friends in my car travelling to an away campout or a Sunday afternoon soccer match within 70 miles of home. This led me to seek additional liability coverage.

now that both boys are launched into their careers, my involvement in volunteer activities is almost non- existent. Also, when the boys were young drivers, I wanted the additional coverage but they now have their own cars and insurance so that financial risk is gone also. Gave up my position as treasurer of a scout troop over a year ago as the last vestige of involvement so my exposure to liability is much much less. I found that, with my insurance, it was much cheaper to increase the auto and home liability to the max than to continue an umbrella add-on.

However, I found that under my auto policy proerty damage liability, the insurance company will not write coverage over #100K. In this day of expensive pickup trucks and expensive cars around, I've retained the umbrella coverage as I consider the auto insurance coverage too low and I get all the other benefits others have pointed out in the thread.

 

[COcheesehead]

+100

I started the referenced thread (see post #8) last spring as a previous discussion of continue to carry umbrella liability coverage. Lots of posts back then that were worthy of a good insurance salesman!!

What was not mentioned enough, and I had even forgot the primary reason I purchased umbrella coverage some 15 years ago was the frisk exposure at the time. With two young boys, I was heavily involved in supporting their activities such as volunteer coach, scout leader, treasurer, and driver. It was not unusual for me to have 3 or 4 of their friends in my car travelling to an away campout or a Sunday afternoon soccer match within 70 miles of home. This led me to seek additional liability coverage.

Know that both boys are launched into their careers, my involvement in volunteer activities is almost non- existent. Also, when the boys were young drivers, I wanted the additional coverage but they now have their own cars and insurance so that financial risk is gone also. Gave up my position as treasurer of a scout troop over a year ago as the last vestige of involvement so my exposure to liability is much much less. I found that, with my insurance, it was much cheaper to increase the auto and home liability to the max than to continue an umbrella add-on.

In order to have the umbrella, we had to take our auto limits to the max.

 

[Yipper]

We had $1M for a long time until our children started driving when we upped it to $2M... with 1 or 2 of the children on our auto policy for a while and use of a boat during the summer months we felt the premium was well worth the protection of our financial assets.

I also coached competitive travel softball for a few years with girls aged 10-16 where there are transportation issues, injuries and other risks to coaches... and while our organization provided some coverage for coaches it didn't cover all risks and didn't go beyond $1M for liability.

Lately I've been considering a reduction back to $1M to save a few $$$ since the children are out of the house and on their own auto policies but probably won't for a while until I sell the boat and our rental property. I'll gladly pay a few hundred extra for that peace of mind... it's a litigious world out there.

 

[tmitchell]

I was carrying $2M until yesterday when Amica told me umbrella does not cover assets held in a trust. So I went back down to $1M.

I’ve only got a car at this point so seems prudent enough.

 

[RetiredHappy]

I was carrying $2M until yesterday when Amica told me umbrella does not cover assets held in a trust. So I went back down to $1M.

I’ve only got a car at this point so seems prudent enough.

From my understanding, umbrella policies do cover assets in a revocable/living trust, but not in a irrevocable trust.

 

[tmitchell]

From my understanding, umbrella policies do cover assets in a revocable/living trust, but not in a irrevocable trust.

Apparently Amica does not. At least that's what the guy told me :/

 

[Dash man]

Apparently Amica does not. At least that's what the guy told me :/

Some companies require to name the trust as an additional insured. I’d shop around if they don’t cover it.