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Old 10-09-2020, 08:46 PM   #161
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Same here.
Before I sign up, (and recognizing that secret handshakes are out during Covid), do we get some kind of identifying codes?
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Old 10-09-2020, 08:57 PM   #162
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Before I sign up, (and recognizing that secret handshakes are out during Covid), do we get some kind of identifying codes?
You don't have the tattoo?
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Old 10-09-2020, 09:39 PM   #163
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my wife and i both have military retirements, pretty sizable 401Ks/403Bs. When we start collecting SS we'll get around $4K (SS+Mil) each without touching our retirement investments. I think we'll be OK
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Old 10-09-2020, 09:57 PM   #164
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+1

The article blaming this situation on the Covid recession is ridiculous. Probably a particular view being pushed for I canít imagine what reason.
+1
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Old 10-10-2020, 09:09 AM   #165
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Disagree. I came to US at age of 36, penniless, with bad English, no profession (suitable for US). For 3 years worked odd jobs on almost min wage and studied - worked at night- studied at day and vice versa. Borrow money to pay for education, even to buy computer.
Where do you see privileges?
Congratulations on your good luck, including the intelligence you were obviously born with, and on your hard work. And welcome! Anyone with even a rudimentary understanding of the demographics can see that the US needs a continuous flow of immigrants in order to prosper.

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So, If I was able to made myself in US, why person who born here, with native English, having US education cannot?
Well, you're kind of making my point for me. "born here" -- is only a 5% probability. "native English" -- about 20% of the population does not speak English at home. "US education" -- about 20% of citizens over 25 do not have a high school diploma, mostly due to poverty and racism. So the people you identify really have already had quite a bit of luck.

Not to say that hard work is not important, but I will still argue that it is often overrated as a success factor. I think most of us here have both been lucky and have worked hard in various proportions.
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Old 10-10-2020, 09:30 AM   #166
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My late wife ran a Frugal Board on the internet and use to argue with consumer expert Clark Howard. She was Dave Ramsey before Dave Ramsey. The board had tips like who to call for a plumber, whether a certain car seat was worth it, deals on diapers, local rummage sales, coupon tips and how to not spend money. She had 250 or so active members when she passed. My success financially is due in a large part to her. I worked full time and she stayed home with the kids. We live in a affluent area North of Atlanta in a paid for house with no dept. So having the right "partner in crime" is important. Side note to Chuckanut, use to do a little COBOL, loved it. Most people today do not realize that a lot of banks still have COBOL behind that fancy High Tech web site.
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Old 10-10-2020, 10:04 AM   #167
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Congratulations on your good luck, including the intelligence you were obviously born with, and on your hard work. And welcome! Anyone with even a rudimentary understanding of the demographics can see that the US needs a continuous flow of immigrants in order to prosper.

Well, you're kind of making my point for me. "born here" -- is only a 5% probability. "native English" -- about 20% of the population does not speak English at home. "US education" -- about 20% of citizens over 25 do not have a high school diploma, mostly due to poverty and racism. So the people you identify really have already had quite a bit of luck.

Not to say that hard work is not important, but I will still argue that it is often overrated as a success factor. I think most of us here have both been lucky and have worked hard in various proportions.


I think into everyones life comes luck on occasion, both good, and bad. But my experience has been that the harder I worked, the luckier I seemed to get. I still believe a lot of it has to do with mindset and education. Fortune favors the bold, not the negative minded. As Dave Ramsey once put it. If Eeyore is your spirit animal, you are doing something wrong...
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Old 10-10-2020, 10:11 AM   #168
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Not to say that hard work is not important, but I will still argue that it is often overrated as a success factor. I think most of us here have both been lucky and have worked hard in various proportions.

Indeed! Certain behaviors correlate with certain outcomes. But in the end success is merely another case of survivorship bias.
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Old 10-10-2020, 10:23 AM   #169
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It's not how much you make, it's how much you spend. Our house and cars are paid off and we live on around 30K/year. We have IRAs, Bonds and cash that we dip into when needed (vacations, cars, health and home repairs). People make it out to be harder than it is. Live within your means and you can get ahead.
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Old 10-10-2020, 10:25 AM   #170
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Although there are many people in poverty because of unfortunate circumstances, there is also DNA involved in many cases as well IMO. Education does raise one's IQ (though only up to a point), but brains of some people are just not equipped for complex thoughts or reasoning... Nature over nurture. To crawl out of a deep cave, you need the right material...
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Old 10-10-2020, 10:25 AM   #171
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Agree with the comments on people who are lucky enough to have been born with advantages (good parents, health, race, gender). Many of my friends and family are service workers, cannery workers, etc. They have worked hard all their lives, and stayed in their small towns to be near family. They are not big spenders, but never earned enough on these jobs to put 20% down on a house of their own. Rent is going up faster than their income but in their older years they donít want to have to move away from friends and family to have cheaper rent, so they sacrifice in other ways (eg, donít get that missing tooth replaced). It makes me angry that in such a wealthy nation the working class continue to struggle while the rich get richer...
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Old 10-10-2020, 10:33 AM   #172
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It makes me angry that in such a wealthy nation the working class continue to struggle while the rich get richer...

That national debt is $27 TRILLION. I wouldn't call that wealthy when drowning in such massive debt.
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Old 10-10-2020, 10:34 AM   #173
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Our local area is expensive, but the services seem like they would be really good for low income seniors. Assuming a retiree didn't have subsidized housing, a room here might rent for $1K a month, but then with all the other programs most other expenses would be covered by assistance programs or very low cost.
Reminds me of something I read in an English-language paper in Geneva, Switzerland. The writer was a retired secretary from England who lived off a very modest civil service pension. She chose to live in Geneva because she felt the benefits (great social services, healthcare, etc) were well worth the high COL. She wrote that though she had very little money left at the end of each month, she had everything she needed to enjoy a good life and was happy.
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Old 10-10-2020, 10:36 AM   #174
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I think into everyones life comes luck on occasion, both good, and bad. But my experience has been that the harder I worked, the luckier I seemed to get. I still believe a lot of it has to do with mindset and education. Fortune favors the bold, not the negative minded. As Dave Ramsey once put it. If Eeyore is your spirit animal, you are doing something wrong...
Agreed.

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Indeed! Certain behaviors correlate with certain outcomes. But in the end success is merely another case of survivorship bias.
Nicely said.

Maybe it would help if I gave an example of what I mean by "luck." I was launched on a successful engineering and management career because my Uncle Pat was an inveterate garage sale shopper. One day when I was in seventh grade Pat spotted an old wooden-cased shortwave radio receiver, brought it home and gave it to me. In the next three or four years I earned a General Class ham radio license and a commercial First Class Radiotelephone License and began working at the airport as an electronic technician. Fast forward, that launch carried me though undergraduate and graduate school employment. In grad school I ended up making friends with a Taiwanese guy named Sing and we played a lot of Gomoku sitting in the back row of our classes. One day he told me that he had been working as a tech for a local megacorp and that they were looking for second tech -- was I interested? So that launched the career. Sure, lots of hard work between seventh grade and the MSEE, but without Pat and Sing my life probably would have been very different and quite possibly not as good.
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Old 10-10-2020, 10:43 AM   #175
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Disagree. I came to US at age of 36, penniless, with bad English, no profession (suitable for US)......
Where do you see privileges?.
Are you male? That's a privilege when it comes to earning power, among other things. Are you Caucasian or light-skinned (i.e. not a person of color)? That's also a privilege in many contexts.
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Old 10-10-2020, 10:59 AM   #176
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I know a few that were lucky in life financially and are pinching copper coins today. Hard work is still in the equation for financial success IMO.

Like one poster said, "the harder I worked the more luck I had" and that maybe be very true. I beleive a person makes his own luck if he works at it hard enough.
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Old 10-10-2020, 12:18 PM   #177
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Thanks for the interesting discussion.

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