Selling an inherited house with "houseguests"

FWIW - If any of your dad's 'cash' assets are in a 401K or IRA, they cannot legally be held in Trust, but instead will be distributed to the specified beneficiary of the account.

I agree with JP. If your brother can't seem to move out, and it's all the same to you, then just give him the house and keep the cash for yourself. It doesn't sound like you are required to ask for his advice on how to split the assets as long as everything is equal.

Unless the trust specifies otherwise, it's up to you as the trustee to make the decisions on the implementation of the distribution of assets. Have an attorney advise you on how to handle the property appraisal for valuation to avoid a conflict of interest. Once you let your brother know your plans, he may change his plans quickly.
 
Whatever you do, do it, and do it sooner rather than later.
I am 9+ years owning half a home my sister lives in. She lived with mom the last 6 months before she died.

I have never received a dime. She says she tried to get a mortgage to pay me of, but didn't qualify. She's now 64, no better job prospects, has no savings. Last year I told her to start applying to subsidized housing because it takes a while to get in. I doubt anything has happened. I'm 1000 miles away.
 
I am a lawyer (albeit now retired). It is time to get a lawyer that specializes in estate litigation. Preferably the attorney will be located in the county where the property is located. Depending on that location, it may be difficult to find an attorney with that specialty. In that case I would find an experienced litigator who has previously litigated estate cases and knows his way around a Surrogate's Court. You need a litigator who has a firm grasp of estate disputes or an estate attorney who actually litigates.

These situations do not improve and only get worse. If the money is material to you then it is better to deal with these issues sooner than later. That is before your brother and his family devalue the house. If the money is immaterial to you, he/she can best advise how to extract yourself from the roles bestowed on you without becoming personally liable. It is very hard to have a favorable outcome when you do not understand the rules.
 
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To the OP, I lean towards keeping things simple, even trading off what is "fair" for simplicity when one does not need the money. I agree with those who say to give your brother the house and you keep a share of the cash and mutual funds. I would actually sweeten the deal and offer the brother more than his "fair" share - say the house plus $50-$80K.

It is clear the brother does not want to/cannot afford to buy the house. Is it clear that moving his son and daughter in law in is a way to dissuade you from selling it. For me that would be a headache that giving him more than what is due to him is worth buying out.

The house does not sound like it is in pristine condition, and you said you need to sell by September or else will likely have to maintain it through the winter. Think of the effort to get the house ready to sell, and how much (or little) you would get help in this from your brother and his family.

Essentially you would be paying your brother to take that headache off of your hands. In may seem "unfair" in the short run, but given what you have posted about the situation, the long term benefit will be worth it.
 
Here's some language I found in the trust

5.1 Administrative powers
We give our trustee (me) all of the powers by (state law)..as they would be exercised by an ordinarily prudent person in managing the person's own property

5.2.8 To divide trust assets into separate shares, whether pro rate or no pro rata, to determine values, to distribute lie or unlike assets to different Beneficiaries or Trusts and to make distribution in cash or in kind, in divided or undivided interests.

There's also this though:
3.1 the Trustee shall divide any property passing to the Trust into equal shares, one for each child of the Settlors...

This seems to say I can give him the house and I take the mutual funds.

BTW, there is an IRA worth nearly $1m that we will be splitting per the bene designation. And while taxable, it's not like he's getting stuck with anything.
 
Find a lawyer and fast. Hopefully, the language gives you broad decision making authority regarding the distribution of the assets and the language above seems like it does. I’ve handled executor duties before and would have been very comfortable giving up the house and taking an equal value in cash/equities. In fact, I would have been thankful that a sibling tried this move because selling a house is a pain. Get the property appraised by a realtor and be done with it.

One tough part about the executor role is the emotion of dealing with the passing and then the heirs. When an heir is not being “good” or cooperative, it makes things easier to take the emotion out of things and do things to make your life as executor a lot easier versus what can be a more painful path and more work because you are trying to help an heir.

If the relationship is already damaged, start documenting what your brother has done and send him letters asking him to leave, and then just do what is equitable but easier. I may not even ask him his preference at this point. Being an executor is a thankless, time consuming, and sometimes difficult job. Feel free to track your hours and charge them back to the estate. When my wife’s father died without a will, her family made her life quite difficult and did nothing. She meticulously documented her hours and charged a fair rate (her annual compensation at work converted to an hourly rate) for the time she spent administering the estate. What a mess. Her family didn’t love the idea of being charged for her time but they liked the fact that she did all the work and they got a spreadsheet with details of the estate and a check. They want her to be the executor of their estates.

Good luck. You’ve been Mr. Nice Guy, now is the time to be clinical.
 
The BIG problem is my brother's son and wife moved in "temporarily" at least 6 weeks ago. He was supposed to be out in under 30 days. They have not paid rent or any bills.
Hopefully, "at this point" you are not paying the utility bills too.:cool: If it was me, I'd notify the utility companies that the "estate" wants the services turned off. Overall, it sounds like it's time (past time) for some tough brotherly love. As the executor you should be in the drivers seat.
 
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You should never put IRA into a trust because it means immediate lump sum distribution and taxes, instead of over a 10-year period.

I hope the OP's brother doesn't do what my stepson planned to do. In DH's last months we told him he'd be getting DH's IRA, which was about $14,000. He was intently interested in how he could quickly liquidate it. After DH died I wrote him a check from other funds for $14,000 and moved the IRA to my name.

OP, keep us posted- it will be interesting to see what a lawyer says and what your brother decides. If he sees that he's passing up Real Money (his share of the proceeds from the house) in order to let his son and DIL stay in the house for free he might change his mind. Even though only one person replying here is a (retired) lawyer, discussions such as these can help you think about options and formulate the right questions before you consult one who knows the local laws and is an expert in this area and that can save you some billable time!
 
You should never put IRA into a trust because it means immediate lump sum distribution and taxes, instead of over a 10-year period.

Do you have a source for that? Everything I just found said 5 years to distribute, maybe more under certain conditions.

I didn't see anything that said "immediate" or within a year.

-ERD50
 
Here's some language I found in the trust

5.1 Administrative powers
We give our trustee (me) all of the powers by (state law)..as they would be exercised by an ordinarily prudent person in managing the person's own property

5.2.8 To divide trust assets into separate shares, whether pro rate or no pro rata, to determine values, to distribute lie or unlike assets to different Beneficiaries or Trusts and to make distribution in cash or in kind, in divided or undivided interests.

There's also this though:
3.1 the Trustee shall divide any property passing to the Trust into equal shares, one for each child of the Settlors...

This seems to say I can give him the house and I take the mutual funds.

BTW, there is an IRA worth nearly $1m that we will be splitting per the bene designation. And while taxable, it's not like he's getting stuck with anything.

IANAL, and 3.1 seems to contradict 5.28. Unless in legal terms "property" and "assets" are two different things?

OK, found this:

https://dictionary.law.com/default.aspx?selected=1645

property

n. anything that is owned by a person or entity. Property is divided into two types: "real property," which is any interest in land, real estate, growing plants or the improvements on it, and "personal property" (sometimes called "personalty"), which is everything else

So it doesn't specify "real" or "personal" property, so I don't know what it means.

When I finally get around to updating our docs, I'm telling the lawyer upfront that I need a "common man" interpretation of each and every paragraph. After all, the executors/trustees are often not lawyers, it should be written for them to understand.

-ERD50
 
You should never put IRA into a trust because it means immediate lump sum distribution and taxes, instead of over a 10-year period.
Funny, our expert trust and estate attorney doesn't believe this to be true.
 
I don't think I can hand it off. The language says:
If there is no serving trustee, then (me) shall serve as trustees. If (me) is unable or unavailable to serve as trustee, then (my brother) shall serve as trustee.

But if I can handoff, the bank or lawyer would handle an eviction, sale of the home, sale of the household items?

How much does something like that run?

FWIW, the house is worth about $330k net, and there's about $380k in cash and mutual funds.

I don't think that you can decline to serve because then brother would become trustee.... but you could hire a bank or lawyer to handle those things for you just like you would hire a real estate agent to sell the house.

You are the trustee so you are in control... brother is currently a squatter since he stayed longer than you agreed to let him stay and he doesn't have a lease.

I would propose to brother that he will receive the $330k house free and clear and $25k, for a total of $355k of value and you will receive $355k in cash and mutual funds. If he later decides that he doesn't want the house then he can sell it.

Since you are already FI and are also getting $500k inherited IRA, you might even want to tilt the deal a bit to induce him to accept it... perhaps make it that he gets the $330k house and $50k for a total of $380k in value and you get $330k... it might be the best $25k windfall that you ever spent.

Given him 7 days to decide and if he decides to take the house and cash have him put it in writing.... then get the house and cash transferred to him asap... engage a lawyer to do a document where he acknowledges that he accepts this in full satisfaction of what he is due under the terms of the trust.

If he decides that he doesn't want the deal, then he has 14 days to move out or he will be cited for trespassing so you can prepare the house for sale.
 
OP, if you follow the path of dividing the estate giving your brother the house and some cash, be sure you follow the legal requirements for establishing the value of the house. The estimate you have from the real estate agent is not it.
 
+1 an independent, third-party appraisal by a qualified appraiser (not a real estate agent) will only cost a few hundred and will give you and your brother confidence that the deal is fair.... and will also provide documentation for him of his basis for the house if he later sells it.
 
... I would propose to brother that he will receive the $330k house free and clear and $25k, for a total of $355k of value and you will receive $355k in cash and mutual funds. If he later decides that he doesn't want the house then he can sell it.

Since you are already FI and are also getting $500k inherited IRA, you might even want to tilt the deal a bit to induce him to accept it ... ...
Brother has estranged himself and his family. I don't think the OP has to "propose" anything:

Subject to the wisdom of the lawyer he has hired, I would suggest that the lawyer write a letter to brother stating how the estate will be divided ("Pursuant to paragraphs 3.1 and 5.2.8, the estate will be divided as follows ... ") Certainly the OP does not want to invite negotiations at this point; by his behavior, brother has shown that the time for that is past.

IMO @phil1ben's advice to hire a litigator is brilliant. In the likely event that brother hires an attorney, this sends a clear message to the attorney that the OP is not going to be a patsy and cave in response to whatever the brother wants to demand. Said lawyer will also explain to brother that fighting will probably be expensive with brother paying his own bills plus effectively his half of the estate's legal bills and half of the OP's time billed to the estate.

& yes, I would order an expedited fee appraisal.
 
If I understand the the original post, the current occupants of the house are the grandson of the deceased and his DW. If they are over legal age (likely), then OP's beef (as executor) is directly with them and not with his brother (their father). The young couple is likely to claim that grandpa, while living, gave them permission to move in and that may have some influence on a court's path to eviction. Dunno really. Just another complicating factor.

I agree with the poster who suggested "sweetening the deal" to influence the brother to accept it and move on.
 
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I like Phil1ben's advice. I have had dealings with a few estate planning attorneys including an ACTEC fellow. They knew a lot about writing trusts but only one mentioned litigation ( I didn't ask.) I think as the financially independent sibling you have an advantage. The trust doesn't distribute until issues are settled.
 
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Selling an inherited house with "houseguests"

I don't think I can hand it off. The language says:

If there is no serving trustee, then (me) shall serve as trustees. If (me) is unable or unavailable to serve as trustee, then (my brother) shall serve as trustee.



But if I can handoff, the bank or lawyer would handle an eviction, sale of the home, sale of the household items?



How much does something like that run?



FWIW, the house is worth about $330k net, and there's about $380k in cash and mutual funds.



Great advice from phil1ben. The previous posts have focused on the larger assets. Often smaller things like personal items, vehicles, tools, artwork etc can be equally as difficult to divide. In a previous post you mentioned that your brother was interested in keeping some of those items. All of it should be inventoried & listed as part of the estate. You may be surprised how much it adds up, especially if there are several vehicles. These items can also be used as part of the negotiations especially if you have little emotional attachment to them. Also the longer your brothers son & other relatives has occupancy the more likely that some may disappear as it appears that they have limited assets themselves. It is everyone’s interest to get these items listed in the estate quickly. If there is a large amount it may be useful to hire an estate sale specialist. From your posts it’s not clear if you are retired. If not you may need to take time off work. The estate should reimburse you for lost vacation/leave time. Good luck. You have a complicated situation.
 
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... In a previous post you mentioned that your brother was interested in keeping some of those items. All of it should be inventoried & listed as part of the estate. You may be surprised how much it adds up, especially if there are several vehicles. These items can also be used as part of the negotiations especially if you have little emotional attachment to them. ...
Good point to think about the small stuff. DW retired as an SVP in megabank investments and trust and has seen many, many estates settled.

The method she like best is for the beneficiaries (just two brothers, I guess) to take turns selecting items from the estate. Flip a coin to say who starts, then select alternately without regard to value. This eliminates arguments about valuation. When each beneficiary has everything they want, the remaining items go to the estate sale or to charity.

Important: Unless there is a written indication of intent, no one is allowed to claim things like "Grandma told me I could have the gold coin collection." DW's method for that, too late now, is to suggest that clients include "precatory language" in a will or a supplement or, more low tech, for grandma to put tape labels on the bottom of any tchotchkes where she wants them to go to a particular person.
 
Do you have a source for that? Everything I just found said 5 years to distribute, maybe more under certain conditions.

I didn't see anything that said "immediate" or within a year.

-ERD50

I must have a memory lapse of "immediate" being 5 years instead of lifetime before SECURE Act. Here is a Forbes article dated Dec 2020 that says why it is advised against putting a trust as beneficiary.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/bobcar...t-be-beneficiary-of-your-ira/?sh=5d28561f52ac
 
Can’t see that article due to ad blocker. Still, there are cases where it does make sense to put a trust as beneficiary of an IRA.

Sure, especially when trying to pass money on to disabled or minors.

I have copied the article and pasted here:

Dec 23, 2020,07:30am EST|
Should A Living Trust Be Beneficiary Of Your IRA?
Bob CarlsonSenior Contributor

It’s generally a bad idea to name a trust as beneficiary of your IRA. The IRA usually loses the power of tax deferral, because it must be distributed faster than in other scenarios. There are only a few instances when a trust as beneficiary avoids this problem, A recent IRS ruling gives an example, but the ruling also reveals the pitfalls of the strategy.

The general rule is when an IRA beneficiary is not an individual, the IRA must be distributed fully within five years. When a trust, your estate, or a business entity is named beneficiary, the IRA quickly must be distributed and taxed.

There’s an exception when you name a trust that qualifies as a “look-through” or “see-through” trust under IRS regulations. You need an estate planner to draft this trust to make sure it avoids the five-year rule. Even then, the IRA must be distributed to the trust within 10 years in most cases.

Another exception was discussed in a recent IRS ruling and shows there might not be a penalty when your spouse’s revocable living trust is named as the IRA beneficiary.

The ruling involved a married couple. One spouse, I’ll say it was the husband, owned an IRA and had begun required minimum distributions (RMDs).

The husband passed away and had named a trust as sole beneficiary of the IRA.

His wife had previously established the trust. She was the sole beneficiary and sole trustee of the trust. The wife had the right to amend or revoke the trust and could distribute all income and principal of the trust for her own benefit. In other words, it was a standard revocable living trust primarily used to avoid probate.

The wife, now widow, wanted to exercise the spousal option for an inherited IRA. She wanted to roll the IRA over to an IRA in her name. This would give her a fresh start, allowing her to manage the IRA without reference to her late husband’s IRA. She could start RMDs based on her own required beginning date and life expectancy. The widow also could name her own beneficiaries of the IRA.

The widow asked the IRS to rule that the IRA could be rolled over tax free into an IRA in her name. She planned to have the IRA balance distributed directly to her, and she would roll it over to an IRA in her own name within 60 days.

The IRS ruled in the widow’s favor. It pointed out that the widow was the trustee and sole beneficiary of the trust. She was entitled to all income and principal of the trust. Also, she was the surviving spouse of the deceased IRA owner.

In these circumstances, the widow was the sole person for whose benefit the IRA is maintained. That allows her to take a distribution from the inherited IRA and roll it over to an IRA in her own name without having to include any of the distribution in gross income, provided the rollover was accomplished within 60 days of the distribution.

In past rulings, the IRS allowed a similar result when an IRA was payable to an estate and the surviving spouse was the sole primary beneficiary of the estate.

In each case, the surviving spouse effectively was the sole individual for whose benefit the IRA was maintained and intended.

While the widow had a happy result, you still might not want to name a living trust or your estate as the beneficiary of your IRA, even under similar circumstances.

The widow had to apply to the IRS for a private ruling to be sure of the tax results, which is an expensive and time-consuming process.

Also, the widow couldn’t have the IRA custodian transfer the inherited IRA directly to an IRA in her name. That’s probably because the IRA custodian was unwilling to transfer the inherited IRA to any IRA other than one with the exact same legal title. The general rule is an inherited can be rolled over to another IRA tax free only if the two IRAs have the same name or title. Instead, she had to take a distribution. That raises the risk that for some reason she is unable to roll over that amount to an IRA in her name within 60 days, causing the entire amount to be taxable.

These complications are why it is best to review your IRA beneficiary designations every year or two. Don’t leave extra work or stress for your family. Be sure only individuals (and perhaps charities) are named as beneficiaries of your IRA and that the named individuals are the ones you currently want to inherit the IRA.
 
Selling an inherited house with "houseguests"

Can’t see that article due to ad blocker. Still, there are cases where it does make sense to put a trust as beneficiary of an IRA.


I think so. Plus, it’s not hard to change IRA beneficiary designations, at least at Fidelity and Vanguard. Trusts/will changes seem more involved.
 
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